BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » sherlock series 4 (spoilers inside)

mrshouse · December 16, 2016 9:27 am

As little as I like it but I agree 200% with what you say here, nakahara.
As a little counterbalance though I found this little interesting detail about canon. Obviously we cannot be sure if that is what they are going for but it shades some different light on the scene....:
http://isitandwonder.tumblr.com/post/154541283646/monikakrasnorada-the-7-percent-solution

Vhanja · December 16, 2016 10:01 am

I don't like the scene and the dynamics here at all. However, I will try to stay on the fence as much as I can until I see the clip in it's full context. And, more importantly, until I've seen the whole series and see what happens to all of them.

The clips they are showing are all clips that "doesn't matter". Clip with no plot and nothing revealing. So a good thing about showing this scene to us so early, is that it tells us that this scene is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

mrshouse · December 16, 2016 10:04 am

Vhanja wrote:
The clips they are showing are all clips that "doesn't matter". Clip with no plot and nothing revealing. So a good thing about showing this scene to us so early, is that it tells us that this scene is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Very good point!

Schmiezi · December 16, 2016 10:27 am

mrshouse wrote:
Vhanja wrote:
The clips they are showing are all clips that "doesn't matter". Clip with no plot and nothing revealing. So a good thing about showing this scene to us so early, is that it tells us that this scene is irrelevant in the grand scheme of things.

Very good point!

Absolutely!

SusiGo · December 16, 2016 10:37 am

This!

ewige · December 16, 2016 12:07 pm

Random bit of observation:
I've just been rewatching the first trailer where Mrs Hudson tells Mycroft to "Get out of my house, you reptile". "Reptile" has been translated as "chameleon" in the Russian trailer, altho there is a perfectly good word for a reptile in Russian too.
While I don't know how much influence BBC has over Russian translations (the eps dubbing is fairly questionable...), the word choice does seem to indicate that Mycroft is not only cold blooded but actually changes sides - acc. to Mrs Hudson at least.

nakahara · December 16, 2016 1:12 pm

One redeeming feature of the clip - this wonderfully smiling Sherlock.

Schmiezi · December 16, 2016 1:29 pm

I am not sure that smile looks honest.

I must admit that I have not seen the clip yet, so I don't know who or what he is smiling at, but somehow that smile seems forced, exaggerated to me.

nakahara · December 16, 2016 1:48 pm

To me his smile resembles the one he had on the end of "The Blind Banker" when he brought the news about the brooch to the blonde secretary....

nakahara · December 16, 2016 1:51 pm

Uh, huh....

Shooting people for money is very postitive, I´m sure... Mary should be promoted as the role-model in schools.

SHERLOCK: "It´s wonderful that you shot the postman, Mary, the man kept getting on my nerves... but please, could you spare the plumber next time? Bathing in cold water for a week is not very pleasant, you know?"

Vhanja · December 16, 2016 1:53 pm

Well, Sherlock is the kind of person who could admire someone's skill set no matter how that skill set was put to use. Look at how he was fascinated by Moriarty or anyone else who managed to murder somone in a clever way. Totally in character, I think.

nakahara · December 16, 2016 1:58 pm

I think that THOB made it clear that Sherlock sees nothing positive in Moriarty, he fears him:

TAB too carried this message, I think.

Vhanja · December 16, 2016 2:00 pm

You can both fear someone and admire their skills. It was clear that he was doing just that in TGG. It's one of Sherlock's regular features - how he can praise a murder for being clever and entertaining, no matter if the deed is horrible in itself.

mrshouse · December 16, 2016 2:07 pm

I disagree. I see a difference in recognizing unusual skills and acknowledging them but on the same time fearing what they do to him and others as well as being repulsed by them (as he clearly is by Magnussen) or on the other side being great pals and having fun...
But there might be two different standards towards what the writers made of Mary and the obvious villains of the show. But maybe that's just me.

Vhanja · December 16, 2016 2:15 pm

Well, all I commented on was "acknowledging Mary's past and skill set in a positive manner", which I think is a very Sherlock thing to do. It's one of those defining things of Sherlock - at least BBC Sherlock - that he will praise the cleverness of a crime where other focus on the tragedy of it.

mrshouse · December 16, 2016 2:17 pm

And that is what I donot see: I see him also being fearsome and repulsed and acknowledging , yes, but not in a positive way.

ewige · December 16, 2016 2:19 pm

But still, Sherlock wouldn't pick the baddie Mary over John just because of her skill set. Like he never picked Moriarty over anybody, too. I hope he's luring Mary into a trap of sorts. Yep.

mrshouse · December 16, 2016 2:22 pm

Have you checked my earlier link, ewige? Spoilers, though!
Still, it is worth a thought.

Vhanja · December 16, 2016 2:23 pm

I've seen it from the very first episode. How he focused on how clever the lady in pink was for "forgetting" her phone and leading them to the killer, instead of thinking about the tragedy of the murder. How he was all eager over the pip cases in TGG, and focused much more on the interesting cases than the tragedy of the victims on the phones.

Or how he praised the case of HoB while Henry was having a total breakdown, leading to John scolding him for "timing!" Or how John had to tell him to perhaps not so openly enjoy himself on the case due to kidnapped children... How he didn't care at all that Irene tricked him, drugged him and beat him because she was interesting.

dioscureantwins · December 16, 2016 2:25 pm

Vhanja wrote:
Well, all I commented on was "acknowledging Mary's past and skill set in a positive manner", which I think is a very Sherlock thing to do. It's one of those defining things of Sherlock - at least BBC Sherlock - that he will praise the cleverness of a crime where other focus on the tragedy of it.

I absolutely agree with you here, Vhanja. Also, since the first S2 trailer aired Moftiss have managed to lead us up the garden path time and again. We're all theorising ahead of the facts. Which is lots of fun of course but so totally against Sherlock's approach towards solving puzzles.