Willow wrote:

A rich sponsor who hands over money to an allegedly retired assassin is much more interesting, plot wise, don't you think?
 

Willow, I like your way of thinking: rational, but with an eye on potentially interesting plot lines! Let's face it: Mary as a former CIA agent in a witness protection program, who meets John just by chance in her new job as a part time nurse, just doesn't cut it with Mofftiss. You should know those devils better, by now, lol! And that would hardly be a past, she would have to hide from John, or kill for. She herself says, she could go to jail for the rest of her life (or a long time anyway), if her past gets discovered. Also, judging by CAM's reaction, when he 'opens' Mary's file, it must be really juicy.

Marva wrote:

I would like to discuss something else here regarding the memory stick:

I think we can be quite sure that Sherlock knows what is on the USB stick which again which leads to two questions imo:

1. why is he not worried about John being together with Mary? He obviously knows things about her that would make her go to prison for her whole life, and while we agree that Sherlock is not an angel himself, there is surely a different quality to what Mary has done.

2. (more important for me because it has not been discussed at all to my knowledge): as Mary knows that Sherlock knows stuff that would make John stop loving her in a split-second (acc. to herself) and being in a reltionship is the most important thing to her in the world: doesn't that mean automatically that Sherlock is still a huge danger for Mary? One that she maybe wants to get rid of sooner or later? She was also not happy in the slightest when Sherlock returned in the end.

 
Good questions, Marva. I also believe, no matter if the memory stick in the fire is a clue or a continuity error, that Sherlock copied that stick. But remember, Mary gave John that stick on her own accord, and she's as clever as Sherlock. So she must know, that Sherlock will probably read it. Maybe she even wants Sherlock to read it, because there's info on that stick, which might be important for Sherlock. So, she must think, there's something on it, which would cause John instantly to fall out of love with her. This could be something about the way, she met John, like her seeking him out for a purpose, but then falling in love with him. Sherlock assumed correctly, that Janine wouldn't want to see him anymore, when she realizes, that he used her. So Mary could initially have made contact with John for a purpose, too. Actually, it's very likely, that they didn't end up just by chance. So, Mary could assume, too, that John will fall out of love with her, when he learns, that he was used at least initially. But she

onlydreamieverhave wrote:

sherlocked wrote:

shezza wrote:

Well there's no need to spoon feed everything to the audience. They showed it in a elegant way. Everybody's reactions are proof enough, imo.

I didn't think, it was elegant. No need to show gore, but the way it was filmed, it considerably lessened the emotional impact, IMO. And it reminded me of many cheap films, where the baddie is killed in the end in such a dubious fashion, that you simply know, they hold the door open for a return. I really don't doubt, that CAM is dead. I just wish, it was shown in another fashion.
Ok, but I'm off this can of worms, since it really doesn't belong here....

Why doesn't it belong here? As i see it the question - why did sherlock do what he did? has two possible answers. The first, to protect mary and john leads u into your ethical debate....the second (my answer) to stop mary from trying to kill CAM again leads down another path but is still as entirely relevant to the title of the post.. What was it he said "John, tell mary she's safe now". What u saw folks was a british intelligence asset (CAM) being extracted for interrogation under the nose of his own protection services and an american "wet ops" agent Mary.. Shit be real folks CAM aint dead and god I do miss spooks!

 
Sorry, you're right: the way, you put it, it indeed does belong here, if we agree with your opinion or not.
I'm just so tired of all those Schroedinger's cat people in this show, who are dead... or maybe not... or maybe dead and undead at the same time.... that's Schroedinger's cat, btw....

shezza wrote:

I'm not really sold on this new Sherlock, to be honest.

And CAM is #dead guys.

Yes, CAM is dead, and if it is just for artistic reasons. They can't pull this Lazarus stunt on too many people. It gets really tiresome, if you can never be sure, that someone is dead. But it IS strange, that they show the shooting in such a roundabout way, as if they wanted to sow doubts about what we saw. But that's really a question for another thread...
 

onlydreamieverhave wrote:

Did we see CAMs body? Can't remember and forgot to record? (Anyone?) Whole thing was a bit odd to me, why were they not searched when they arrived at appledore?  Felt like the murder was faked to me..the information in CAMS head would make his faked death and abduction worth while from mycrofts position (particularly when the alternative could only have been attempt number 2 on his life by mary) confirming all the info was in his head gives mycroft a green light to extract CAM to a locked bunker for use by the british government IMO. Meanwhile SH keeps his vow to protect Mary and john by taking the rap for murder and saving them from having to tackle CAM themselves (and presumably, actually killing him)...or not whatever!

 I really wished, they would've made at least CAM's death a little more unequivocal.  Like seeing Sherlock shooting him in a rage in close up, and seeing CAM's surprised face, since he didn't see that coming. Would've had more emotional impact, too.
The number of persons, who may or may not have faked their death, or have something fishy about their death, is large enough as it is. I really don't want to worry about CAM being really dead, or really being killed by someone else, or just having got incapacitated by Sherlock, so that Mycroft can nurse him back to health in a secret vault, in order to question him... and confront him with Moriarty, who is locked away in that secret vault of Mycroft as well, together with Irene Adler.... actually I start to see immense possibilities here, lol!

Mary Me wrote:

sherlocked wrote:

Oh, I think, Mary did much more than working for the government with a licence to kill. CAM, said, she was freelancing and 'wicked'... and I believe him, strange as that sounds. If she was just a CIA agent with a licence to kill, she wouldn't have to fear to lose John's love, and it wouldn't be exactly grade A blackmailing material...

And there would be the question how tolerating you are. Once you start killing people for money, I assume your general ethic is beclouded. Funny though, when watching films like James Bond or Jason Bourne you never question their judgement when killing another person. 

I question their judgements, and I don't like those kind of movies. It has nothing to do with squeamishness, btw.
As to Mary, I got the feeling, that she did something, which cuts much closer to the bone than just killing people for money, something, which has a lot to do with Sherlock and John.
 

Oh, I think, Mary did much more than working for the government with a licence to kill. CAM, said, she was freelancing and 'wicked'... and I believe him, strange as that sounds. If she was just a CIA agent with a licence to kill, she wouldn't have to fear to lose John's love, and it wouldn't be exactly grade A blackmailing material...

SusiGo wrote:

Just one thing, Hanka - we do not know if the murder will not be dealt with in series 4. I do not believe that they will get back to business as usual without addressing this in any form. 

 I agree with you there. I feel, it will get adressed. And, maybe, there is more to this business, than we can see right now.

sj4iy wrote:

sherlocked wrote:

The thing with the cabbie is totally different. John saw, that Sherlock was about to take the pill, and he thought the cabbie was about to force him. He killed because he wanted to save someone's life, which is even a legal reason for justified killing under certain circumstances.

...except that, just like this, it never went to court because the murder was covered up in bother cases.

 No, I don't think, the cabbie's shooting by John was covered up. It was just never solved, IMO

The thing with the cabbie is totally different. John saw, that Sherlock was about to take the pill, and he thought the cabbie was about to force him. He killed because he wanted to save someone's life, which is even a legal reason for justified killing under certain circumstances.