BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / The comprehensive Johnlock guide (Johnlockers only)

**Posted by ancientsgate** April 22, 2014 1:56 am

KeepersPrice wrote:
....So if TSoT was a nod to "Game of Shadows" then the writers were correct to leave out any real dancing between Sherlock and John because its already been done. And it would have ruined that lonely bittersweet feeling we get because we know Sherlock wanted to dance; but since everyone was already taken, it wasn't meant to be.

I agree. Sherlock's loneliness was palpable, especially from the violin solo on. He was wearing it like a cloak.

God, when I see his expression when he realizes he's alone on the dance floor and that John is gone and Janine is occupied, it reminds me of the look on his face when Seb Wilkes in TBB says how everyone at Uni hated him. It breaks my heart.

Yup. Lovely Ben, he is such a fabulous actor, and he knows Sherlock inside and out, knows who he is, what makes him tick and what makes him not tick. Sherlock was very torn in those moments, wanting to fit in, wanting to be with John, but feeling like the quintessential fifth wheel. I love me some angst, god knows, and that was angsty as hell.

**Posted by SusiGo** April 22, 2014 6:33 am

I agree with you both. And it might be a nod to GoS after having nodded to The Private Life of SH already. I liked the dance scene in GoS, especially since it is a sort of farewell preceding the showdown between Holmes and Moriarty on the balcony.

**Posted by SolarSystem** April 22, 2014 9:09 am

I agree, there was quite a lot of angst and hurt during those last few minutes of TSoT. It really is one of the most heartbreaking scenes in the whole show - and after TRF I really thought it couldn't get any worse, but this here is a totally different kind of angst/hurt.

But btw, did anyone else think that the way in which Sherlock told Janine that he loves to dance felt a bit... odd? I'm still trying to figure out what it is that disturbs me about that moment... I think it might be the writing which strikes me as not being all that elegant. Then again, maybe it's just that I'm not really used to the Sherlock we see here... chatting with a girl in a pretty confidential way... after all, he's letting her in on a secret of sorts. A secret I'd much rather see him talk to John about...

**Posted by SusiGo** April 22, 2014 9:17 am

Well, he had just solved a case. Maybe he just shared the exhilaration he could not share with John at this point with Janine. This in connection with teaching her to dance might explain his behaviour.
And I like John's reaction, stopping in his tracks outside the door, coming in and putting his hand on Sherlock's arm.

**Posted by SolarSystem** April 22, 2014 9:28 am

Ah, good point!
And yes, John's reaction is just... how it should be.

Last edited by SolarSystem (April 22, 2014 10:20 am)

**Posted by tonnaree** April 22, 2014 12:30 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
I agree, there was quite a lot of angst and hurt during those last few minutes of TSoT. It really is one of the most heartbreaking scenes in the whole show - and after TRF I really thought it couldn't get any worse, but this here is a totally different kind of angst/hurt.

But btw, did anyone else think that the way in which Sherlock told Janine that he loves to dance felt a bit... odd? I'm still trying to figure out what it is that disturbs me about that moment... I think it might be the writing which strikes me as not being all that elegant. Then again, maybe it's just that I'm not really used to the Sherlock we see here... chatting with a girl in a pretty confidential way... after all, he's letting her in on a secret of sorts. A secret I'd much rather see him talk to John about...

Just a little "girl talk."

**Posted by SolarSystem** April 22, 2014 12:51 pm

Oh tonnaree...

**Posted by besleybean** April 22, 2014 4:13 pm

Why would Sherlock be having a little girl talk?!

**Posted by Harriet** April 22, 2014 5:09 pm

LOL, tonnaree! You made my day for the second time now

**Posted by tonnaree** April 22, 2014 5:36 pm

Harriet wrote:
LOL, tonnaree! You made my day for the second time now

You're welcome Harriet. I do try.

**Posted by Harriet** April 22, 2014 5:37 pm

Quite talented, aren't you?

**Posted by tonnaree** April 22, 2014 5:50 pm

Harriet wrote:
Quite talented, aren't you?

I have references and a certificate of merit from Smartasses Online.

**Posted by SusiGo** April 22, 2014 9:26 pm

I am sure you all know this but it is always nice to watch. South Korea, ultimate Johnlockers:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=murI8Hrlpck

**Posted by tonnaree** April 23, 2014 2:12 am

*swoon*
*thud*

**Posted by SusiGo** April 23, 2014 2:42 pm

I found this post on tumblr. Quite fitting IMO

arminarlert

people on heterosexual couples in shows: understood that they are romantically involved even when it’s not actually canonically stated

people on queer couples in shows: well if you give me a ten page testimony from the creator explicitly stating that X and X are queer and together along with a full twenty page analysis of all of their screen time and interactions with every character on the show. oh and may i remind you that if i could possibly argue against what’s stated in canon then you’re reading too much into it? every queer character and couple need to be explicit in their sexuality and relationships. otherwise they’re straight.

Last edited by SusiGo (April 23, 2014 2:43 pm)

**Posted by tonnaree** April 23, 2014 3:02 pm

SusiGo wrote:
I found this post on tumblr. Quite fitting IMO

arminarlert

people on heterosexual couples in shows: understood that they are romantically involved even when it’s not actually canonically stated

people on queer couples in shows: well if you give me a ten page testimony from the creator explicitly stating that X and X are queer and together along with a full twenty page analysis of all of their screen time and interactions with every character on the show. oh and may i remind you that if i could possibly argue against what’s stated in canon then you’re reading too much into it? every queer character and couple need to be explicit in their sexuality and relationships. otherwise they’re straight.

THIS

**Posted by besleybean** April 23, 2014 4:36 pm

Thing is, it's up to the characters to decide what sexuality they are and what relationships they have ...not us!

**Posted by Harriet** April 23, 2014 8:16 pm

Similar to this from theloudestsubtext..., had it as Sig before:

"It’s considered polite to unquestioningly assume everyone you meet and every character on tv and in film is straight until they inform you otherwise. It’s rude or insulting to think someone might be anything other than straight without that conversation."

**Posted by besleybean** April 23, 2014 8:19 pm

I never assume if characters are gay or straight..they could also be bisexual or asexual.

**Posted by Harriet** April 23, 2014 8:30 pm

Susi, I just returned to the beginning to this thread and cannot quite figure out what your intention was to open it.
Could you explain it again? Thanks