I've been meaning to post something about what was said in the commentary about Mary, but it's all in little bits and pieces.   The general picture I'm getting from the commentary is that they're not hinting at anything other than a straightforward reading of what we see on screen.  (However, that could be because they want to surprise us in S4!).  Here's a couple of selected bits:
(Apologies for transcription errors again.  And I know there are few times when I haven't been able to make things out clearly and have just left them out.  They're joking in the spoilers, in case it isn't obvious!). 

After Mary shoots the coin...
Steven: I slightly wish ... I cut a couple of lines out that I wish I'd kept in, which is ...   when she says, you know ... he says you saved my life or whatever ... I nearly killed you .. and he says you didn't hit the middle of the coin, I mean nobody's perfect.  Which slightly covers the fact that although she saves his life, she also nearly kills him.  So in Sherlock's defence, he's really quite forgiving ...
Now this is interesting.  When I first heard it, I thought Steven was saying that he wished he'd made it clearer that Mary only nearly killed him because her aim wasn't precisely accurate i.e. the surgery explanation was the correct one.   But it could also just mean that Steven wishes he'd made the surgery explanation more plausible (whether it's true or not).  What do you think?  Then saying that Sherlock is forgiving implies that he accepts the surgery idea, but forgives Mary for nearly killing him .... oh, I don't know.  I was really hoping the surgery thing would be properly explained.  

They confirm that AGRA stands for

Amanda Google Rampant Abbington.

The confrontation at 221B
Mark: We have to think, that what ... has Mary herself made a decision to change her life.  I mean if she meets John Watson and thinks he's a really decent man, I like him, is she actually intending to become, to go straight?
Sue: I think so
Mark: Or is it all (sorry, I can't hear this bit).
Steven: It was always my sort of feeling that, you know,  a bit like John, she can't really keep away from that.  You know, she fits in with these two blokes because she's got exactly the same problem.  You know, I can spend six months without having an adventure, but not seven.  You know that's ... she's happy when .. what other wife is going to be sending John out to play with Sherlock and then tagging along? You know, the way she behaves in The Sign Of Three is preposterous for a bride at a wedding.  She likes that world better.  
Mark: In my mind, though, she's sort of like Callan.  She's a troubled assassin.  I don't want to think that she's totally evil.
Steven: No, I think the Callan comparism is terrific.  I love Callan, but the idea that she's done bad things but not because that's what she wants to do, you know.  
It was nice to get this background on Mary's motivations - it's a fairly sympathetic view, I think?  I presume Callan refers to the TV programme with Edward Woodward. 

The reconciliation
Mark: This is very clever, Steve, I must say.  The curse of saying things that you wouldn't say in real life.  I remember Martin at the graveside in Reichenbach saying, I genuinely find this very difficult, and then eventually I quoted him in the tube station saying exactly that, because these are the sort of things you don't really say ...you have to say it  But then to work out a way of actually saying I've thought about this, these are prepared words, is kind of the perfect escape.  Because it means so much, but he couldn't just do it on the hoof.
Does this confirm that Martin's speech is genuine?  His speeches in TRF and TEH were certainly genuine ... I think they're implying that this one is too.  

Then they reveal that the memory stick contains

five Doctor Who scripts!

Last edited by Liberty (November 5, 2014 8:49 pm)

What parts?  Or all of it?  I do think these are a lot more ambiguous than the bit about reshooting the Janine scene (which was very clear).  I mean, obviously the memory stick revelations are jokes (there was a lot of laughter at those points).  But the discussion about Mary's motivations sounded genuine - that she craves adventure, that she has been a reluctant villain, etc.  I'm still kind of hoping for Mary to be S4s archenemy, but it would still be interesting to think that she wanted to "go straight" and that something will get in the way to stop her. 

Also bear in mind that a couple of times, Mark is commenting on bits that he didn't write, so he could be as in the dark as the rest of us .  OK, well, not THAT much in the dark.

Last edited by Liberty (November 4, 2014 4:28 pm)

Thank you for making the transcripts, Liberty!

Liberty wrote:

Steven: I slightly wish ... I cut a couple of lines out that I wish I'd kept in, which is ...   when she says, you know ... he says you saved my life or whatever ... I nearly killed you .. and he says you didn't hit the middle of the coin, I mean nobody's perfect.  Which slightly covers the fact that although she saves his life, she also nearly kills him.  So in Sherlock's defence, he's really quite forgiving ...
Now this is interesting.  When I first heard it, I thought Steven was saying that he wished he'd made it clearer that Mary only nearly killed him because her aim wasn't precisely accurate i.e. the surgery explanation was the correct one.   But it could also just mean that Steven wishes he'd made the surgery explanation more plausible (whether it's true or not).  What do you think? 

I think it is as I feared, the surgery explanation is meant to be taken at face value. If that´s the case I think they really should have kept that line in. It still wouldn´t make much sense, but at least there would have been a tiny glimpse of remorse from her side that would make it more believable. Now all we have from her is silence, threats and the blank page of the AGRA-stick (I laughed so hard at the explanation of the acronym..) 

I was mainly laughing at the AGRA and memory stick explinations this time.

