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September 26, 2012 7:23 am  #101


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

@NW16XE: I love that childishness, too. I think Mycroft would like to have a grown-up relationship, but sometimes he can't help himself either.


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September 26, 2012 11:37 am  #102


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Ivy wrote:

@NW16XE: I love that childishness, too. I think Mycroft would like to have a grown-up relationship, but sometimes he can't help himself either.

Exactly! They are both so controllled and able to rise above it all-- except with each other.


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September 26, 2012 11:41 am  #103


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

'Too much history'.


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September 26, 2012 12:49 pm  #104


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Hello !
I love Mycroft Holmes and his little brother and I was very surprised when i saw the two Holmes. They are more different than the Holmes of ACD. And they look like Brothers of "the world"...Like my brother and me....Yes I have a little brother : I am Mycroft and he is Sherlock...Hum...
It is a relationship very interresting


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November 3, 2012 1:17 am  #105


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Sherlock Holmes wrote:

Put it this way...if Mycroft had been the one about to get a sniper bullet, Sherlock still would have jumped off that roof!

I actually wonder if that's true. I'm not sure their animosity is just for show. When Mycroft says he worries about Sherlock constantly, his tone strikes me as more sly then sincere. And why would he tell Moriarty all about Sherlock's personal business? That's a serious betrayal, if you ask me. I mean, when Moriarty threatened Sherlock's "friends" on the roof Mycroft was not on the list. I'm not saying there's no familial bind or mutual understanding, but I think it has a limit.

The one time I heard someone ask Moffitt about their relationship, he said he felt the details of why they didn't get along weren't important and that he had no intention of exploring it on the show, which totally bummed me out as I was curious to know the details of their lives as children.


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November 3, 2012 1:23 pm  #106


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Telling Moriarty all about Sherlock's personal business is only a serious betrayal if you don't follow the premise that Sherlock and Mycroft are colluding to ensnare Moriarty.

Last edited by Davina (November 3, 2012 1:23 pm)


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Don't make people into heroes John. Heroes don't exist and if they did I wouldn't be one of them.
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November 3, 2012 6:58 pm  #107


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Davina wrote:

Telling Moriarty all about Sherlock's personal business is only a serious betrayal if you don't follow the premise that Sherlock and Mycroft are colluding to ensnare Moriarty.

I'll grant you that's a different perspective I hadn't thought of. Not sure I buy it though.  I suppose we'll find that out come next series though. 


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This is a cash and carry world. You pay as you go. Sometimes it's a little. Mostly it's a lot. Sometimes it's all you have.
 

January 18, 2013 11:34 pm  #108


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

The other day I met a group of holmesians and they had a theory about what happened in Mycroft and Sherlock's childhood, and why Mycroft is watching over Sherlock and why he's anxious about him. They think that Sherlock has killed in the past, and that Mycroft is looking after him to make sure it doesn't happen again. They say that maybe Sherlock killed their father because he was abusing their mother, and that that's at the root of the brothers' strange relationship and Sherlock's weirdness. A bit far-fetched, eh?

For me I prefer that they don't explain and spell out everything plainly in the show, to make it interesting the history of Mycroft and Sherlock has to retain some mystery, and some of the allusions they make are hilarious, like when Mycroft says he'll be mother to pour the tea and Sherlock says that sums up a whole childhood.

 

January 19, 2013 8:48 am  #109


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

This reminds me of the novel "The Seven-Percent Solution" in which Sherlock's mother and her lover are killed by Sherlock's father. A very good pastiche by the way which sends Sherlock to Vienna to be treated by Sigmund Freud. http://images.boardhost.com/emoticons/smile.png


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

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January 19, 2013 6:16 pm  #110


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

SusiGo wrote:

This reminds me of the novel "The Seven-Percent Solution" in which Sherlock's mother and her lover are killed by Sherlock's father. A very good pastiche by the way which sends Sherlock to Vienna to be treated by Sigmund Freud. http://images.boardhost.com/emoticons/smile.png

 
Hoho, that sounds very interesting, I'll read it as soon as I finish re-reading the canon, or maybe in parallel.

 

January 20, 2013 10:25 am  #111


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft


Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.   Independent OSAJ Affiliate

... but there may be some new players now. It’s okay. The East Wind takes us all in the end.
 

