BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / How will John react when he finds out Sherlock isn't dead?

**Posted by Irene Adler** May 25, 2012 6:55 pm

Sherlock Holmes wrote:
After John freaks out and possibly punches Sherlock I definitely think there'll be a hug. A manly hug though. Obviously.

Oh, God... that will be worth seeing. Sherlock hugging and being hugged. I wouldn't miss it for anything in the world

**Posted by Sammy** May 25, 2012 8:19 pm

Sherlock Holmes wrote:
In The Empty House Sherlock pulls a cruel trick on Watson by dressing in disguise then revealing his true identity at which point Watson faints...I think there'll go for something equally dramatic but more modern...Sherlock will just turn up out of the blue and surprise John expecting him to just be happy to have him back, not really thinking about the deeper emotional effect that it will have had on him thinking his friend was dead for three years or however long they decide to make it.

Agree
Sherlock is just the person to not quite get why they can't just go on with their lives like nothing happened.
And I also think it would be kinda fun if he disguised himself, but just like with... a hat or a hood or something and then he will pull it down and be like "ta-dah~"

**Posted by Smoggy_London_Air** May 26, 2012 5:28 am

@Sherlock Holmes Definitely. Headcanon at its most extreme. Imagine the fanfic though.

**Posted by LoveBug54** June 7, 2012 10:58 am

Hmmmm... I can't decide if John will punch Sherlock before or after he hugs him.

Just think of that look on John's face when he realises Irene Adler was not dead and multiply it x 100.

But although Sherlock's motives were good -- very good for him -- there are still going to be consequences for making the most important person in his life, a man who has PTSD, witness his "suicide." But it couldn't be helped; it's not like he had a lot of options at the time, and the fall might have killed him anyway had something gone wrong.

I think Moftiss had their themes for this series in reverse. Instead of this being about Love, Fear and Death it was about Death, Fear and Love. Sherlock risked his life for his friends and there is no greater love than that.

**Posted by bohemian_rhapsody** June 7, 2012 7:30 pm

I expect a fight like the short one in Scandal in Belgravia - this time without any humour. Not sure about the rest though. To hug or not to hug .. that is the question. Even if Sherlock has good reasons to hide, I think he will definitely hurt his friends he tried to save.

**Posted by Sentimental Pulse** June 8, 2012 6:36 pm

First Watson will be relieved and overjoyed, then quickly he will turn angry and disown Sherlock for not letting Watson in on the scheme and causing so much heartache and grief.

**Posted by KeepersPrice** June 10, 2012 9:38 pm

Glad I found this thread because I've been obsessing on the "reunion" scene for some time now. I am of the opinion that the gap will not be 3 years because yes, this is the modern age and the world moves a lot faster than Victorian England. Perhaps the "Motiss" twist on the story could be John putting a lot of hints, clues, bits of info together in his head and spending the 1st episode trying to track down Sherlock because he's become convinced the clues say he's alive. People like Lastrade, his psychiatrist, Mrs. Hudson are sure he's gone over the edge into psychosis. Mycroft is concerned that John might actually find Sherlock before the final plans to destroy Moriarty's nest, or whatever it is, come to fruition and he works hard to keep John from succeeding in his quest. Everybody could be working at cross-purposes. This is just fun speculation...but it might be kind of cool if it's John who reveals himself to Sherlock instead of the other way around.

As for the actual reunion, I'm not sure yet, but a lot is going to depend on John's state of mind when they meet. I do feel there will be a lot of hurt anger because Sherlock didn't trust him enough to tell him what was going on. This will need to be expressed (giving Martin Freeman a chance to show a remarkable range of acting - yeah!). Not sure if he will actually take a swing at Sherlock or not. It would not be totally out of character for him to do so - but not sure if it will be necessary. For Sherlock's part, I don't for a minute think he would be clueless to John's depth of feeling about the situation. From the moment John handed him the phone and said, "He's back" (and we, the audience, hear that little ominousness drum-throb in the soundtrack) Sherlock knows that things are about to take a very dark turn that will likely not end well for him and his friend. The sad look he gives John in the mirror just before they leave for the trial is very moving - Molly's observation perfectly reflected there. I also believe the tears on the rooftop were genuine because he knew he was about to break his friend's heart in order to save him. Definitely shows how far he's come in emotional development - or perhaps how far John has broken down his barriers. Anyway, Sherlock will have to look straight into John's eyes and explain why he had to do it. I imagine something like this:
"John, it had to be done this way. Lives were at stake. Your life was at stake. There could be no flaw, no crack in the facade. It had to be real. You had to believe it John - because if you didn't neither would the gunmen. I couldn't chance anything less. You're the man I've come to depend on at my side, John, steadfast - brave in any situation. My friend. I trust no other but you - but I couldn't trust you with this one. You're not a good enough actor. Could you have kept up the pretense? No, don't think so. You wear your heart on your sleeve. I can read you like a book, and if I can, so can others"......etc.

