BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / Thoughts about series 3 as a whole

**Posted by JP** September 23, 2015 2:36 pm

Zatoichi wrote:
That goes very much in the direction of my thoughts.. maybe he is already over the "parenting" at that point. I would certainly applaud that. But to me he didn´ t seem too grown-up at the wedding.. if I think at his hurt face when Mycroft made the "Redbeard"-remark, Mycroft lecturing him in his mindpalace, him hitting himself or the exaggerated shocked expression at John´s "drama queen".. so to me this remark seemed like the climax of a succession of instances that show regressed!Sherlock.

This is actually an inconsistence of the character (it almost feels like there were an important scene cut from the episode) but I see the mature Sherlock only at the dancing scene. As if something snapped inside him. The speach he gives about the problem being handled - he is so comfortable in it, as if he was doing speeches all the time. Okay, maybe the Vow itself was him being carried away a bit.

**Posted by tonnaree** September 23, 2015 4:09 pm

Vhanja wrote:
Aaaand another thread that went straight to the gutter.

How many of those do we have now?

Isn't there an internet rule about that.

All discusion threads will eventually end up in the gutter.

**Posted by JP** September 23, 2015 5:26 pm

You just need a proper drainage in this forum.

**Posted by tonnaree** September 23, 2015 5:28 pm

Don't look at me.
I'm perfectly happy in the gutter.

*adjusts thudding matteress and shock blanket*
*hugs Watson Bear tight*

**Posted by Zatoichi** September 24, 2015 5:34 pm

JP wrote:
Zatoichi wrote:
That goes very much in the direction of my thoughts.. maybe he is already over the "parenting" at that point. I would certainly applaud that. But to me he didn´ t seem too grown-up at the wedding.. if I think at his hurt face when Mycroft made the "Redbeard"-remark, Mycroft lecturing him in his mindpalace, him hitting himself or the exaggerated shocked expression at John´s "drama queen".. so to me this remark seemed like the climax of a succession of instances that show regressed!Sherlock.
This is actually an inconsistence of the character (it almost feels like there were an important scene cut from the episode) but I see the mature Sherlock only at the dancing scene. As if something snapped inside him. The speach he gives about the problem being handled - he is so comfortable in it, as if he was doing speeches all the time. Okay, maybe the Vow itself was him being carried away a bit.

Maybe he felt so elated about the case solved..? And the wedding business being finally (almost) brought to an successful end? So elated he actually wanted a dance.. with a girl.. in the middle of being downed by the prospect of losing John to his new family? Idk..

Last edited by Zatoichi (September 24, 2015 5:35 pm)

**Posted by besleybean** October 14, 2015 8:11 am

I do feel Sherlock is very conflicted.
He approves of Mary and accepts he has to let John go to her.
But he misses John and is friendly with Janine because well...he hasn't anybody else.
But then even she is snapped up, too.
He's destined to be alone...

**Posted by SusiGo** August 16, 2016 9:28 pm

I did not know where to put this but I think this thread might work. This is a screenshot from Sherlock Uncovered - Villains, to be found on the series 3 blu-ray.

This is incredible for a lot of reasons:
- cigarette holes in a wedding invitation
- the wilted flower seems to be from Sherlock's wedding bouquet
- the odd webpage with the Appledore roof construction, Canon name Milverton over Mary's face
- the text under the wedding pic: “Are recently married couple John and Mary Watson (nee Morstan) really the match made in heaven we’ve all been to believe…?”

So they seem to be hiding clues in the extras. Until someone finds them two and half years later. Btw, not me but @221bgay on tumblr.

**Posted by Vhanja** August 16, 2016 9:33 pm

That IS very odd. It does seem a bit too obvious, though, as a hint? Too much in the open?

**Posted by tonnaree** August 16, 2016 9:33 pm

Fascinating Susi!

**Posted by SusiGo** August 16, 2016 9:37 pm

Vhanja wrote:
That IS very odd. It does seem a bit too obvious, though, as a hint? Too much in the open?

As I said, this has never been discussed anywhere since 2014. At least not on tumblr or in here. Not so obvious, if you ask me.

Last edited by SusiGo (August 16, 2016 9:38 pm)

**Posted by Vhanja** August 16, 2016 9:38 pm

Fans are rarely that lazy... What does the clip say, the one on the upmost left that we only see partly?