January 21, 2013 5:07 pm  #112


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Aurora wrote:

kazza474 wrote:

I sometimes wish Benedict wasn't the star of this show,

But are "all the girls" going wild about Sherlock because of Benedict, or are they going wild about Benedict because of Sherlock?

I can answer that! I was in love with Sherlock the first time I read Hound of Baskervilles when I was 13 (or 14?) anyway, that's the kind of man I always wanted...someone who could meet me on an intellectual level. I married my husband of 15 years not only because I was attracted to him but because he came with a crap load of BOOKS! We can discuss characters and plots, and he seems to have a bit of understanding in the way the human mind works. He is no student of philosophy or psychology as I have been and continue to be, but it nice to be able to see the world through someone else's eyes. 

I am not saying that a physical relationship isn't important (it very well IS!) but for a certain percent of the world wide population, we need MORE. A body is just a body, but a MIND...now that is something amazing!

 


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January 21, 2013 5:16 pm  #113


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Also-I think the reason the whole sibling rivalry association is so fascinating is that, as humans, we have been obsessed with it for a very long time. Just look at how mythology and theology have influenced modern fantasy literature/movies: Loki-Thor (even though in the myths Loki is only referred to as "raised like a brother", step-siblings count, too?) Cain-Able, Caramon-Raistlin (am I too far out of my depths here?), hell even Ron and Ginny! It's fun and it's fascinating to watch..and anyone with even just one sibling can attest to. It's something we all deeply understand and can identify with, at least in my opinion. A sibling is someone who is in the same boat as you and you can all (or both) agree on how nuts your parents really are, someone who knows you (...nicked all his Smurfs and Action Man...really wanted to be a Pirate)...but can drive you up the freakin wall. But at the end of the day, it's just the two of you alone and you barely even have to talk to each other.

Not that it matters, but something pretty horrible happened to me about 16 years ago. My little brother was there after the fact when I was picking myself back up. He made me the best bowl of chicken-noodle soup I've ever had in my life. When I watched the scene with Mycroft and Sherlock and the cigarette, it reminded me of that chicken soup. I know that sounds silly and over-romanticized, but between those two, nothing is done without meaning. Not sentiment--but meaning. I think it's the only way they can communicate but that cigarette meant something between the two of them.

(Obsessions? Compulsions? A nod to a past no longer in existence? Dunno...been thinking way too much this morning )


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February 3, 2013 6:46 am  #114


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

I thought Sherlock had absentee parents. It seemed like Mycroft was both older brother & quasi-father, which I think would cause Sherlock to conflate the I-hate-dad relationship with the I-hate-brother relationship together so that it's a I-loath-brother/father relationship. It would explain why Mycroft's so good at running the country if he first had to run a household & being of the genius Holmes DNA, he found no trouble applying that to "the British government, or the British secret service or the CIA on a freelance basis".

Last edited by saturnR (February 3, 2013 6:46 am)

 

February 3, 2013 1:09 pm  #115


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

I agree with those who think that Mycroft's character has somewhat departed from canon.

Sure, Mycroft's does not appear heavily in the canon, but he is described enough in a couple of sentences that demonstrate that the show departs from such characterization.

Sherlock admits that Mycroft is in many ways the superior brainpower, but he's just too lazy and indifferent to details to follow through.  He'd much rather be lazy and wrong than make the effort to be right, quite the opposite from Sherlock. 

I'm certain the writers know this, and they figure that the TV character is a much more interesting character.  A lazy, indifferent Mycroft would severely limit the scope of Sherlock's available government crises to solve. 

My only nitpick is that Mycroft just doesn't seem close to Sherlock's brainpower in the BBC series.  Things like talking about the Bond Air over the phone while Sherlock is around, or being rebuffed by Irene Adler in every attempt to achieve leverage over her phone.  He certainly isn't lazy or indifferent in these instances, he just simply lacks Sherlock's forward-thinking, which I see as a minor, but not bothersome, nitpick.


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February 3, 2013 2:24 pm  #116


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

BlinkULDHC wrote:

I agree with those who think that Mycroft's character has somewhat departed from canon.

Sure, Mycroft's does not appear heavily in the canon, but he is described enough in a couple of sentences that demonstrate that the show departs from such characterization.

Sherlock admits that Mycroft is in many ways the superior brainpower, but he's just too lazy and indifferent to details to follow through.  He'd much rather be lazy and wrong than make the effort to be right, quite the opposite from Sherlock. 

