BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » How did Sherlock get close to Culverton Smith?

Vhanja · January 8, 2017 11:07 pm

I don't understand how Sherlock managed to get into CS's "inner circle". How did they meet? How did CS let him in and let him see everything?

Liberty · January 8, 2017 11:13 pm

Culverton Smith wanted to, I think. Sherlock Holmes was famous, Culverton Smith was smug, and showing off. Sherlock publicly accused him, so Culverton invited him to meet him and see his charity work, and hugged him and so on. He was showing he was untouchable.

ewige · January 8, 2017 11:18 pm

Well THAT hug was downright creepy! I'm so happy Sherlock pickpocketed him in return! *nods*

Sherlock Holmes · January 8, 2017 11:26 pm

Like all serial killers, CS had a weakness. He was arrogant and loved to think that he was playing Sherlock. And at one point in the morgue, I had flashbacks to HLV, where Sherlock realises he's got everything wrong and f*cked things up. Except in the end, he hadn't.

Liberty · January 8, 2017 11:28 pm

Yes, it was pretty clever. And funnily enough, he used the same thing as he used with Magnussen, drugs, to try to put Culverton on the wrong track.

ewige · January 8, 2017 11:33 pm

You know, when John and Lestrade watched that video of CS about "putting Sherlock in his favorite room" I immediately thought of the mortuary and wasalmost screaming at John to connect the dots too!!!

Mattlocked · January 8, 2017 11:34 pm

God, when they searched the flat and the note fell down. I almost cried out THE NOTE!! IT'S REAL!!

ewige · January 8, 2017 11:36 pm

Mattlocked wrote:
God, when they searched the flat and the note fell down. I almost cried out THE NOTE!! IT'S REAL!!

Haven't noticed that! So I was a little longe in suspense than you on that matter

Mothonthemantel · January 8, 2017 11:38 pm

Sherlock twitters he (CS) was a serial killer and asked for a lunch date.

Last edited by Mothonthemantel (January 8, 2017 11:38 pm)

Vhanja · January 8, 2017 11:40 pm

So when they meet (with the creepy hug), that's the first time? They talked as if they had known each other for ages.

This Is The Phantom Lady · January 9, 2017 2:42 pm

"The frailty of genius. It needs an audience"

Liberty · January 9, 2017 2:47 pm

Yes! We're back where we started. And in fact, Culverton seems delighted with the extra audience he's getting through being a famous serial killer. "I might break America!"

(I like that they pointed out the entrapment too!).

Lola Red · January 9, 2017 3:48 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
"The frailty of genius. It needs an audience"

"...always so desperate to get caught"

I think that was Culverton's downfall, he wanted to get caught, he wanted to confess. In fact. confession was as much part of his compulsion as the murders were

Liberty · January 9, 2017 3:56 pm

Yes, I think you're right. And now he can be free with all the horrible details. A happyish ending for him, rather disturbingly.

Last edited by Liberty (January 9, 2017 3:56 pm)

Kittyhawk · September 26, 2017 10:52 am

Liberty wrote:
Yes, it was pretty clever. And funnily enough, he used the same thing as he used with Magnussen, drugs, to try to put Culverton on the wrong track.

I don't think so. From what I've seen upon re-watching (Sherlock with Faith Smith is my favourite scenes in season 4), Sherlock was drugging himself out of his mind long before ever being aware of there being anything wrong with Culverton Smith. He has the drug lab and Bill Wiggins in his kitchen when Faith comes to tell him about her suspicions regarding her father killing one person - and he is in a state where he can't remember why he looks out the window. Then it takes the night walking with Faith and a morning (or so) of thinking to come up with the idea that CS is a serial killer.

Sad as it is, I'd say Sherlock took the drugs for their own sake - because he thought they'd help him get over having got Mary killed, over John wanting to have nothing to do with him, because he wanted to switch off his brain, because it's easier to give in to addiction than to face the realities of life, or for whatever reasons people take drugs.

Liberty · September 27, 2017 6:26 am

Oh, I agree that there was the more to his drug use than just that. But it seemed that he planned all along to become a "patient"/victim - he had to be in serious danger and have John rescue him. I'm still unclear as to exactly how much was planned, but the drugs certainly helped to get him in that situation.

SusiGo · September 27, 2017 11:15 am

I also think that the drug use was due to Sherlock having lost John. It is the same pattern as in HLV and both times it would not have been necessary to consume the drugs, he is an excellent actor. It is no coincidence that whenever Sherlock thinks he has lost John, he falls back on the drugs:

- at the beginning of HLV (John is married)
- at the end of HLV (the suicide mission)
- TLD

There is a definite pattern there.

The idea of Sherlock taking drugs in order to approach CS does not make sense to me because at the point he has no idea that the killings are connected to the hospital. The only information he has came from Faith and did contain any hints to the hospital.

Liberty · September 27, 2017 4:52 pm

I'll have to watch again, as I think maybe the very obvious Jimmy Savile connection made me just assume that there was a hospital connection! (Setlock probably didn't help to dissuade me either). Of course, it would have been an easy deduction for Sherlock to make, given the circumstances. I do think that he tries to put himself in danger, as Mary suggests. I think the drugs were initially grief-related, as he'd lost both Mary and John and also had some guilt over it. But they also played a part in the case, in various ways - and I thought the Magnussen connection was interesting.