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October 5, 2012 3:47 am  #21


Re: Looking Sad

I still say we get one glimpse of Sherlock looking serious/concerned/sad (perhaps for him) when he and John are getting ready to leave for court and Sherlock looks at John in the mirror.  He could have looked at himself to adjust his shirt collar or something, but his gaze was on John.  The director put that there for a reason. Why? The first time I saw it I remember thinking, "Wow - that's interesting......"

I also thought there was one moment in the lab when John walks in front of Sherlock at his microscope and Sherlock looks up at him briefly as he passes by.  That's when I think Molly says her lines about looking sad.  (Not sure, I'd have to go back and watch that bit again).  But don't forget, Molly has a massive crush on Sherlock and watches him intently when he's in the lab.  I think she would be very good at reading any subtle changes in Sherlock's expressions or gestures. Example:  "Dear Diary, today Sherlock wore his purple shirt with the cuffs turned down - not like yesterday when he had them rolled up. And I think he washed his hair last night because that one curl I especially like wouldn't behave.  And here's the best part!  His mouth twitched on the left side when I accidently stepped on his foot. He's never done that before.  I think he likes me!" 

I think she notices everything.


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And I said "dangerous" and here you are.

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October 5, 2012 4:04 am  #22


Re: Looking Sad

KeepersPrice wrote:

I still say we get one glimpse of Sherlock looking serious/concerned/sad (perhaps for him) when he and John are getting ready to leave for court and Sherlock looks at John in the mirror.  He could have looked at himself to adjust his shirt collar or something, but his gaze was on John.  The director put that there for a reason. Why? The first time I saw it I remember thinking, "Wow - that's interesting......"

The one second Sherlock being very serious is just before leaving Baker Street behind the front door when John asks him: "Ready?" - "Yes.".This "yes" gets me every time and gives me the desire to hug him.


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John: "Have you spoken to Mycroft, Molly, uh, anyone?"
Mrs Hudson: "They don’t matter. You do."


I BELIEVE IN SERIES 5!




                                                                                                                  
 

October 5, 2012 11:32 am  #23


Re: Looking Sad

tobeornot221b wrote:

The one second Sherlock being very serious is just before leaving Baker Street behind the front door when John asks him: "Ready?" - "Yes.".This "yes" gets me every time and gives me the desire to hug him.

One of my fave moments in all 6 episodes is this one. The whole thing-- the two of them in the sitting room getting ready, trotting down the stairs, pausing inside the door, pushing through the crowd to get to the cop car, and even inside the car, when John lectures Sherlock to "remember...."  And the music playing around all of that is delicious as well. Mmmm, thinking about this makes me want to get my DVDs out. Again.

 

October 6, 2012 7:46 pm  #24


Re: Looking Sad

The door shot is fab.  But the one BEFORE that, by the mirror...PHWOAR!


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October 6, 2012 10:07 pm  #25


Re: Looking Sad

besleybean wrote:

The door shot is fab.  But the one BEFORE that, by the mirror...PHWOAR!

God, I love TRF. All of it.

 

October 6, 2012 10:23 pm  #26


Re: Looking Sad

Me too!


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October 11, 2012 6:11 pm  #27


Re: Looking Sad

So I don't have a fully formed theory about this yet, but I've started to think that Sherlock's OOC moment is telling Molly she's right. When has Sherlock ever told anyone their deduction was right? The scene always felt slightly more patronizing to me than sentimental. He wants something from her, so he tells her she was correct and that she does matter. If she does matter, even if he didn't consciously realize it, he would have been keeping up appearances around her too. Part of me is starting to think he was hiding something else from John and he realized that Molly's misreading of it could be useful to him. Add to this the sense that the fall was in some ways stage managed for John's "benefit" and I'm heading into curious territory here. I'm starting to wonder if the "look" was really suspicion. That some part of this is a test for John.

Sorry to going dropping this in here... carry on

 

October 11, 2012 6:22 pm  #28


Re: Looking Sad

I don't think Sherlock means it as a test for John, but it's going to be regardless.


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October 16, 2012 12:55 am  #29


Re: Looking Sad

Test was probably too strong a word but accuracy suffers when I eat lunch late There is still something about that exchange with Molly that doesn't sit right with me. At the moment I'm considering that when she ask what he needs, Sherlock doesn't reply "you" but rather "U"...

 

October 16, 2012 6:04 am  #30


Re: Looking Sad

Ooh.
But I'm not sure.
I think Sherlock is simply going to ask for her help.


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October 16, 2012 8:19 am  #31


Re: Looking Sad

ancientsgate wrote:

tobeornot221b wrote:

The one second Sherlock being very serious is just before leaving Baker Street behind the front door when John asks him: "Ready?" - "Yes.".This "yes" gets me every time and gives me the desire to hug him.

One of my fave moments in all 6 episodes is this one. The whole thing-- the two of them in the sitting room getting ready, trotting down the stairs, pausing inside the door, pushing through the crowd to get to the cop car, and even inside the car, when John lectures Sherlock to "remember...."  And the music playing around all of that is delicious as well. Mmmm, thinking about this makes me want to get my DVDs out. Again.

