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June 19, 2013 7:00 am  #801


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

Hi there , just some idea's i had that led to my own theory , i enjoyed reading some of yours , i wonder what you think of them ~

Moriarty's theme tune is " staying alive " why ? When he plays it for SH on the roof , it finishes and he mimes a flatline mocking death ~ life's boring anyway tho huh ?

In Moriarty's first conversation with SH he references the Bach deathbed story ~ Bach couldn't stand to die with something unfinished and then Moriarty taps out the rythem of Bach's Partita No. 1 . 

Famously the last piece Bach wrote was a chorale prelude for organ, entitled Vor deinen Thron tret ich hiermit (Before thy throne I now appear, BWV 668a) which he dictated from his deathbed. When the notes on the three staves of the final cadence are counted and mapped onto the Roman alphabet, the initials "JSB" are found. Seems Bach invented a keycode too . 

Bach-1 specifically tho ?.  A vital liver protien/antibody ?. 

In the film ~ Staying alive ~ The main character asks his gf ~ " Do you have a iou? " 
It's a usually un~noticed mistake. 
What he was supposed to say was " Do you have a idu? " Obviously in the film the reference is to contraceptives , but most commonly now idu refers to Intravenous Drug Use , you might see it on a liver dialysis/ hepatitus patients file for example,  .
Did you think Moriarty looked ill ? 

Moriarty tells SH "IOU" .He is calling in his Debts,  and as he tells SH , soon , he doesn't have much time and refers to The Final Problem . He wants to die with SH. (  they need each other/ No living without each other / Dieing together ~ Which seems to have been Moriarty's plan from TGG on. ) 

Moriarty is dieing and SH is unfinished business , and what he owes SH is death and what he wants is to die with SH.

Its like the what kind of criminal leaves
clues  Q  = One that wants to get caught .
And remember the same Q but with assasins that miss ? = Ones that arn't trying.

M did get caught as he wanted , but was released as expected , so thats not really the answer is it  ,
i think the answer is  
~ One that wants to die .



With the false advertising campaign and the rigged trial and
Using the Grimms fairy tales themes , breadcrumbs , riddles , the villain , the fox , the key , snow white , the king ,etc etc ,as clues for SH , Moriarty sets SH up as a disgraced fake and sets the scene for SH's death in one of many ways.

On the roof Moriarty admits the so called keycode is made up , a con that he has sold to set all his nasty clients worldwide after SH.Because he has told them Sherlock has the key. The man with the key is king , Moriarty entered this game with a crown on his head , has he passed it to SH?
Does SH now have the key ? Is this all just another way of ensuring SH's death if Moriarty dies himself ? or was it always just red herrings ?

Also a note on Anderson. , He has been bribed  , when SH has homeless people looking for the kidnapped kids , he tells Lestrade they are quicker than the yard and " less easy to bribe." AND then he looks right at Anderson . Thats why he later ASKS for Anderson on forensics , he has seen the set up coming and where from . Obvious ?

Moriarty seems to have finished up his unfinished business and organised SH's death in many ways , even his backups have backups . ( the three snipers ) etc .

However SH seems to also have made backups too ~ he chooses the place where he can "fake" his own death ,ridding himself of people that want the code , and the assasins  , and the police , media , etc etc  

Moriarty made a last moment mistake on the roof tho , oops he boasted ? ~  he mentioned he wouldn't call them off ( the snipers ) and SH saw a way to Force Moriarty to an instant death , instead of having to find him later or wait , ~    " I am You " , " I have You ." SH tell Moriarty.

Obviously Moriarty knows SH is willing to die to prove a point from EP1.

Thus Moriarty shoots himself thinking checkmate , and that they would die together as he had planned maybe ? he did have the gun with him afterall.

Unfortunatly SH still had to die convincingly ,and stay dead , he still had plan B ( the guys after the code ) and plan C ( the snipers on John ) to deal with afterall .

He did still win the game tho , His King lived in the end :D


PS As an aside . I notice the writers like to stick with ACD cannon when they can , , in ACD cannon SH leaves Watson a note saying he expects to die in his final confrontation with Moriarty , but that to take the greatest criminal mind ever down with him is worth the price , and will give his death meaning .
The above theory is an almost exact reversal of ACD's cannon , but with Moriarty wanting to take SH down with him . I think thats kinda neat .

Last edited by lil (June 21, 2013 2:27 am)

 

June 23, 2013 3:38 am  #802


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

I think Moriarty killed himself to so that Sherlock didn't have an out. As he's portrayed in the Reichenbach Fall, he finds just being alive boring.

I agree Sherlock's plan involved Moriarty being dead before he jumped.

I also think it'd be easy for Mycroft to completely overturn all the Moriarty propaganda. He basically runs the British Government. It'd be easy for him to have any story he wanted printed and all of Moriarty's lies erased.


