BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

**Posted by lil** February 25, 2014 6:40 pm

The scene where they are planning the wedding...
Sherlock wants Mary to invite more people..so shes struggling to find friends..and then later he gives her what looks like a rather large list of names of people she has invited that dislike her.
Interesting that Mary doesn't seemed bothered by that either.
Quite leading I thought...she has had quite a few years to make friends/aquaintances...but it seems even they dislike her.
Not to mention Janine being her matron of honour, a person she was using/hoping to manipulate.
Indicative that her behaviour is generally not that nice anyway don't you think..
Backed up by her rude uncaring attitude with Wiggins in hlv.

Last edited by lil (February 25, 2014 6:45 pm)

**Posted by besleybean** February 25, 2014 6:44 pm

How was she rude and uncaring to Wiggins?
Even if she was, he got his own back when he drugged her.

**Posted by lil** February 25, 2014 6:55 pm

besleybean wrote:
How was she rude and uncaring to Wiggins?
Even if she was, he got his own back when he drugged her.

- Car scene when he says he is injured etc
- Hospital scene , she bandaged his arm but he claims she hurt him and cradles his wrist..she snaps " you moved" quite sharply blaming him.
- When he is acting the homeless street guy to give her the phone from Sherlock.

Heh yes he did get to drug her @the end..

**Posted by SusiGo** February 25, 2014 8:39 pm

I did not mention her relationship with Janine because we do not know much about it. We do not even know if she uses her to gain entry to the office. I suppose she will have used another way in. She knocks her and the security person unconscious but this is not such an unusual thing in the Sherlock universe. As you can see, I do not criticise her blindly.
And what Sherlock does is not very nice, neither here nor in Canon. It fits his old pattern of using Molly and drugging John.
The difference, however, is that Mary is ready to shoot CAM and that she owns a gun with a silencer and is willing to use it even on a friend.

**Posted by Willow** February 25, 2014 9:26 pm

Swanpride wrote:
Concerning Wiggins....she is acting towards him with the typical no-nonsense attitude of a nurse. It's never a good idea to indulge a complaining patient too much. .

I am pleased to say that the Nursing and Midwifery Council disagrees with you on this one: their Code of Conduct, which all practising nurses and midwives in the UK are bound by, is rather long to quote in full but includes:

3. 'You must treat people kindly and considerately.'

and

8. 'You must listen to the people in your care and respond to their concerns and preferences'

Telling people it's all their own fault really isn't good nursing practice; whatever else may be said for Mary's skills as a nurse, she clearly isn't bothered about complying with the Code of Conduct.

**Posted by SusiGo** February 25, 2014 9:30 pm

Tbh, I did not mention this scene in my analysis because the thought that Mary was not doing her job the right way did not even cross my mind. What I have been trying to avoid and what I would friendly request everyone to do is this - not getting too critical and turning everything Mary does into an accusation.

**Posted by besleybean** February 25, 2014 9:32 pm

Yeo, she's a victim, too.

**Posted by besleybean** February 25, 2014 9:39 pm

So maybe Wiggins got his revenge on John, too!

**Posted by SusiGo** February 25, 2014 9:42 pm

I think we should not take the whole drugs scene too seriously, i.e. the behaviour of the persons involved. They are under stress, it is all slightly over the top. Molly slapping Sherlock three times, Billy deducing John's personal habits, Mary not being too careful with Billy's arm.

**Posted by besleybean** February 25, 2014 9:49 pm

Just stating fact...

**Posted by SolarSystem** February 25, 2014 9:59 pm

John doing wrong doesn't make what Mary is doing right. Yes, John shot the cabbie in ASiP, Sherlock threw a guy out of a window several times, they bot are willing to sometimes take arguable measures to reach their goal. But pointing at them doesn't take the responsibility for her actions away from Mary. And at this point, at the end of S3 and without having any idea what will happen in S4, I don't really see her showing any willingness to take responsibility. John threw A.G.R.A. into the fire, and that seems to be it - for John, but also for Mary.