Okay, I'm not great at dialogue, but you get the idea. As for any physical contact between them like a hug...mmm, possibly.... but I'm not sure Sherlock has quite reached that level of comfort yet. Perhaps something more touching (no pun intended) would be if John continues to struggle with anger but then comes to realize what Sherlock is saying is true - yes, he would not have been a reliable participant in the magic trick. We see the anger slowly drain from his face, to be replaced by a struggle not to break down from relief. Sherlock sees this and carefully reaches out his hand and puts it gently on John's shoulder. John breaks down a little further but then reaches his hand up to tightly grip Sherlock's arm in return. End of scene. Not enough for the "shippers" I'm afraid but maybe enough to the satisfy the bromance angle and the public at large. Oh yeah.....maybe a little throw away line in there about how John tried out for the school play as a kid and was cast as a tree - thereby proving Sherlock's point about his acting and breaking the emotional tension.

Well - that was fun getting all that out! I'm drained now....

**Posted by Sherli Bakerst** June 10, 2012 11:24 pm

I feel like I've barely scratched the surface of this board even though I've been on it for what seems almost continuously since I registered a couple weeks ago; I keep finding new and interesting threads such as this one. Here are my thoughts:

I don't think John will hit/punch or hug Sherlock when he finds out he's still alive. Rather, I think John will stare at him, narrow his eyes, tug the bottom of his coat with both hands, square his shoulders, turn, and walk away from Sherlock. Where and when this happens, I don't know. But John will emanate anger and hurt and won't trust himself to say anything nor will he want to hear anything from Sherlock at that moment.

Sherlock, not expecting that response, will stay still for a moment and then walk quickly after John and catch up to him. In a quiet voice he'll say, "John."

John ignores him.

"John. Look at me."

John continues to ignore the man he used to think of as his closest friend. But, he slows down and allows Sherlock to catch up to him.

"John, let me explain."

John comes to a halt, his back still to Sherlock.

Sherlock walks around to face John. He regards the ex-soldier closely, noting the tired expression on his face, the slightly out-of-date clothes, how his old friend sighs. Then John looks up, and Sherlock sees a lifetime of emotion in his eyes. But the prevalent emotion is...what? Sherlock doesn't care to figure that out. "John," he tries again, "I..."

"Yes," John cuts him off. "You're alive. Even I can deduce that." The bitterness doesn't mask the betrayal he feels. He shakes his head and resumes walking.

Sherlock doesn't get the message. He falls into step with John and chatters on while John does his best to block out the explanation. He isn't ready to hear it. Not yet. Not for a while. Maybe not ever.

But. Sherlock is his friend. Was his friend, John reminds himself. Was. Things are different now. And a tiny voice whispers back: Are they, really?

Well, this sorta morphed into a story but I think this scenario could realistically happen.

**Posted by Smoggy_London_Air** June 13, 2012 1:44 pm

I think it will be like his reaction to Irene being alive only amplified.

"YOU WERE DEAD ON A SLAB." I think that, knowing the character and the actor he's going to shake himself and say something pretty much like that. "YOU WERE DEAD ON THE PAVEMENT. YOU WERE DEAD. I VISITED YOUR GRAVE," etc. I do wish he would faint, because I don't think it's a very Victorian behavior, at least not for men. He says in the story that it was the first and only time he fainted in his life, and remember that he hangs around with Sherlock Holmes. Watson, in whatever incarnation, is no wuss, but think about your own reaction if the person that pretty much saved you from yourself and changed your life died...and then showed up at your flat again. I think I would faint.

**Posted by ancientsgate** June 13, 2012 5:03 pm

I totally wear my slash glasses everywhere I go, so it's real hard for me to fantasize about their reunion without inserting the romance, either pre-slash or outright slash, into it.

But aside from that, IMO John knows very well that Sherlock is still alive. He doesn't know how he pulled it off, but he knows. He can barely say "he's dead" to his psychologist, and he stood at the grave and told Sherlock to "stop it... just stop this!" Um, I've stood beside many gravestones, and I've never once asked the deceased to please not be dead, lol-- so John, IMO, knows. "At times, I didn't even think you were human." Yes.

So when S finally comes out of the woodwork and reveals himself to J, I think there will be fireworks of all kinds-- anger, joy, disbelief, and maybe most of all, relief-- John will finally let out that breath he'd been holding in all the time since he watched his friend hurtle off that rooftop.