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Is the foil of a detective a thief or a magician?

My Theory on the Fall: http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=21539#p21539
 

June 23, 2013 7:45 am  #803


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

I'm not convinced that the Holmes boys weren't merely trying to capture Moriarty and clear Sherlock's name...


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

June 23, 2013 12:23 pm  #804


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

besleybean wrote:

I'm not convinced that the Holmes boys weren't merely trying to capture Moriarty and clear Sherlock's name...

But Mycroft had Moriarty and let him go.  Mycroft clearly needed information that only Sherlock could get...but I don't think that Sherlock was in on the plan.


__________________________________________________________________Bigby: Will you shut up?
Colin: Well, maybe if my throat wasn’t so parched, I wouldn’t have to keep talking.
Bigby: Wait, that doesn’t make se-
Coline: Just give me a drink, please.
 

June 27, 2013 12:04 am  #805


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

sj4iy wrote:

besleybean wrote:

I'm not convinced that the Holmes boys weren't merely trying to capture Moriarty and clear Sherlock's name...

But Mycroft had Moriarty and let him go.  Mycroft clearly needed information that only Sherlock could get...but I don't think that Sherlock was in on the plan.

Mycroft wasn't interested in Moriarty,per se' Mycroft wanted the code.
When Moriarty launched the false ad campaign , using Sherlock , Mycroft prob. let it play out hoping Sherlock wld get the code.
However the so called code was a long con and what Moriarty really wanted was to arrange Sherlock's fall .

Obviously Sherlock saw tht coming hence the pre-planned fake death.
This gives Sherlock the perfect opportunity to turn the hunt on the assasins & codeseekers.

 

June 27, 2013 5:36 am  #806


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

So if he did record his rooftop conversation with Moriarty, was that partly for Mycroft's benefit?


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

June 28, 2013 12:39 am  #807


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

I'm pretty sure Sherlock would have explained to Mycroft the code was a fake and Mycroft would have believed him without needing to record the whole conversation on the roof.


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Is the foil of a detective a thief or a magician?

My Theory on the Fall: http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=21539#p21539
 

June 28, 2013 6:08 am  #808


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

Obviously if Sherlock knew before he was on the roof...
Oh I see what you mean, cos presumably he communicates with Mycroft after!
Well yeah, as long as Sherlock is positive he was going to survive.
Maybe he needed to record the evidence for other peoples benefit...
Also for court, if he didn't know Moriarty would definitely die.


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

June 30, 2013 3:45 pm  #809


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

I don't have a complete theory, but I wanna tell you what I was thinking. Some things (but not 54 pages) I've seen here and agree, but I hope to bring something new too. Sorry about English.
First, I don't wanna believe we have been fooled by the cameras, this is too easy. As far as possible, everything we see actually happened.
My thoughts:
Sherlock has been planning everything for a long time, since the pool meeting.  I think that during the great game Sherlock learned that: 1.Moriarty could use his friends to get to him ("I was informed I don't have a heart." "We both know it's not quite true") 2. M wanted to see him dancing, so Sherlock should be always one step ahead, but letting M think he was lost in the game.
Sherlock planned everything with Mycroft’s help. We see S asks for Mycroft's help in Hounds (An ironic "Hello, brother, dear. How are you?" phone call) but Moriarty didn't participate in that case, he wouldn’t know that. The initial plan: not letting Moriarty realize that the brothers are together.
Apparently John read the newspaper and confirmed that Sherlock’s life history was correct (“There are some things that only a close person would know”). It makes me think that Sherlock and Mycroft planned it, which could explain why Sherlock tells John he is a fake. They could control Moriarty and gain time when giving him an extra: why just kill Sherlock when he could ruin S’s reputation?
Sherlock acts in front of Moriarty the entire episode. While they’re having tea, do you think S would see Moriarty’s fingers and ignore that? No! They were talking about Bach. Sherlock plays violin, he should know Partita N. 1. Now he recognized that, he wouldn’t consider that while thinking of the code. But when he was talking to John about the code and once more the fingers come to the talk, he sees that that was M’s red herring, the Binary Code (and there’s no code). M convinced the jury, he could convince everyone of everything.
Sherlock said, “I’m you. Prepared for anything”. That’s why I think he thought of every single possibility and had A, B, C, D plans. And, at that moment, M realized he couldn’t beat S.
Talking about the fall:
We’ve seen a fall before! “He fell out of a window”, yes, the American man. It may mean nothing, but I kind of find that scene Ooc, and Moffat never said the clue was specifically in TRF . Not only because Sherlock isn’t driven by emotions, but the punishment does not amount to the crime. The man “falls” several times and survives, that is because Sherlock never intended to kill him and, according to the Canon, has “accurate, but unsystematic” knowledge in anatomy.
So, why couldn’t he jump? He offers resistance to air and there’s a possibility he landed knees and hands first, head later. It seems like the sniper could clearly see Sherlock falling, if he had to see John and see the moment Sherlock jumps, but I’m not sure.
I don’t how much time had passed from the moment he jumped until John goes to the cemetery, but he had already gone to the psychologist, Mrs. Hudson had already organized S’s mess and there’s no reason to visit a grave just a few days after the funeral (let’s consider that John wasn’t even ready to go to Baker Street, so he had spent some time finding strength to go to the cemetery, maybe?). Maybe enough time for Sherlock to recover.
That’s all I remember I’d like to say for now. I have no answers, I know, I just wanted to share my thoughts and see what’s wrong.