**Posted by SusiGo** August 16, 2016 9:41 pm

I think it was something about TGG but I am not sure. If I find the time, I will have a look myself. But I cannot make a screenshot since my computer does not play Blu-Rays.

**Posted by Vhanja** August 16, 2016 9:42 pm

Mine neither. I could take a pic with my mobile from my tv, but that would have to wait until Thursday-ish. Someone will probably do it before that.

**Posted by SusiGo** August 16, 2016 9:45 pm

Here is some additional information by the person who posted this:

I’m seeing a lot of confusion, and maybe I should have been more clear when I posted this. This is a screenshot from Sherlock Uncovered: Episode 3, The Villains. This is a part of series 3 on Netflix in the US, so it is official. HOWEVER, I’m not sure who produced it or how much creative say Moffat and Gatiss had in it. This is the opening sequence for Mary’s section of the Villain episode (which is telling in and of itself). All that being said- this is not a real set/real props from the show; Sherlock certainly never had Milverton crossed out over a picture of Mary (Milverton is CAM’s name in ACD canon), and potentially never burned his wedding invite or left his boutonnière out to rot. It’s also unlikely that in canon, a gossip blog blogged about the Watsons. I assume these are more easter eggs than anything else, but keep in mind that anyone could’ve designed this, and TPTB may have had little to do with it. My best guess is that someone in production designed it, and either Mofftis or Sue or another producer signed off on it. I think it’s inline with their vision for the show and characters, but it’s not 100% reliable and definitely not canon that Sherlock assembled this wall. Feel free to have a different outlook on this- it’s just my best guess for how seriously we should take this.

**Posted by Liberty** August 17, 2016 6:46 am

Interesting, and thanks for the information. I may be remembering wrong, but I think Sherlock threw his buttonhole, and Janine caught it, so he didn't leave it out (that we know). I suspect that it might be supposed to be clues for HLV instead, where Mary is revealed as a villain (temporarily at least), with Milverton meaning Magnussen, etc., especially if this section is about Mary in S3. I haven't watched it for a while - will watch it again if I get the chance and see what I think!

**Posted by diva** August 17, 2016 9:15 pm

SusiGo wrote:
Here is some additional information by the person who posted this:

I’m seeing a lot of confusion, and maybe I should have been more clear when I posted this. This is a screenshot from Sherlock Uncovered: Episode 3, The Villains. This is a part of series 3 on Netflix in the US, so it is official. HOWEVER, I’m not sure who produced it or how much creative say Moffat and Gatiss had in it. This is the opening sequence for Mary’s section of the Villain episode (which is telling in and of itself). All that being said- this is not a real set/real props from the show; Sherlock certainly never had Milverton crossed out over a picture of Mary (Milverton is CAM’s name in ACD canon), and potentially never burned his wedding invite or left his boutonnière out to rot. It’s also unlikely that in canon, a gossip blog blogged about the Watsons. I assume these are more easter eggs than anything else, but keep in mind that anyone could’ve designed this, and TPTB may have had little to do with it. My best guess is that someone in production designed it, and either Mofftis or Sue or another producer signed off on it. I think it’s inline with their vision for the show and characters, but it’s not 100% reliable and definitely not canon that Sherlock assembled this wall. Feel free to have a different outlook on this- it’s just my best guess for how seriously we should take this.

Fascinating stuff! These "Sherlock Uncovered" clips are included on the Series Three Special Edition bonus disc so I think it is as official as any other bonus material too.

**Posted by SusiGo** August 17, 2016 9:18 pm

Exactly. And I think combination of burnt invitation, wilted buttonhole, a website throwing doubt on the happy Watson marriage and the Mary/Magnussen/Milverton combination is quite telling.

**Posted by besleybean** August 18, 2016 5:43 am

More telling for S 4, perhaps.

**Posted by Liberty** August 18, 2016 7:02 am

I'm not sure - just in S3, Mary turns out to not be what she seems, she deceives John and shoots Sherlock, virtually killing him, the marriage splits up for months, with just a tentative reconciliation at the end. And, of course, Magnussen was based on Milverton. I think it's about S3.

**Posted by Schmiezi** August 22, 2016 4:59 am

Liberty wrote:
I'm not sure - just in S3, Mary turns out to not be what she seems, she deceives John and shoots Sherlock, virtually killing him, the marriage splits up for months, with just a tentative reconciliation at the end.

This is a very good summary of HLV and the real cliff hanger of S3.