There´s another one:

Mark: “We talked a lot, didn’t we, about having that problem of suddenly someone spoiling the fun – it’s the worst thing you can do, so the important thing was to regard the third series as a new team in a way, and actually that fundamentally she and Sherlock would immediately get on. And that sort of changes everything.”
Steven: “Which resulted in us writing a scene between Sherlock and Mary that we couldn’t make work. We both took passes at it and couldn’t make it work and it’s all replaced by one line.”
Mark: “‘I like him’.”

What do you think about it, did the "I like him" make it work as intended?

I confess I've always loved it and agree with the commentary on it...

It's great that this is up - there are so many good bits in the commentaries but I haven't been able to find the right thread for them.  I like this one too, which sort of goes here...

Steven: “We did think of this relatively early, the endless tease [of how Sherlock survived the fall]. I remember you saying, ‘Of course, actually in real life you wouldn’t be asking How; you’d be saying Why? Why would you do that?”
Mark: “Actually, I just popped that [line] in in the ADR. I said to Benedict, ‘Will you just say that also a system of Japanese wrestling,’ which is the way that Doyle actually explained it, outrageously!”
Steven: “The Doyle explanation doesn’t work at all. His whole reason in the original story for concealing the fact he’s alive is so that Moriarty’s gang don’t find out – but Moran has just seen him, number two in Moriarty’s gang, so it’s all complete nonsense!”
Sue: “That bit from Amanda just then, when she said, ‘Well, he’d have needed a confidant,’ that’s the first little slip-in that she wasn’t exactly what she seemed.”
Steven: “The idea was that you would like Mary because she was getting into the swing of the action so quickly and therefore [you] never questioned the fact that nobody really would – unless, of course, they weren’t what they really seemed to be; and she’s far too at ease with Sherlock Holmes and the way he behaves for a normal person.”
Mark: “And when we get to the deductions on screen we slipped in ‘Liar’ and of course people picked up on it but it was great because they were just going, ‘What does this mean?’”
Sue: “Also, when we were putting it in there, d’you remember, however much you tried to hide ‘Liar’, it just stares you in the face!”
Mark: “Amongst the other [deductions] it once said, ‘Unresolved Jason Orange crush’, which was an attempt to hide ‘Liar’!”

I see what they mean about the signs being there ... her reaction to Sherlock's reappearance doesn't quite make sense.   She's not at all bothered about having her engagement interrupted, she's very calm about John's reaction, she's almost collaborating (wrong word) with Sherlock at points, and I think it's nice that she stays and looks after Sherlock a little while John leaves, but it's slightly odd, and then finally, "I like him"  rather than "Are you OK?" or something along those lines.   The "confidant" line was first obvious major clue, but the whole extended scene, in retrospect, plays out as if Mary is pleased and excited that Sherlock is coming in and shaking things up.

I can just about buy Sherlock accepting Mary in that way, because of the rather vulnerable position he's in.  At first he virtually ignores her (apart from wittily answering her questions - "oh my God!"  "Not quite" amuses me every time), but she presents herself as an ally (the confidant, the moustache, etc.) and doesn't react the way you would expect the average person to react.  And she wants them to reconcile, and says she'll help. Sherlock is very alone at that point, and trying to win John back - I can see why he would be drawn to an ally at that point. 

Love the bits about Doyle's explanation ... and the unresolved Jason Orange crush!

Last edited by Liberty (November 5, 2014 9:36 pm)

Very funny commentary, thank you for sharing. 

Considering Doyle, he didn´t care sh*t about inconsistencies in his stories. I suspect him that he messed with his audience as gladly as Moftiss do. My most favourite "dirty trick" of his is his explanation that the Hound of the Baskervilles glowed in the dark because his fur was painted with phosphorus. But phosphorus in poisonous and the dog would die if he wore something like that (and Doyle as the medical man new that fact quite well....).

I understand her, Jason Orange was a hottie.. *nods earnestly* 

Liberty wrote:

Sue: “That bit from Amanda just then, when she said, ‘Well, he’d have needed a confidant,’ that’s the first little slip-in that she wasn’t exactly what she seemed.”
Steven: “The idea was that you would like Mary because she was getting into the swing of the action so quickly and therefore [you] never questioned the fact that nobody really would – unless, of course, they weren’t what they really seemed to be; and she’s far too at ease with Sherlock Holmes and the way he behaves for a normal person.”

Sadly for me their plan didn´t really work.. because yes, nobody would really act that way, and that made the whole scene seem off and unconvincing. In hindsight I can see what they were going for, but all through TEH and TSoT I just felt Mary and her place in their new trio was unnatural. I never recovered from that feeling, and HLV didn´t really help matters.. *shrugs*

Last edited by Zatoichi (November 5, 2014 9:41 pm)

Mrshouse, I see what you mean. And I think it depends on what is going to come next. If we are to accept all this as it is shown, I have my difficulties to buy it. I believe that Sherlock accepts Mary, maybe even likes her, but I still cannot buy the whole surgery/forgiving thing. But the comment for HLV is not on arianedevere so I am  going to wait until I can read it in full before saying more about that. 

As for "I like it". It seems thin to me because it is counterbalanced by the word "liar". I could not forget the word throughout TEH and TSOT and kept wondering in which way she was a liar. 

Last edited by SusiGo (November 5, 2014 9:44 pm)