BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Go on then...what are your theories?

AndyO. · March 15, 2013 6:06 pm

I am trying to create my own theory how Sherlock survived...
But I don't know what to think... So I think that he jumped on that truck and then landed on the ground. And he was replaced with a fake body prepared by Molly after those paramedics took him away (he needed 'his' dead body to go to the hospital, right?)
I don't know who were those paramedics but I think they were part of the plan.

And I think that making John believe that Sherlock is dead wasn't difficult after he saw Sherlock jump. He was in shock and also got hit by a cyclist (who was part of the plan too). And he took Sherlock's pulse at his right arm instead of the left one (the pulse is weaker there) and it was the arm Sherlock was lying on. (+ that rubber ball and/or maybe some drug to slow down the pulse...)

Somehow it seems too easy to me but it's also quite logical (I hope).

beekeeper · March 27, 2013 3:54 pm

Oh the cyclist yeah, thats interesing. He comes from behind John. I've lost my bearings by this point but I'm not actually sure there is even a road there for him to come from. (fair enough, could be poetic license). He seems to be marking John, cycling slowly and watching him-and then manages to cycle into him and cycle off. That's not an accident. The cyclist also slows, kind of checking John isn't badly hurt, kind of looking back, then off he goes. The cyclist (I think he's male) is also very hard to identify-he has a hat on which covers pretty much all his face-but the bits we see, the quite distinctive nose and the pale skin, look remarkably like Sherlock (the Solitary Cyclist even). But how could he do that?

Also re the chalked rectangle. He falls and then rolls meaning that he falls into the rectangle and rolls out. (see I think this is the Jonathan Creek.trampoline theory myself ;-) )

My theory is that he somehow decelerated his fall, although I don't know how. His injuries, the speed at whcih he hits the ground, not to mention the actual time taken for the fall support this but there's a bit of a problem because he actually doesn't seem to do anything that might slow his fall ;-).

There is an additional issue with all these theories also. They kind of rely on half of Barts hospital being in on Sherlock's plan. Which given his plan was to pretend to fake his own death and Moriaty's henchpeople have spies everywhere as we know...maybe not cool.

(I do LOVE all the speculation here. Internet hive mind at its best :-) )

Last edited by beekeeper (March 27, 2013 3:58 pm)

tardislass · March 29, 2013 11:50 pm

IMO, the show has made it clear that Sherlock and Moriarty are the same. Jim planned his take down of Sherlock, thereby I can't believe when Sherlock made the date with a rooftop he didn't imagine that Jim would try to kill him or himself. I also find it interesting that Sherlock does the whole confession on the rooftop when he's on the phone with John-as if he's worried someone's listening in. Sherlock has to know that John won't believe him. Hmm. Try as I might I really think Mycroft had to have helped fake the death. I always thought it was strange that Sherlock and Mycroft never spoke to one another in this episode. Yes they allegedly had a tiff but even in Hounds, Sherlock swallows his pride and calls his brother. Yet both brothers decline to see one another.

The brothers' behavoir just seemed a little off and I wouldn't be surprised if it was so Mycroft could help behind the scenes.

beekeeper · March 30, 2013 12:22 pm

Just noticed that one of the fake doctors is wearing a Mycroft ring-like Mycroft and Anthea wear, right hand. So I think Mycroft is clearly in on it.

How has the show made clear that Sherlock and Moriaty are the same? I think thats a really interesting idea and one that crops up a lot in Holmesian fanfic, like The Last Sherlock Holmes story or the Jeremy Brett/Edward Hardwicke play. But, I dunno, unless its all Baskerville drugs they do look like two separate people to me. Its interesting! Elaborate!

myrarobles · April 22, 2013 1:03 pm

i think Jim Moriarty never existed in the first place, Richard Brook is a genius and he got tired of mingling with "ordinary people" so he created Jim Moriarty.

SilverMoonDragonB · May 21, 2013 1:00 pm

ancientsgate wrote:
besleybean wrote:
I am on record as saying if we didn't get a hug between the boys this time...well, I dunno what I will do. I may just have to put up with it, tho!
Agreed, on both counts. Sigh.