I'm certain the writers know this, and they figure that the TV character is a much more interesting character.  A lazy, indifferent Mycroft would severely limit the scope of Sherlock's available government crises to solve. 

My only nitpick is that Mycroft just doesn't seem close to Sherlock's brainpower in the BBC series.  Things like talking about the Bond Air over the phone while Sherlock is around, or being rebuffed by Irene Adler in every attempt to achieve leverage over her phone.  He certainly isn't lazy or indifferent in these instances, he just simply lacks Sherlock's forward-thinking, which I see as a minor, but not bothersome, nitpick.

Mycroft still doesn't like to do the footwork, and he mentions he the very first episode that he'd rather Sherlock didn't, either.  Most of the antagonism between the brothers actually comes from Mycroft trying to protect his little brother and Sherlock resenting it.

I shouldn't think he'd see any reason to be secretive about Bond around Sherlock - it's not like Sherlock is going to announce it to the whole world.  Both of them are played by Moriarty and Irene - Sherlock only gains leverage with her in the end because he is finally able to deduce the phone code.

There is a significant scene earlier in ASiB, when Sherlock and Mycroft have a short exchange about the case Sherlock's been 'working' (or rather, John has been working):

- What, the hiker and the backfire? I glanced at the police report. Bit obvious, surely?
- Transparent.

In other words, Mycroft has solved the case from the police report alone.  His character has suffered somewhat from TRH, but I think it'll play out differently when we get the whole story.  I very much doubt he was any more fooled by the key than Sherlock was, and given his overprotectiveness, I don't see him throwing Sherlock under the bus to get information from Moriarty.  If he did give Moriarty information, he did so with Sherlock's consent.  (And it's possible that it was Sherlock's plan and not one Mycroft particularly liked.)
 


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Sherlock: And you invaded Afghanistan.
John: That wasn't *just* me.
 

March 8, 2013 1:45 pm  #117


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

I see many interesting theories about Sherlock's and Mycroft's relationship here =D But to be honest I don't think their relationship is so weird and/or mysterious. They remind me of me and my sister a lot.


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March 8, 2013 6:46 pm  #118


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

Having a younger sibling myself, I can understand their relationship quite well. My brother drives me up the wall and there is a constant bickering between us. People think we really don't like each other, but the truth is, I would die for him any day. Even if, most of the time I feel like killing him myself. And I know he'd do the same. I'm not a very emotional person.  I don't display affection, not openly. I can't and I don't like it. I don't hug or kiss people and I am very critical. I seem harsh and cold and uncaring.

Anyway, I can see where Mycroft and Sherlock are coming from. I understand their bond. Except they're two of me. My brother is more affectionate, more normal, so Mycroft and Sherlock share a bond like I'd share with someone else like me. It's a very powerful one, even if people can't see it. Even if it's burried deeper than most can dig, it's there and it's real and it's forever.

Last edited by Sparrow (March 8, 2013 6:48 pm)


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March 29, 2013 3:10 pm  #119


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

As others have said, I do think they behave as normal brothers. My favorite scenes between them are in the scenes at Baker Street. The scene in the Great Game where Mycroft tries to give Sherlock the file and blocked by Sherlock's violin bow is perfect. Mycroft just sticks his tongue in his cheek and walks to John. And in the Adler case, when Sherlock tells Mycroft to give his love to the Queen then starts playing God Save the Queen, Mycroft just rolls his eyes and walks out. I think they both know what needles the other as most sibling do. 

 

 

March 29, 2013 6:41 pm  #120


Re: Sherlock's relationship with Mycroft

I think my favourite scene in the whole entire show has to be them bickering in Buckingham palace. Because honestly, anyone with a sibling can recognise that one, the fact that however much of a professional face you can put on for others your siblings can still reduce you to your nine year old self at the drop of a hat.

And Mycroft is literally the only person who Sherlock cannot ever outsmart. Ever. Unless I'm mistaken there is not one single instance (in canon or on the show) where Sherlock actually gets the upper hand. When Irene says something like "not you junior, you're done,", that just about sums it up.

Last edited by beekeeper (March 29, 2013 6:45 pm)


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Sherlock Holmes "The question is, has she been working on something deadlier than a rabbit?"
John Watson : "To be fair, that is quite a wide field"

The Hounds of Baskerville
 

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