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“The scar had not pained Harry for nineteen years. All was well.” HP and the Deathly Hallows

"Why's it always the hat photograph?"The Reichenbach Fall
 

July 1, 2013 4:33 am  #810


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

OK , now it is obvious as to how .

A fake Sherlock fell. ( Molly threw it )

The real Sherlock was behind the smaller building , when the fake Sherlock landed , the real one took his place.
Enter bus's and lorry's to obscure the landing and homeless ppl to remove fake Sherlock and add blood etc.

The biker slipped something on Johns wrist ! (Observe and you will  SEE ? ) John was out of it longer than you think.
 
ENDOV We know that all happened. 
Easy to fake the fall tbh .!

" It's just a majic trick " (The Optical illusion of Sherlock jumping , he didnt a dummy was thrown.)

The real mystery is WHY!!!!

WHY ?   Bach and Deathbed's and unfinished business!  and Codehunters and Assasins and  Moriarty's plans A, B. and C to make Sherlock fall , ( die with Moriatry the final problem solved!
) and  ACD cannon in reverse .

Everything Else Is Red Fishe's !!!


Final Words from me  , Cos , That was the way the cookie crumbled.

I REST MY CASE.

Game Over.

(Apologies for the spoilers.)

Last edited by lil (July 1, 2013 4:42 am)

 

July 1, 2013 5:22 am  #811


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

lil wrote:

OK , now it is obvious as to how .

A fake Sherlock fell. ( Molly threw it )

The real Sherlock was behind the smaller building , when the fake Sherlock landed , the real one took his place.
Enter bus's and lorry's to obscure the landing and homeless ppl to remove fake Sherlock and add blood etc.

The biker slipped something on Johns wrist ! (Observe and you will  SEE ? ) John was out of it longer than you think.
 
ENDOV We know that all happened. 
Easy to fake the fall tbh .!

" It's just a majic trick " (The Optical illusion of Sherlock jumping , he didnt a dummy was thrown.)

The real mystery is WHY!!!!

WHY ?   Bach and Deathbed's and unfinished business!  and Codehunters and Assasins and  Moriarty's plans A, B. and C to make Sherlock fall , ( die with Moriatry the final problem solved!
) and  ACD cannon in reverse .

Everything Else Is Red Fishe's !!!


Final Words from me  , Cos , That was the way the cookie crumbled.

I REST MY CASE.

Game Over.

(Apologies for the spoilers.)

What do you mean by a fake Sherlock exactly? We saw Sherlock jump, remember, and we saw him moving as he fell


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That's the thing about fanfiction, it's always a self-portrait
People want to believe what is easy, rather than what is right.
"One begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts"
 

July 2, 2013 1:57 am  #812


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

It's without a doubt real alive Sherlock jumping off the building. Whether it's Sherlock on the ground or not I guess is up to interpretation but I have to say any theories that start with a dummy or body I instantly don't believe.


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July 2, 2013 1:59 am  #813


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

Michele wrote:

It's without a doubt real alive Sherlock jumping off the building. Whether it's Sherlock on the ground or not I guess is up to interpretation but I have to say any theories that start with a dummy or body I instantly don't believe.

Right. Ben even talked about it in interviews, what it was like to fall 75 feet into a huge air bag. You can clearly see his face as he falls,his arms and legs moving, etc. No dummy.

 

 

July 2, 2013 2:09 am  #814


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

shouldbestudying wrote:

I think the American agent only fell once. Lastrade asks how many times because Sherlock had nutted him and possibly hit him (fractured ribs, punched lung etc ) so he looked like he had fallen multiple times. He was after all just a burgular that fell out of the window.

At the very first time I watched Scandal I had the same thought, but I think I got used to the idea then haha.
The reason I didn't put away the theory that he really falls and lands is exactly because nobody seems to believe it's possible, but we're talking about Sherlock here! Oddly enough I've seen - besides the "miracles" that seldom happen - some things 1. a person healthy/athletic and young has more chance of survival, 2. relaxing and bending the knees help, 3. land on the feet drives a leap, it's a chance for the person to protect the head and land sideway (which "could" explain why he was in a different position). John couldn't see the complete fall and shouldn't see S was manipulating the land. And I still need to think of everything else.
But I'll come back to reality now, ok?


