BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Theories About Season 4 Moriarty

GLaDOSperson101 · January 4, 2016 3:08 am

So: Moriarty. It was revealed (I hesitate to use that word because the entire episode was essentially nesting dolls of questionable consciousness) at the end of TAB that he didn't actually fake his own death; it was just a figment of a drug-induced dream from Sherlock's brain. BUT: what if HE WAS NEVER REAL? It actually kind of makes sense. He is such an opposite to Sherlock--unrestrainedly crazy (unlike Sherlock, who usually keeps his thoughts and feelings to himself), a consulting criminal (seriously, the world's only "consulting criminal" in the same country--nay, the same CITY--as the world's only "consulting detective"? Coincidence?), and is quite an extreme character--almost a caricature compared to the deep and complex personalities of Sherlock, Watson, even Mrs. Hudson. Please tell me what you think. I don't necessarily believe in this theory, I just think it's an interesting point (my friend originally brought this up).

tonnaree · January 4, 2016 12:58 pm

It is interesting, but if Moriarty was not real, who did all the kidnapping and bombing?

James Norrington · January 4, 2016 1:13 pm

Same here, and I've thought of that as well while going through the possibilitys, but what about the scenes where he interacted with other persons and was seen without being in direct contact with Sherlock (f.e. the Tower scene, the court etc.) If he only existed in Sherlocks brain, then why would he come up with scenes like those? And yes, who would be behind all the things that happened in the Great Game? Sherlock himself?
I doubt it. It would be more than just disappointing if the world's greatest mind would turn out to be a madman who sets up his own cases...

Now I'm always wondering who it might be that's behind the videos at the end of series 3, the ones using Moriarty as some kind of symbol. It's still the same question we've been having after the ending of series 3. There are several persons we already know that could be behind it (actually it could be anyone really).
Is it Janine? Is it Mary?

Or is it someone we don't know yet?

Last edited by James Norrington (January 4, 2016 1:28 pm)

Danielle80 · April 12, 2016 7:51 pm

Me too: since I watched TAB there are many points I called into question. Moriarty is one of this: What if he was a real actor but not employed from Sherlock but from the terroristic organization? So the organization might have exist before Moriarty and he was himself only a "puppet" from them as like as the cabbie in SoP. And the organization, who are they? Are they victims like the women circle in TAB and they want to take revenge? Maybe they are victims or relatives to victims of the experiments in baskerville and want now take revenge to the British government and so on ... When I think so by myself, Moriarty could really be something like a failed human experiment :-D

@GLaDOSperson101: You made me think of another crazy theory: What if the whole episode is a mixture of reality and hallucinations? That would explain a few things I did not undstand yet like the IOU Messages.
What if Sherlock used the drug of Baskerville to enhance his mind palace:
The IOU Messages were never seen by anyone except Sherlock and he did not tell anyone about this. At the latest on the police department the message would be noticed by anyone. So the message could be a visualization of information Sherlock did not want to forget. At the lab Sherlock said "I owe you" and Molly asked him what he mean. He answerd that he only wanted to memorized something. So this messages are no messages from Moriraty himself but could a part of Sherlocks mind palace. As I understand in a mind palace you visualise numbers as letters, serveral informations as pictures and than you assign it to a location. So maybe is this part of the explaination whats happend in this episode (TRF).

Last edited by Danielle80 (April 13, 2016 4:30 pm)

sherlock_gheek · August 21, 2016 1:15 am

I highly doubt this. In the books, we know him as Professor and Sherlock even called him Professor once. However, we rarely see him connected in any academia. One of the things that made Moriarty so menacing is the fact that he could hide in plain sight. He orchestrated all kinds of criminal activity for profit and yet maintained good citizenry for society. The identity switching, for the series, made Moriarty that more intangible as he could be anywhere and anyone. Moriarty being dead is more so metaphorical as he will become more than a mere mortal. The bigger question is why make his return so public? He stated at the end of TRF to Sherlock, "Why does everything for you must be so clever? So he's showing Sherlock that he outsmarted him. They are both sociopaths and hate to be outdone.

besleybean · August 21, 2016 7:47 am

I so want him back...but just don't think it will happen.

Mothonthemantel · August 21, 2016 11:12 am

I really want him back too . I sort of think he might be but not as he was though. I think Moriarty 1 may of been dieing anyway and was used to distract Sherlock from solving the Pink case properly and ultimately get Sherlock up working for Mycroft.
So maybe a twin or a hired lookalike or something.
Have had some funny thoughts that the Sherlock lookalike actually hired R.Brook who was a Moriarty lookalike.

besleybean · August 21, 2016 11:15 am

I don't actually think that, really...I think future Moriarty will all be back story/mind palace.

Mothonthemantel · August 21, 2016 11:22 am

You are probably correct. But I like to have one ray of hope in the expectation of the dark angst stuff they seem to be promising .

besleybean · August 21, 2016 11:22 am

I know!

Liberty · August 21, 2016 11:23 am

That would be an interesting twist, Moth!

Mothonthemantel · August 21, 2016 11:46 am

I think it does all go back to Pink though. Moriarty got Hope to kill those people for a reason and someone was trying to hide it. An adulterous MP a young man and a media something makes some kind of pillow talk scandal cover up to my mind.

besleybean · August 21, 2016 1:29 pm

Just seems so long ago!

sherlock_gheek · August 22, 2016 5:25 pm

He's not a backstory or just stuck in his mind palace. Even Mycroft was saying he's back and his video was being plastered all over London. Was there ever a scene where they showed whether or not Sherlock investigated Moriarty's body? Is that why he was so panicked?

besleybean · August 22, 2016 6:48 pm

I hope so!

Schmiezi · August 23, 2016 6:09 am

Mothonthemantel wrote:
You are probably correct. But I like to have one ray of hope in the expectation of the dark angst stuff they seem to be promising .

I think Mind Palace Moriarty has every potential for endlos darkness. So I'd bet the "real" one remains dead.

besleybean · August 23, 2016 6:24 am

Me, too.

Liberty · August 23, 2016 6:57 am

No scene where the body was investigated, but doesn't Sherlock say "His body was never recovered". Which is really, really odd.

Although he does say it in the Victorian mind palace, and seems to be talking about the Reichenbach falls and original story, where neither body was recovered. It would be very strange if Moriarty's body was not recovered from the rooftop, where they knew it was lying.

besleybean · August 23, 2016 3:59 pm

From what Benedict has said in interview, I do think Moriarty is dead.

Liberty · August 23, 2016 5:17 pm

Yes, he seems to have kind of absorbed Moriarty, as a part of his psyche, and that's the sense in which Moriarty lives on. But TAB didn't really answer any questions, while kind of claiming to.