I'm agreed also...damn I want to see a hug!
As for my theories...well...I've been going over and over The Reichenbach Fall in my head, rewatching Sherlocks "suicide" (admittedly not a wise movie, I know he's alive and all, but I dehydrated myself from crying ) and there are just so many things in the episode that could indicate a part of Sherlocks plan...that I am convinced Moffat and Gatiss put some things in there that will have no bearing on it whatsoever just to mess with us and keep us guessing! Which, though slightly annoying, is interesting and kind of a good thing I guess...it wouldn't be as good if it were easy to guess. I figure it'll be something either so simple or incredibly complicated, obviously there are things that happened or were there that we didn't see and though there are hints, I doubt it's possible to figure out exactly how Sherlock pulled it off. Still, it is fun to guess. I'm thinking Molly and Mycroft have to be in on it somehow, Molly for obvious reasons (being a Doctor) and given Mycrofts position in the government...who better to get help from to "disappear" for a while? I'm not 100% convinced of that though, Sherlock is incredibly smart to say the least, he probably could've figured out something like without his brothers assisstance, maybe. Here are just a couple things I am pretty much sure of;

Sherlock jumped off that building, I'd be very surprised if he didn't...where he actually landed, I have no idea and if he did land, he must've landed on or in something.
Molly is involved in some way.
The bicycle guy knocked John out of the way to prevent him from seeing something.
The truck/bus thing was blocking the view of either John or the Sniper, or both from seeing something.
The people hanging around the area at the time of his jump are also involved in some way.

I know, those theories are nothing new...but that's all I've got xD, it is a pickle to say the least. I can't wait to see how he did it, other than the Sherlock and John reunion, it is the scene I am most looking forward to seeing. I'm also interested in finding out how Sherlock discovered Moriarty's plan, or at least when he suspected it.

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 5:47 am

There's one thing I'm pretty sure of. It might not be much, but still.

Sherlock's last phone call to John was spontaneous and Sherlock did not plan this.

I think if we go on theorising we need to clarify if we think that Sherlock did include the death of Moriarty into his plans or if he did not. I have got the impression that things weren't going as Sherlock originally wanted them to go. He needed to improvise.
Here are a few questions I hope I will get an answer to in the upcoming series.

1. Sherlock could not know that Moriarty would force him to commit suicide. Why had he planned it then at all?
Seriously, this has bugged me the whole time.
2. Sherlock must have assumed that Moriarty would watch him falling. That being said, Sherlock probably created his fake death in a way one would not notice from the roof. How?
3. Either that or Sherlock knew that Moriarty had to disappear, which would put another complexion on the matter. But Sherlock seemed to be honestly shocked when Moriarty shot himself. Could it be that Sherlock had needed him for something? Or was he just seriously convinced that Moriarty would cancel the order?
4. Why does Moriarty owe him a fall? That makes absolutely no sense to me. How did he get it at all? He could not know at this point that Sherlock was going to jump off a roof, could he?
5. What has Sherlock originally planned? What was the point in meeting Moriarty on the roof?

Regarding the phone call... I think Sherlock did not plan to jump with John watching. His despair was real and so were his tears. It's even more heart-breaking, if you ask me.

Now go on with your theories. Just remember: It is a mistake to theorise without all the facts.

besleybean · May 24, 2013 6:02 am

I confess I'm still not clear on all of this...
Can I kind of take a step back first?
I was pondering the Mycroft-John scene at the Diogenes.
What is the point of that scene?
To give Sherlock time to do something, to prepare John for what was happrning or WAS it in fact Mycroft using John to desperately get a message through to Sherlock that the Moriarty threat was both real and imminent,.
Or, was it Mycroft's way of signalling 'game on' to Sherlock?
The other thing is. There seems to be a genuine moment of cogniscience to Sherlock, outside Kirtty's flat.
He certianly knows Moriarty is gonna smear his name and blame him for the crimes etc...but ' the one last thing he needs to do'...
Could just refer to a public confession from Sherlock.
But no. Sherlock immediately seeks Molly out and we assume to ask for her help to set up the fake death.
So Sherlock must know he might die. Whether or not he gets that it's a forced suicide? But then, that would fit into an admission of being a fake.
I genuinely do not think he knows Moriarty will kill himself.

Last edited by besleybean (May 24, 2013 6:04 am)

sherlockian111 · May 24, 2013 6:29 am

with the "there's only one thing he needs to do and that's to-", I think Sherlock realised that if people delve in a little deeper into the matter, they would discover that Sherlock is in fact real, and so Sherlock must have realised that Moriaty would need him to die almost immediately, and preferable die in disgrace, so people wouldn't delve any further into the matter. And what better way to die in disgrace then to 'appear' to commit suicide, right after his so-called 'secret' is exposed? However, if Sherlock died then there would be nobody interesting for Moriaty to watch dance, so I think Moriaty was already planning on committing suicide.

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 6:44 am

However, if I was Sherlock and I would realise that Moriarty would have me to commit suicide, then the last thing I would do is jumping off a roof and give Moriarty what he had longed for.

sherlockian111 · May 24, 2013 6:49 am

yeah, but it was the ideal solution to Sherlock's situation though. Faking his death gives him a much better chance to track down all of Moriaty's henchmen or whatever, and it also gives him the chance to prove that he isn't a fake. Also, I don't think Sherlock particularly liked being famous, so faking his death would give hima chance to 'disappear'.

