Thinbeard wrote:

I'm wondering if there isn't another reason for the Janine character. A Moriarty family connection? How might she and Mary have come to know each other? Why are we informed about the cottage and the bees? Why are we informed that CAM flicked her eye? What did he have on her? And, by the way, how did Mary get into CAM's office? Sherlock says she left the way she came but that isn't explained? Wouldn't Janine have seen the person who bashed her in the head? Any thoughts?

Or an Adler family connection: she looks and acts like a sort of a "Irene-lite." Maybe CAM threatened to reveal to terrorists where Irene was hiding? Or threatened to make it look like Janine was involved in Irene's gathering of information?

(thought I already posted this but now I don't see it):

When your Christian friends' Easter posts remind you of The Empty House or BBC-TEH!

ancientsgate wrote:

SusiGo wrote:

I did not really follow the whole Amanda thing but I think it is ridiculous to mix up real persons and the characters they play. Quite sad. 

There was a spat of mean!fans shoving Johnlock into Ben and Martin's faces at certian Q&A sessions a few months ago. It got pretty ugly, I guess. Poor guys, they dealt with it very gracefully, from all accounts. Some fans really need to take a chill pill and get over themselves.  Not sure why this is happening in this fandom...  I've been around fandoms since I was like 12, and I've never seen this lack of respect, desire to shock, and pressing an uncomfortable issue where it should never be pressed before. Makes me sad.
 

The author of "Decoding the Subtext," which is one of my favorite blogs about Johnlock in canon, says that when she first wrote it, around 2007 or so, she was "blacklisted by mainstream Sherlockian societies," and Sherlockians "recoiled in horror" from the idea of the two being a couple.(A lot of old-time Baker Street Irregular types are convinced canon-Holmes had an affair with his Irene, many of them claim it was during the Hiatus.)

Now, seven years later, it seems the pro-Johnlockers are, perhaps not in the majority, but just as vocal.
 

I don't know if I was being too coy before, but I was saying that if Watson was A woman s/he could be THE woman (who admits she often dresses up as a man, so she could easily assume a male identity on a regular basis to be a detective.)

SusiGo wrote:

Exactly. You get the impression that actually Sherlock and John are the ones getting married. I had the idea the moment I saw the first pics from the wedding, both of them side by side in their beautiful morning coats. 

That is what I have been talking about  - there is something missing in the relationship between John and Mary. The writers and actors are excellent. If they wanted us to feel real love between those two, they would have managed to convince us. But apparently they did not, at least not all the audience. All the beautiful things that you would expect from a marriage - I am quoting you, Lue - proposal, shocked reaction, confessions, vows is there. We just do not get it from the married couple but from the bridegroom and his … best friend. 
And you know what Mycroft says about coincidence. 

 

There's also the fact that of the three of them, John is the LEAST into planning the wedding...Sherlock gets involved in every aspect, and does treat it like his wedding in many ways. (When he could probably have sabotaged it if he wanted to.)

And then, John says he wants to be up there with, "the two people I love most in the world." He lumps them together, as if he were marrying them both.

Something's up with the text color...


...but you make a good point: Sherlock's own near-death foreshadows that the same could be possible for CAM. It has been said Mary purposely shot Sherlock so as NOT to kill him (I think that's thin), and I never before thought maybe that's what he did to CAM.

I thought maybe the bullet was something weird...some tranquilizer bullet invented by Billy?

There's another thread about CAM being in cahoots with Sherlock to fake his death (since, after all, Sherlock's known to be good at that.)

Because I think CAM actually appeared to be stupid when it came to his personal, physical security: he made himself accessible to his blackmail victims physically, and some of them were known to be willing and able to kill. That applies to all FOUR of Team Holmes-Watson, actually (they're all willing to kill under some circumstances, albeit differing ones.)

So, maybe CAM had more up his sleeve for protecting himself...

Because, yeah, we can't leave Sherlock as a murderer...did you notice how the end of Season 3 put us right back to the end of Season 2?

After seeing Moriarty "bring Sherlock down" only to discover Sherlock had been playing HIM all along, I have significant confidence that Sherlock had something up his sleeve in dealing with CAM, such that his apparent murder of CAM is not what it seemed.

However, Holmes is amused by the wedding and points out that Irene's being in love with another man solves his client's (the King's) problem. Which doesn't sound like Holmes has any envy for the man who marries Irene.

On the other hand, notice that the KING's reaction is, "She can't possibly be in love with [Norton]," even though this would solve his problem. The King raves over Irene's cleverness several times and even says, "What a queen she would have made!"

I think HE'S still hot for her...I almost want to think HE was the one trying to sabotage her new relationship! (Wouldn't you think that if she made their affair known, she would be more disgraced than the King? Wasn't there a double standard in those days? The King would have us believe it would be bad for his reputation and his princess would dump him, but I'm not sure I trust that. I thought royal women were conditioned to accept their men doing that kind of thing?)

How you interpret Irene may depend on what you think "adventuress" means. In that era it almost surely wasn't a compliment...but to the modern reader it sounds glamorous.

Irene is an actress...which was also enough to give a woman a dubious reputation in that day (though it was a step up from Shakespeare's day because there WERE female actresses...the parts weren't all played by men.)

In the Indian in the Cupboard series, (by Lynn Reid Banks) the modern protagonist (boy living in the 1980s or 1990s) reads the diary of an ancestor who[color=#222222] was a stage performer in the Victorian/Edwardian era. Her father tells her he'd rather see her dead than on the stage; her sister and brother-in-law limit her contact with their daughter; her (out of wedlock) son is ashamed of her, and she gets the reputation among later generations as "wicked." She says that she's basically poor and an outcast her whole life, but that she's proud of that career nonetheless. She is, however, terribly

SherlocklivesinOH wrote:

nakahara wrote:

.
 
 
But he abhors CAM. Completely.
In Sherlock′s eyes, murderers are nothing in comparison to this reprehensible man:
 
„I have said that he is the worst man in London, and I would ask you how could one compare the ruffian, who in hot blood bludgeons his mate, with this man, who methodically and at his leisure tortures the soul and wrings the nerves in order to add to his already swollen money-bags?“
 
He also hates with passion CAM′s tendency to pray on weaknesses of his victims:
 
„What would it profit a woman, for example, to get him a few months' imprisonment if her own ruin must immediately follow? His victims dare not hit back.“
 
CAM′s blackmail is utter cowardice, unworthy of man.
 
For Sherlock, this is not just about the case anymore. It gets personal between him and CAM:
 
„Between ourselves, Watson, it's a sporting duel between this fellow Milverton and me. He had, as you saw, the best of the first exchanges, but my self-respect and my reputation are concerned to fight it to a finish.“
 
And we can′t forget that in HLV, Sherlock′s own brother Mycroft is blacmailed apart from Sherlock′s other clients – Lady Smalwood, his best friend John and Mary.
 
Such is the Sherlock′s distaste for CAM that he, a well-known misogynist, miraculously transforms into a chivalrous knight and is willing to risk everything, his career and his life, for his female client:
 
„Surely a gentleman should not lay much stress upon this, when a lady is in most desperate need of his help?“
  

Watson says elsewhere that Holmes "disliked and distrusted [women] but was always a chivalrous opponent" and "had a remarkable way in dealing with them." And indeed, I don't think there are too many truly dislikable women in canon.

It is a favorite theory of Johnlockers that Milverton knew something about Holmes' love life, having to do with either Watson or the college

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