And yeah, he might very well give S a black eye. A soldier to the end, I think J would not be able to stop from hitting him (or at least wanting to and holding himself back only with great effort), any more than he did when he bloodied the Inspector's nose in TRF.

Whatever, all I know is, I cannot wait to see whatever the writers cook up, and I expect Sherlock and John's actors to deliver some powerful acting. Yum.

**Posted by Sherlock Holmes** June 14, 2012 9:46 am

Wow, you guys a rather good....I'm enjoying your bits of dialogue and scenes. You should send them to the Moff, lol

**Posted by KeepersPrice** June 15, 2012 3:31 am

Yes, SH - actually we're waiting for Moffat and Gatiss to contact us demanding our services! I told Sherli B that we need to hold out for at least $250,000 a page! Ha, ha!

**Posted by Silent.Ecstasy** June 16, 2012 2:37 am

When I think of it in my head, it happens something along the lines of this:
John can't move on from the fact that Sherlock is dead, he's still living in the flat with Mrs. Hudson, and one day, Mrs. Hudson kicks him out of the flat, telling him that he can't sit around like a miserable puppy anymore (yeah..puppy xD) so he goes shopping for groceries (it seems to fit, since he usually shopped for Sherlock x3) and when he's coming out of the store, Sherlock is behind him and suddenly starts "Observing" him, immediately saying things like, "I've noticed you lost a lot of weight, clothes seem roughly worn out, which means you haven't really been taking care of yourself, your limp is back, which means you've been dealing with quite a lot of emotional stress, you aren't dating, or you would've gotten newer clothes and you would be (probably) be living with the girlfriend/boyfriend in question, but instead you're shopping for yourself and Mrs. Hudson, so it's safe to conclude you haven't gotten over my "death"" (while he puts quotation marks around the word death in the air

John is speechless, and all of a sudden he drops all his groceries and just stands there for a while, and rushes over to Sherlock and tentatively touches his hand, and when he sees it's actually Sherlock, he says, "Bloody hell, you're alive!" And Sherlock just shrugs and says, "Well, obviously! I'm here, aren't I?"

And all of a sudden John punches him in the face, yelling things like, "Why would you do that to me? Do you realize how it felt this past year? (it's only a year in my headcanon because 3 years is waay too long x3) How the hell did you do it?" and finally, when he calms down a little, Sherlock asks, "Better?" and he says, "Yeah.." and they do this sort of awkward hug, and they go back to Baker street together, Sherlock explains everything, and they go back to solving crimes together x3

Thr script sucks, but it's basically how I see it happen xD
I think John's part when Sherlock comes back will be the most amazing acting of the whole series, since he has all these feelings pent up inside of him, and watching MF play then out will be a pleasure to watch ^_^

**Posted by jenosborn** June 16, 2012 10:50 pm

Very nice, Silent.Ecstasy. Especially the "Well obviously!" - kind of along the lines of "perfectly sound analysis, but I was hoping you'd go deeper."

And any reunion scenario should definitely include a punch in the face!

The acting all around has the potential to be stellar, as you point out.

I've often thought about how the writers are going to structure the reunion scene. The writers have a lot to play with if they work in the Mrs. John Watson/ Mary Morstan angle. If they decide to kill her off before they re-introduce Sherlock, (since John is a widower by the time of the 'Empty House' story), I can see it going along the lines of:

Open with John, at a gravesite (familiar now to us), but as the camera pans back we see he is actually in mourning over the recent sudden death of his new wife. In following scenes, via flashback (maybe even via more therapist scenes), we learn of that chapter of his life, how she really was special, and did fill the gap of losing a best friend, how they shared a lot in a short period of time. We'd get to see just how good she was for him, and how she appreciated and knew instinctively how much he missed Sherlock when she first met him.

Anyway, however Sherlock re-surfaces, to this doubly-grieving Watson, I would hope there is a nod to his dear Mary. For however grand this off-screen romance may have been, his Sherlock graveside wish "Sherlock, please don't be dead" should resonate with an understanding that Dr.&Mrs.W share - even if unspoken, "Mary, please don't let Sherlock be dead"…

After the punching, and whatever between them, I do hope there's a scene which was suggested previously, that someone gets to say 'Let's have dinner.'

Group hug? well maybe. But only very briefly, later, and if Mrs. Hudson is involved.

**Posted by ancientsgate** June 16, 2012 11:01 pm

I think there may be a punch in the face coming, for sure. Whether or not S will allow it to actually connect I have no idea. As we've seen, he has the fighting skills to block any punch he sees coming, if that's the way the writers write it for him.