"Sinnerman" is the perfect song for this scenes, gets me every time.


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Normal is not something to aspire to, it's something to get away from!


 
 

October 17, 2012 4:08 am  #32


Re: Looking Sad

She didn't say "you are sad". She said that "you look sad," which I think shows a fundamental difference. She's trying to make clumsy conversation with him in a way that she has experience in: the death of her father.

I have a theory that this scene is where her crush on Sherlock ends. She tries to refuse to skip lunch and fails--this isn't the end of her naivety and vulnerability by any means--but I see the playful flattery and "pay attention to me" attitude somewhat toned down. The fact that she's going to lunch with a guy and wasn't initially very willing to blow him off was telling to me. I think that even if her attraction hasn't relinquished it has loosened its grip. You can also see this where she almost reflexively asks him if he wants something for lunch and then follows it up by saying "No, nevermind, I know that you don't." This feels less like she's trying to lure him into some kind of relationship and more like casual acceptance of the fact that, yes, Sherlock is very different from the people she's accustomed to, and he's probably never going to flirt back except when he wants something.

I think this whole speech was her clumsy way of trying to tell him that she wants to be his friend. Not his girlfriend, just his friend, and that she's "here for him" as the phrase goes.

It's quite possible that I think far too highly of Molly in that regard. One thing that definitely doesn't mesh is that Sherlock does turn up the flattery when he's trying to convince her to help him with...whatever in the end of the episode. If he'd seen the same he wouldn't have done so, he simply would have asked.


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October 17, 2012 6:07 am  #33


Re: Looking Sad

Wow, so much here and it's so complicated, plus we also have to consider what the Sherlock creators have said.
So ok, here is my own clumsy attempt at an assessment of the situation and I'll probably forget about /leave things out...
Sherlock is The Rock, The Island and an island who feels no pain...and he's always been the cleverest in the room and thrived on the excitement of The Game.
But he's gradually being humanised...
I think, as Sherlock acknowledges to Molly himself, he's always trusted her as a colleague.
He knows matters are coming to a head with The Criminal Mastermind and he realises he cannot completely deal with this alone.
Molly has been besotted with Sherlock, but she now accepts he(for whatever reason) is never going to reciprocate.
But Molly still cares about and wants to help Sherlock.  I also think she has a great sense of his emotions.moods etc and even realises he has difficulty expressing his needs.
Irene is the only woman who has ever challenged Sherlock emotionally.  But he now realises that he could still have a 'friendship' of sorts, with a female.
This last bit is the woolly part, where words are failing me...
I just think Sherlock, with his back against the wall and options running out, realises that there is a trustworthy person there who will go that extra mile to help him.
I think, because this is Sherlock, he finds it hard to understand that altho Molly knows he's not interested in her- she still is prepared to help him.
I also, incidentally, think he is genuinely staggered at her accurate ' reading' of him...
But he does point out to her that he's not everything he has seemed and he is trying in HIS clumsy way to say ' thank you for the offer of help and yes I do both need and appreciate it,.'


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October 17, 2012 6:20 am  #34


Re: Looking Sad

besleybean wrote:

I also, incidentally, think he is genuinely staggered at her accurate ' reading' of him...

Molly is the exact opposite of Kitty Riley who claims to be smart and trustworthy - but isn't.


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John: "Have you spoken to Mycroft, Molly, uh, anyone?"
Mrs Hudson: "They don’t matter. You do."


I BELIEVE IN SERIES 5!




                                                                                                                  
 

October 17, 2012 6:21 am  #35


Re: Looking Sad

Good point.


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October 17, 2012 7:04 pm  #36


Re: Looking Sad

Molly's assertion that she knows that Sherlock does not really want anything for lunch, even though he has opened his mouth suggesting that (in order to make amends) he will ask for something to eat, shows that she does understand him well. Sherlock does not eat when he is on a case, she knows that. That is established in the series and the canon.


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Don't make people into heroes John. Heroes don't exist and if they did I wouldn't be one of them.
 

October 17, 2012 7:08 pm  #37


Re: Looking Sad

Thanks Davina, that was something I meant to coement on and forgot!


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November 20, 2012 5:37 pm  #38


Re: Looking Sad

KeepersPrice wrote:

We see Sherlock look at John in the mirror when they are getting ready to leave for the Moriarty trial and we see a quiet, sad expression on his face.  He "knows" even then.  This moment is "reflected" back later by Molly's comment.

That´s exactly what I think. The whole beginning is somehow sad (and especially the trial preparations and also the drive to the court). It´s all missing the fun and easiness cases have normally to Sherlock ("I am on fire", "the game is on", "I don´t want to miss this for the world" and so on and so on.....). He is definetely sad and highly concentrated from the beginning on. Which again convinces me that everything what happens in the beginning is already belonging to a plan of Sherlock - to elicit Moriarty our of his web.

 

November 20, 2012 5:40 pm  #39


Re: Looking Sad

I'm still not convinced on this...Sherlock knew Moriarty would come after him and he was ready for him.


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November 20, 2012 7:12 pm  #40


Re: Looking Sad

I have to watch this  a g a i n   


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