Yes, the same song, the same place with the same grave stones.

Liberty wrote:

Thinking of it ... she kind of gives Sherlock another chance to save "Redbeard"(with John standing in!) too (even if that isn't her goal!).

This is a beautiful thought.

Schmiezi wrote:

ewige wrote:

Yes, the same song, the same place with the same grave stones.

Just wondering: the words of the song, are they from the canon story "The Musgrave Ritual"?

No, it's something completely different, see also: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Adventure_of_the_Musgrave_Ritual

I wonder how it was possible for Sherlock to decipher Eurus' song! The thing he did with the tomb stones didn't make any sense!

The song didn't lead to the well at all, or young Sherlock would have found Victor even all those years back. He tried to decipher the song and it didn't make any sense, it was about digging a hole by a tree, you know. He dug and dug and nothing was there.

Adult Sherlock deciphered the song with the key from the tomb stones (HOW???) and realized he had to come up to Eurus' room. I guess she would have let people save Victor if Sherlock played with her a bit.

Last edited by ewige (January 19, 2017 7:05 pm)

Yes, my feeling was that the song had never lead to Victor/John - it lead to Eurus. 

Adult Eurus gives him another clue ("no one") which leads him to the graveyard.   He numbers each word of the song, and then picks out the words with the numbers which correspond to the fake dates on the gravestones, and that's what gives him the answer. 

So I presume if young Sherlock had solved it, Eurus would have helped him save Victor, just as she helped him save John.  I think it only just dawned on my today that the song had always led to Eurus, not to Redbeard/Victor.

The song was the cipher, the gravestones were the key.  I suppose it was too hard for little Sherlock without a further clue, and it looked as if even adult Sherlock might have been stuck without the no one/Nemo clue that Eurus gave him.  (I suppose she thought that through - she really, really wanted him to solve it). 

And we were shown the gravestones earlier, so maybe could have guessed that they played a part. I love solving puzzles, though, and wouldn't it have been great if they'd given us the whole song, and the details about the house, maybe a floorplan, pictures of the gravestones, etc., and given us a while to see if we could work it out?  I wouldn't have got the "no one" clue, but it would have been to try!  Of course, it would have completely disrupted the pacing of the episode, so never mind!

stoertebeker wrote:

Seems my English is too bad, to make myself understandable. 

Or my, to understand

But actually, I think, you have skipped the part of your argumentation, and I was too distracted this moment (too noisy around :/  ), and understood you wrong - it could happen in every language.
Now I can focus, and, as I understand, in your opinion she was ready to let them die, if they turned out to be not clever enough. I think, she really wanted them alive (thus your "yes" looks very misleading), and the risk, she took, was too big.

Liberty wrote:

I suppose she thought that through - she really, really wanted him to solve it.

And poor Sherlock next almost thirty years kept training his mind, to be ready, if this situation repeats itself. And even did not remember, why

nakahara wrote:

Liberty wrote:

Adult Eurus gives him another clue ("no one") which leads him to the graveyard.   He numbers each word of the song, and then picks out the words with the numbers which correspond to the fake dates on the gravestones, and that's what gives him the answer. 

Hmmm... you nailed it why this scene seems to be such a nonsense in rewatch. The puzzle is aimed at somebody who can already read and knows how to count.... there´s no way a five years old child could manage the feat like this.
Even the adult Sherlock must imagine the text of the song written to crack the puzzle.
There was no way to save Victor with the puzzle like this, I guess.

 
It's not uncommon for three year olds to read and to count. Eurus managed, and Sherlock was above avarage too so I bet he even knew how to spell

nakahara wrote:

Liberty wrote:

Adult Eurus gives him another clue ("no one") which leads him to the graveyard.   He numbers each word of the song, and then picks out the words with the numbers which correspond to the fake dates on the gravestones, and that's what gives him the answer. 

Hmmm... you nailed it why this scene seems to be such a nonsense in rewatch. The puzzle is aimed at somebody who can already read and knows how to count.... there´s no way a five years old child could manage the feat like this.
Even the adult Sherlock must imagine the text of the song written to crack the puzzle.
There was no way to save Victor with the puzzle like this, I guess.

Well, highly intelligent children often learn to read at the age of four or five or even earlier.

We are talking Holmses here. Sherlock has most likely been considered the slow one because he was already NEARLY FIVE when he learnt how to read. Stupid brother! ;-)

How do you know he had no interest in reading?!

Naavy wrote:

But not for Eurus. She most likely expected Sherlock to do both, too. 
The point is, she never stopped, even when it was obvious, that no one can break her code. 

Well, we were informed that Eurus is something like Newton - incomparable genius. Sherlock was quite a normal child in comparison.
He never had a chace to crack this complex code in time.... 
 

Last edited by nakahara (January 19, 2017 9:20 pm)