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“The scar had not pained Harry for nineteen years. All was well.” HP and the Deathly Hallows

"Why's it always the hat photograph?"The Reichenbach Fall
 

July 2, 2013 3:38 am  #815


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

ancientsgate wrote:

Michele wrote:

It's without a doubt real alive Sherlock jumping off the building. Whether it's Sherlock on the ground or not I guess is up to interpretation but I have to say any theories that start with a dummy or body I instantly don't believe.

Right. Ben even talked about it in interviews, what it was like to fall 75 feet into a huge air bag. You can clearly see his face as he falls,his arms and legs moving, etc. No dummy.

 

I'd be pretty insulted if they tried to explain the fall with 'oh it was a dummy' even though it clearly wasn't. The writers are too smart for a copout excuse like that. 'Sure you really saw alive Sherlock fall but in reality it was something completely different.' Since they've said all the answers are in the episode I'd be ropable if they changed it on us. Thus all Dummy/Dead Body theories don't hold any water with me.


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July 2, 2013 7:30 am  #816


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

Caroll wrote:

shouldbestudying wrote:

I think the American agent only fell once. Lastrade asks how many times because Sherlock had nutted him and possibly hit him (fractured ribs, punched lung etc ) so he looked like he had fallen multiple times. He was after all just a burgular that fell out of the window.

At the very first time I watched Scandal I had the same thought, but I think I got used to the idea then haha.
The reason I didn't put away the theory that he really falls and lands is exactly because nobody seems to believe it's possible, but we're talking about Sherlock here! Oddly enough I've seen - besides the "miracles" that seldom happen - some things 1. a person healthy/athletic and young has more chance of survival, 2. relaxing and bending the knees help, 3. land on the feet drives a leap, it's a chance for the person to protect the head and land sideway (which "could" explain why he was in a different position). John couldn't see the complete fall and shouldn't see S was manipulating the land. And I still need to think of everything else.
But I'll come back to reality now, ok?

But then why were the paramedics fake? Surely, if that were the case, it would have made more sense to have real paramedics, in case something went wrong
 


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That's the thing about fanfiction, it's always a self-portrait
People want to believe what is easy, rather than what is right.
"One begins to twist facts to suit theories, instead of theories to suit facts"
 

July 2, 2013 4:02 pm  #817


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

The paramedics had to be fake. Real paramedics would never move a body that just fell from that height before checking for brain and spinal cord injuries. You can paralyze someone if you move him when his back has been broken.


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Is the foil of a detective a thief or a magician?

My Theory on the Fall: http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=21539#p21539
 

July 2, 2013 4:28 pm  #818


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

There is a dummy in the flat in a SH style suit behind sh in 221b at the start of the episode.
You can see it all apart from head behind sh when Johns warning about the press turning and bringing ppl down.

Check the cranes and st pauls dome in the skyline on st barts roof when sh is there with Moriarty. Completly different when sh makes the phone call to John, sh is standing somewhere else it is an optical illusion.

Time lapse between .

Many magic tricks rely on confusing the senses , John hears Sherlock is told to look up and then see's what he is set up to see , that's why the angles & positions are important.

The smaller building blocked a lot of st barts from Johns viewpoint ,at most he saw sh jump/fall halfway anyway.

When sh asked John to look at the stars , ? lol what ? Why ?
He was checking out Johns height,angles etc when John was looking at the sky.

Kinda a cheat here but Derren Brown on set , showing the actors / writers the angles and positions of where ppl had to be for the Optical illusion.

The obscuration of the landing site with bus/lorry/etc & the biker knocking down John and the extras/fake paramedics etc for the switch .'

It's just a magic trick. Magic is mostly an illusion ,eyes are slow to compute and easy to fool.

Last edited by lil (July 2, 2013 4:38 pm)

 

July 2, 2013 5:02 pm  #819


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

It could not have been a dummy. No way. Any tricks that Sherlock pulled had to be on ground level where the view was obscured.

Can you imagine Sherlock's plan backfiring if the sniper saw Sherlock launch a dummy off the roof? Sherlock would've thought about that possibility and it would be too risky. He had to jump himself.


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He does love to be dramatic.
Well, thank god you're above all that!
 

July 2, 2013 5:47 pm  #820


Re: Go on then...what are your theories?

John feels for a pulse which, to me, confirms the body is not a dummy.

Also, any trick would have had to fool anyone who could have seen St. Barts from a window or be walking by it on ground level. If anyone saw a dummy being launched, then surely they would've come forward to the press or police or something.


-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Is the foil of a detective a thief or a magician?

My Theory on the Fall: http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=21539#p21539
 

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