As for any friendly touching, group hugs, etc, well.... I find that very doubtful with this group. S might allow Mrs. H a brief weepy hug, because he's fond of her and she's like his doting aunt or grandma in a way. But the writers have never shown us any physical warmth between S and J that I can remember, so why would they start hugging now? After all, it's not like someone came back from the dead or something. heh

**Posted by Silent.Ecstasy** June 17, 2012 12:25 am

jenosborn wrote:
Very nice, Silent.Ecstasy. Especially the "Well obviously!" - kind of along the lines of "perfectly sound analysis, but I was hoping you'd go deeper."

And any reunion scenario should definitely include a punch in the face!

The acting all around has the potential to be stellar, as you point out.

I've often thought about how the writers are going to structure the reunion scene. The writers have a lot to play with if they work in the Mrs. John Watson/ Mary Morstan angle. If they decide to kill her off before they re-introduce Sherlock, (since John is a widower by the time of the 'Empty House' story), I can see it going along the lines of:

Open with John, at a gravesite (familiar now to us), but as the camera pans back we see he is actually in mourning over the recent sudden death of his new wife. In following scenes, via flashback (maybe even via more therapist scenes), we learn of that chapter of his life, how she really was special, and did fill the gap of losing a best friend, how they shared a lot in a short period of time. We'd get to see just how good she was for him, and how she appreciated and knew instinctively how much he missed Sherlock when she first met him.

Anyway, however Sherlock re-surfaces, to this doubly-grieving Watson, I would hope there is a nod to his dear Mary. For however grand this off-screen romance may have been, his Sherlock graveside wish "Sherlock, please don't be dead" should resonate with an understanding that Dr.&Mrs.W share - even if unspoken, "Mary, please don't let Sherlock be dead"…

After the punching, and whatever between them, I do hope there's a scene which was suggested previously, that someone gets to say 'Let's have dinner.'

Group hug? well maybe. But only very briefly, later, and if Mrs. Hudson is involved.

Thank you! (and please, call me Sarah ^_^) I quite liked it, I'm trying to actually get it down on paper, maybe prefect it so I won't go absolutely insane just thinking about it haha
I would love to go deeper with the analysis, but I'm not really on Sherlock's level yet I'm trying though!

If it doesn't have a punch in the face, I'll keep feeling like it's missing something

I'm thinking they might change that, since Mary and John aren't married yet, it seems improbable they would have him get married while he's still mourning the loss of his friend, and I think I would prefer it if John/Sherlock got together instead at some point after Sherlock's return

Wow....I haven't actually thought of that, if Moffat were to actually go in that direction, I think it would be a pretty cool way to show it, how you're describing it c:

Mary will most likely be his crutch for that whole time, it seems to me that he trusts her enough to let his emotions run free with her, especially since she's stuck through with him

The "let's have dinner" will be amazing if it happens! I would love to see that, including seeing Sherlock in a group hug with the rest of them, so cute! <3

All in all, I can't wait wait for the next series, I'm hoping it will fulfill all of our expectations

Last edited by Silent.Ecstasy (June 17, 2012 12:27 am)

**Posted by kazza474** June 17, 2012 12:47 am

ancientsgate wrote:
I think there may be a punch in the face coming, for sure. Whether or not S will allow it to actually connect I have no idea. As we've seen, he has the fighting skills to block any punch he sees coming, if that's the way the writers write it for him.

As for any friendly touching, group hugs, etc, well.... I find that very doubtful with this group. S might allow Mrs. H a brief weepy hug, because he's fond of her and she's like his doting aunt or grandma in a way. But the writers have never shown us any physical warmth between S and J that I can remember, so why would they start hugging now? After all, it's not like someone came back from the dead or something. heh

What a good post. Exactly right on the Sherlock & John hugging thing, how out of character would that be? If that happened, it would show the writer's were caving in to some fandom pressure and would indicate a downhill slide in quality for the future. Frankly, it'd spell the end of the series for good.
My quirky comedic streak would love to see Henry Fishguard (dressed in Great Coat & Deerstalker) 'sitting' in a theatre watching the same movie that John goes to see; sitting on a bus as it drives past John walking down the road. These are Sherlock's attempts at softening the blow & sending hints to John that "I am here"; hints that John would no doubt completely misunderstand of course.
Could be quite a comical opening.

**Posted by Sherlock Holmes** June 18, 2012 8:17 pm

Not even a manly hug Kazza? Just a small manly hug?

**Posted by Davina** June 18, 2012 8:48 pm

Are you trying to say Martin is small?

**Posted by kazza474** June 19, 2012 5:31 am

Sherlock Holmes wrote:
Not even a manly hug Kazza? Just a small manly hug?

And when have they ever done that before?
I'd suggest the only reason John would do that would be to get a better starting position for some army wrestling technique he knows.
And that would be short lived when Sherlock applies his baritsu skills
*giggles*