**Posted by RavenMorganLeigh** February 25, 2014 10:20 pm

Honestly, I think people need to stop taking observations about the characters that actually happened in the show as accusations or insults or attacks against either the characters (which are fictional) or even worse-- against any of us. We need to not take this personally-- no-one is attacking anyone. By the same token, shouldn't we all be free to express how we feel about what we watched? Do we really want people to be so afraid of expressing their own opinions about the show that we end up self-censoring ourselves? Really?

Sorry, rant over. Please feel free to take the virtual metaphorical nerf bat and begin beating me about the head and shoulders!

**Posted by Sherlock Holmes** February 26, 2014 12:15 am

Ha, never has a character divided this fandom so much. I LOVE IT!

**Posted by SolarSystem** February 26, 2014 5:05 am

Interesting analysis:

http://deducingbbcsherlock.tumblr.com/post/77865018181/their-masks-just-drop-the-instant-mary-turns

**Posted by SolarSystem** February 26, 2014 5:08 am

Swanpride wrote:
Yeah, but if we forgive John and Sherlock, why shouldn't we forgive Mary?

Uhm, because they all three aren't one and the same person, they all did different things, they all come from different places, they all behave differently, they all take responsibility for their actions in different ways, just to name a few reasons...?
I don't 'forgive' someone just because I 'forgave' someone else... that would be a bit weird.

Last edited by SolarSystem (February 26, 2014 5:09 am)

**Posted by RavenMorganLeigh** February 26, 2014 5:34 am

SolarSystem wrote:
Interesting analysis:

http://deducingbbcsherlock.tumblr.com/post/77865018181/their-masks-just-drop-the-instant-mary-turns

Thank you for sharing this, SolarSystem, it's freaking brilliant! I'm now following the blog. Nice insights.

**Posted by jenosborn** February 26, 2014 6:59 am

RavenMorganLeigh wrote:
SolarSystem wrote:
Interesting analysis:

http://deducingbbcsherlock.tumblr.com/post/77865018181/their-masks-just-drop-the-instant-mary-turns
Thank you for sharing this, SolarSystem, it's freaking brilliant! I'm now following the blog. Nice insights.

Agreed!    I really enjoy this take on it,   food for thought.       Maybe series 4 is when John really comes alive
again?    Stakes are much greater, with their daughter on the scene too.    I was just beginning to think (no,
of *course* he watched what was on that USB stick..before tossing it on the fire.)   So, thanks for
forwarding this.   quite interesting.

**Posted by SolarSystem** February 26, 2014 7:04 am

jenosborn wrote:
I was just beginning to think (no,
of *course* he watched what was on that USB stick..before tossing it on the fire.)

I'm actually coming back to this idea again and again, because really... I'm just not convinced that John didn't have a look at it. I can't imagine that he really wouldn't want to know... doesn't mean he read every last detail, but at least... some of the stuff that's on there...

Last edited by SolarSystem (February 26, 2014 7:04 am)

**Posted by SusiGo** February 26, 2014 7:10 am

SolarSystem wrote:
Interesting analysis:

http://deducingbbcsherlock.tumblr.com/post/77865018181/their-masks-just-drop-the-instant-mary-turns

Thank you for posting this, Solar, just brilliant. And I am glad someone else shares my ideas. Did not observe the moment at the airfield, though, but it is definitely there.

**Posted by jenosborn** February 26, 2014 7:55 am

SolarSystem wrote:
jenosborn wrote:
I was just beginning to think (no,
of *course* he watched what was on that USB stick..before tossing it on the fire.)
I'm actually coming back to this idea again and again, because really... I'm just not convinced that John didn't have a look at it. I can't imagine that he really wouldn't want to know... doesn't mean he read every last detail, but at least... some of the stuff that's on there...

Yes, and the "rehearsed words" might really have needed to be rehearsed for him, given what he actually
knew what had happened in the past, and what he may think may be in store for them
in the future, a very charged scene. And so beautifully played by both of them.