BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Mrs Hudson "Dying"

Sherlock Holmes · March 19, 2012 7:54 am

In our topic comparing Sherlock eps to the original canon we've just been comparing the phone call John receives to say that Mrs Hudson is dying and the note Watson receives in Final Problem to say there's a dying woman who's been asking for an English doctor. In both cases the note has been a fake (as in no one is dying), and in both cases it was designed purely to get John away from the scene.

Later on in Empty House, Holmes says that he knew the note was a fake but he allowed Watson to go anyway because he knew a confrontation was going to occur. This to me indicates that it was Moriarty who arranged the note and not Holmes himself...

What I was wondering was, with regards to the Mrs Hudson is dying phone call - do you think it's the same case? I mean, Sherlock obviously knows that the phone call isn't for real, as he shows no concern for Mrs Hudson's life or even any real surprise at the call.

But was it Moriarty that arranged the phone call or Sherlock??

kazza474 · March 19, 2012 8:50 am

Good point.
I always assumed that Sherlock made a phone call while John was sleeping.
And as I have said, I forgot about the comparison to the original canon.
It would have been both advantageous to Moriarty to get John out of the way (Sherlock is always more vulnerable without John) and would have been a signal to Sherlock that Moriarty was setting a plan in motion.
Although, Sherlock didn't look that surprised at the call.
Something more to ponder I guess. Just when you think you have pondered enough... *sigh*.

And if Moftiss has been alerted to this site & reading this......... "Stop it ! Stop it NOW!!!!!!"

sherlocked · March 19, 2012 9:12 am

I've done a lot of reading and pondering over the weekend. A lot of people assume, that M arranged the call in order to use John as a count down clock, but that jarrs with a lot of details: S being completely unconcerned about Mrs.H is the strongest one. But S also wanted John as the witness of his fall. That only works with John being at a special location and a more or less computable time frame on the street. So he had to get him out of the house for a certain amount of time. So, IMHO S arranged the call.

Sherlock Holmes · March 19, 2012 9:19 am

And I suppose Sherlock must have known that when John realised Mrs Hudson was perfectly OK he would know the phone call was a set up and that something odd was going on and his instinct would be to get straight back to the hospital to warn/help Sherlock, by which time Sherlock knew he would be on the rooftop ready to go.

But in order to do that, Sherlock would also have needed to know that Moriarty was close by. I mean, didn't he text him right after John left, and then receive a reply back fairly soon? He must have known somehow that Moriarty was already in the vicinity. Perhaps he knew he was being followed on his way to the hospital.

kazza474 · March 19, 2012 10:10 am

No, straight after John left to go to Mrs Hudson, Sherlock gets the message " I'm waiting".
It was earlier on, before John's 'nap' etc that Sherlock sends the message to meet him on the rooftop; when they first meet up in the lab. Remember Sherlock was already there bouncing his ball, John walks in. They discuss how the key code must be at the flat; They both do a little finger tapping & then Sherlock gets the 'lightbulb' look. He turns away to send a text to Moriarty.
Then they do the 'nap ' .. etc etc.

(Don't worry, I just played that part tp check it all again, lol.)

Sherlock Holmes · March 19, 2012 10:48 am

Right, yes I remember now. So we might also assume that whilst John was napping Sherlock arranged the Mrs Hudson thing, knowing that Moriarty wouldn't be able to resist his invitation to "come and play" and would be on his way to St Barts.

sherlocked · March 19, 2012 12:53 pm

Mrs. Hudson being ok was the whole point in sending John off to check on her. This way his reactions and from which direction he would arrive at the hospital, were perfectly computable for Sherlock, as well as the rough time frame.
Also, Moriarty realized correctly, that Sherlock has a heart after all for his friends. In fact, his whole plan was based on that fact. If he had arranged the call, John rushing off alone wouldn't have been certain at all.
It's interesting, though, to speculate, if M anticipated S's move to get J out of the way for a while. After all, the sniper, who was assigned to John, had to watch his movements. Interestingly, his arrival and preparation of the gun is shown AFTER M has committed suicide.

Sherlock Holmes · March 19, 2012 12:59 pm

Oh yeah, that's another aspect which tells me Sherlock must have arranged it. The sniper was waiting for John at the hospital. If Moriarty had arranged the call he might have had a sniper waiting at 221B instead. And yes you're right, how could Moriarty predict that Sherlock wouldn't go to see Mrs H too? Unless he'd already guessed that Sherlock would know it was a fake...

Irene Adler · March 19, 2012 6:14 pm

M had already a man in 221b, the one who was with Mrs. Hudson. Maybe he could have shot both John and Mrs. H. The one we see at the hospital probably was following John because he was the most likely to be on the move. Lestrade is at his office and Mrs. Hudson is in 221b supervising her handyman (I don't know if that is the correct word?) who also happened to be her "sniper".
Anyway, I think it was Sherlock who set John's call. His reaction was so calm... he had to know for sure that Mrs. H was allright, cause we all know what happens if Sherlock thinks she has been harmed.

sherlocked · March 19, 2012 8:33 pm

In Sherlock's words: This is boooring, because we all agree, lol! If Moriarty had made a call, to get John out of the way for a time, John would have been told, that Stamford had been shot. Sherlock couldn't have cared less.

Last edited by sherlocked (March 19, 2012 8:34 pm)

besleybean · October 7, 2012 4:08 pm

Yeah, I very recently discovered there was discussion on who made the call.
I think Sherlock set it up, but it could have been Moriarty...

Sam · October 8, 2012 1:02 am

Who was on the other end of the phone though? Molly? John would know what Moriarty's voice sounded like so it had to be from someone they knew/trusted. Sherlock set it up but who actually made the call?

I read the posts but I could have missed if someone said already haha

besleybean · October 8, 2012 7:25 am

John comes off the phone saying it was a paramedic...so it could be anybody's voice.

Sam · October 8, 2012 7:26 pm

Ooooh, forgot that. Maybe a homeless network person?

besleybean · October 8, 2012 7:37 pm

Possibly.

sherlockian111 · January 27, 2013 10:44 pm

I think it was Sherlock who set the call up, but it's a bit of a coincidence that as soon as John leaves, Moriaty texts Sherlock

kennese · January 28, 2013 2:04 am

The question about who called Watson about Mrs Hudson raises another question. If it was Sherlock who called, to get Watson out of the way was Watson supposed to witness the jump? How would Sherlock have known that he would have gotten back to St. Barts in time?

Lupin · January 28, 2013 2:24 am

I think that Moriarty arranged the call to Watson. This would be a nod to a canon.

Notice that Moriarty texts Sherlock to play on the roof right after Watson leaves.

besleybean · January 28, 2013 7:04 am

Funny how it was just as John leaves!

erunyauve · January 28, 2013 12:27 pm

besleybean wrote:
Funny how it was just as John leaves!

Well, remember that Moriarty's got a sniper watching for John. I always thought Sherlock arranged for John to leave, because that explains how he knew Mrs Hudson wasn't really dying. But the more I think about it, the more I believe Moriarty did it, simply because he needed to get John outside the building at some point in order to be in position to be shot by the sniper (who also had to be in position to see Sherlock jump).

All this plotting is making my head hurt. It can't be that complicated!