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 6:55 am

I would approve. Maybe it was just the right time for him to 'die', or whatever, call it disappear.
Though, he must have known that he would become even more famous after returning. If it was Sherlock's logic to disappear because he was getting too famous, then there's also a lack of logic.

sherlockian111 · May 24, 2013 6:58 am

I suppose, but then, he would have waited a while before coming back, and by the time he did, no-one would remember that detective who turned out to be a nutter. and it's not as if he's going to publicly announce himself to the world when he comes back. It all makes sense in my head, it's just hard to explain

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 7:17 am

sherlockian111 wrote:
It all makes sense in my head, it's just hard to explain

I know that.
But I think I'm getting your point.

Davina · May 24, 2013 7:27 am

(Resisting comment that he may just have read the original books ) Here we have a literal fall (from the roof of St. Barts and a metaphorical fall from grace (via the newspaper exposé).

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 7:32 am

Davina wrote:
(Resisting comment that he may just have read the original books ) Here we have a literal fall (from the roof of St. Barts and a metaphorical fall from grace (via the newspaper exposé).

That's what my father just pointed out. I explained to him that Sherlock and Moriarty do not know the canon. Father: But the producers do! Me: Yeah, dad, but that's a different matter.

anjaH_alias · May 24, 2013 1:04 pm

Mary Me wrote:
There's one thing I'm pretty sure of. It might not be much, but still.

Sherlock's last phone call to John was spontaneous and Sherlock did not plan this.

I think if we go on theorising we need to clarify if we think that Sherlock did include the death of Moriarty into his plans or if he did not. I have got the impression that things weren't going as Sherlock originally wanted them to go. He needed to improvise.
Here are a few questions I hope I will get an answer to in the upcoming series.

1. Sherlock could not know that Moriarty would force him to commit suicide. Why had he planned it then at all?
Seriously, this has bugged me the whole time.

In general I think everything on the rooftop was a mixture of planning and improvising - Sherlock could not really foresee what´s going to happen in every detail. But the more happened during TRF, the more he got the picture and the more he could plan in advance. And you should not forget that Moriarty threatened him with death since TGG, something like "one day I will kill you, but before I´ll watch you dance". He could deduce that Moriarty wants him dead in the end. Also because, as somebody said, his death would be more convincing of him being a fraud. And it gives him the best opportunity (along canon) to destroy Moriarty´s spider web out of the dark.

Mary Me wrote:
2. Sherlock must have assumed that Moriarty would watch him falling. That being said, Sherlock probably created his fake death in a way one would not notice from the roof. How?

I don´t have any idea to this either - maybe a part of his plan he knew he had to improvise.

Mary Me wrote:
3. Either that or Sherlock knew that Moriarty had to disappear, which would put another complexion on the matter. But Sherlock seemed to be honestly shocked when Moriarty shot himself. Could it be that Sherlock had needed him for something? Or was he just seriously convinced that Moriarty would cancel the order?

I think he was really trying to make him cancel the order.

Mary Me wrote:
4. Why does Moriarty owe him a fall? That makes absolutely no sense to me. How did he get it at all? He could not know at this point that Sherlock was going to jump off a roof, could he?

Because Sherlock crossed his plans several times? Because he was obsessed with him since a long time? In Moriarty might be a side, which is not to be explained rationally. Or we don´t know something out of there past right now. Moriarty was glad that Sherlock chose a high building, and he had enough to pressure him to jump finally, don´t you think?

Mary Me wrote:
5. What has Sherlock originally planned? What was the point in meeting Moriarty on the roof?

Again, I think he couldn´t plan and foresee everything, but I am sure that he knew that Moriarty wanted his death at the end. Here, on St. Bart´s rooftop, he had advantages (like Molly Hooper, the location itself etc.), so it was a kind of homerun for him. He could plan better, wanted to be one step ahead of Moriarty. What better place he could have chosen?

Mary Me wrote:
Regarding the phone call... I think Sherlock did not plan to jump with John watching. His despair was real and so were his tears. It's even more heart-breaking, if you ask me.

I absolutely agree with you. He could not know when exactly John came back, but it made his suicide even more convincing (dying in the arms of his best friend).

besleybean · May 24, 2013 3:32 pm

Ern...Sherlock has to ' commit suicide', to save his friends.

Mary Me · May 24, 2013 5:43 pm

besleybean wrote:
Ern...Sherlock has to ' commit suicide', to save his friends.

Yeah, but he didn't know that his friends were in potential danger before he had the chat with Moriarty on the roof.

Schmiezi · May 24, 2013 6:05 pm

Mary Me wrote:
besleybean wrote:
Ern...Sherlock has to ' commit suicide', to save his friends.
Yeah, but he didn't know that his friends were in potential danger before he had the chat with Moriarty on the roof.

Are you sure? I think it's safe to say that Sherlock has considered everything Moriarty could possibly use against him long before meeting him on the rooftop. He must have realised that his few friends were high on top of that list.