BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Operation Ugly Duckling

ukaunz · June 19, 2016 10:25 am

So, remember in HLV when Sherlock disappeared from hospital and everyone was looking for him, searching out all his bolt holes... Lestrade visited Mycroft in his office at the Diogenes club and we saw that he was more concerned with something on his computer screen, with the heading "Ugly Duckling".

Source

He appears to be tracking something or someone in Poland using GPS. Since just about every detail that we are shown is meaningful to the storyline, what can we speculate about Operation Ugly Duckling?

Final Problem has some ideas. Anyone else want to give it a shot?

JP · June 19, 2016 10:57 am

I gave it a shot. I asked Mark. I have never seen a more puzzled person.
He said, he had no idea what was on the monitor. Well, we should ask people who made this prop.

I didn't make a connection with canon (Mycroft trying to trace Irene would make sense though), but with the location itself. Which could be a really big chemical plant or a flight academy.
This makes ne wonder: how many clues we really had in the show, when we put away the canon hints, that do nothing to the story. I can only remember the squash ball in TRF.

Last edited by JP (June 19, 2016 10:57 am)

GimmeCat · June 19, 2016 11:09 am

JP wrote:
I gave it a shot. I asked Mark. I have never seen a more puzzled person.
He said, he had no idea what was on the monitor. Well, we should ask people who made this prop.

So we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that this is DEFINITELY an important detail that they want to keep under wraps for the time being, considering what a hilariously transparent fib that obviously is.

Mothonthemantel · June 19, 2016 11:28 am

I think it is a reference to the Ugly duckling story by A A Milne . Replace being pretty or dull with being smart and not normal and the cat / dog riddle relates well with what happened in TGG and between Sherlock and Moriarty on the roof.

Might just be me that thinks so. .

Wiki has a brief summary of the story though.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Ugly_Duckling_(play)

JP · June 19, 2016 12:36 pm

GimmeCat wrote:
So we know beyond a shadow of a doubt that this is DEFINITELY an important detail that they want to keep under wraps for the time being, considering what a hilariously transparent fib that obviously is.

I seriously doubt it. You cannot fake such puzzlement. Even Mark is not so good.
It wasn't even a real question, but it came as a "side effect" of something else we were discussing. Anyway at the moment I said Ugly Duckling, he gave me a WTF look and I had to explain what am I talking about.

Of course, someone could definitely give this detail some backstory, but it weren't the writers. I was too concentrated on Mark to see Steven's reaction, but he didn't say anything.

Last edited by JP (June 19, 2016 12:37 pm)

mrshouse · June 19, 2016 12:42 pm

That sounds interesting, JP, could you tell more about it? How did you get into the situation? When was it?

Mothonthemantel · June 19, 2016 12:43 pm

Probably a insert by the creative direction team - AWJ&Co.

JP · June 19, 2016 12:51 pm

It was at Sherlocked, the special "round table" for VIPs. Actually, I was talking about the terrible fake German in MHR and TBB. Don't ask me how I came to the Duckling. I was high on adrenaline and my brain couldn't keep the pace with the things that were happening to me. But Mark's WTF face I remember very well.

Yitzock · June 19, 2016 2:10 pm

I had not noticed "Ugly Duckling" before, but I think you guys have some interesting ideas. Mononthamantel's idea is one I like, though I don't know whether this little detail means much more to the story than that. Or it could be they just wanted something that appeared like a funny code name for something to appear on the screen.

Settercrazy · June 22, 2016 10:31 pm

So JP---did Mark comment on the "bad German" stuff when you asked him? I was surprised, because I thought: 'Couldn't they find a few more Germans to say "Nicht schuldig" for MHR?' I mean, they could have doubled up and the real Germans they had, could have repeated in a slightly different tone of voice and nobody would have noticed. LOL

JP · June 22, 2016 11:06 pm

Settercrazy, the scene in TBB, when Sherlock robs German tourists of their London guide is even worse... I also read not so nice comment on the Serbian, even if the actor playing the torturer seems to have at least Serbian roots. I understand that Mycroft might be able to learn a language in few hours, but has no ear for proper pronunciation, still - in such a great show this kind of mishaps are a bit not good (and my movie pet peeve, BTW )
The reaction?
Oh, the guys got rather defensive, which surprised me. No instant puns! More some excuses, like
...that the part for MHR was shot in the corner of the other set, and in a hurry, that everybody in the industry makes that, that Peter Dinklage has a helluva accent for a Westerosi... It was quite a surreal dialogue. Or half-dialogue, as I had a problem to bring my point against those two. :-) I swear I don't remember how it came to the Duckling, probably I had said something about hiring Polish native speakers if they want to bring Poland into the story next season. At the end I just wished I had kept my mouth shut.

BTW, you don't need native speakers as actors. You just need someone to do the final dubbing. And I bet - one post on Twitter would be enough - and they could find not only native speakers of any language on this Earth, but also people who speak old Klingon or Quenya with Shire accent.

GimmeCat · June 23, 2016 5:57 am

I read some amazing meta about this the other day, but I don't recall where. It was something to do with figuring out who The Other One could be, and there was like 5 or 6 layers to it, but it all made so much sense (as many metas do, whether they end up right or wrong).

Essentially, it said that the Ugly Duckling being tracked here is something to do with the laptop of the agent who "died to bring us [the] information" that brought Sherlock back to England. That ill-fated agent was possibly 'The Other One' that Mycroft refers to in the boardroom, the person whom everyone automatically assumed was the third Holmes brother due to him using the expression "brotherly compassion" in the same sentence. But it's equally possible it was a seperate statement. Mycroft is talking about Sherlock in context of him being an agent for this mission, therefore 'the other one' can mean 'the other agent'.

Whoever he was, he was an agent Mycroft sent on a mission to Eastern Europe, the same mission he later compells Sherlock to reject (hence why the woman in the boardroom tells him that's "hardly merciful" when he later decides to send Sherlock there anyway rather than incarcerate him for CAM's murder).

Why a laptop? Because it's established in HLV that government laptops have GPS tracking, and it's much more likely he's tracking a laptop than a human.

There's also an explanation of why it's in Poland in relation to Sherlock being in nearby Serbia during his post-TRF undercover work, but I'd have to find the post again because I don't remember the details. The jist, though, is that it's all to do with Moriarty's network, and how he definitely hasn't dismantled it yet.

It also explains why Ugly Duckling (aka Swan) but I don't recall that bit either. Something to do with an opera house, with evidence supported by Sherlock making opera house + swan serviettes in TSoT.

Man, I really need to find that post again!

Last edited by GimmeCat (June 23, 2016 5:58 am)

ukaunz · June 23, 2016 6:20 am

That would have been Final Problem's series of metas, which I linked in the first post of this thread

The reason I think the information on Mycroft's screen is important to the plot (and not just some random thing the creative team invented just for this scene) is because every time we see a newspaper or John's blog or a BBC news ticker or some other piece of text, there are always hidden clues and references. Moftiss are very devious

Last edited by ukaunz (June 23, 2016 6:22 am)

GimmeCat · June 23, 2016 6:42 am

LOL! So that's where I read it. Should have been obvious. xD

I've just been going through so many posts lately, including a bunch of really old stuff. Half the time I have no idea where I read something.

Liberty · June 23, 2016 7:03 am

JP wrote:
Settercrazy, the scene in TBB, when Sherlock robs German tourists of their London guide is even worse... I also read not so nice comment on the Serbian, even if the actor playing the torturer seems to have at least Serbian roots. I understand that Mycroft might be able to learn a language in few hours, but has no ear for proper pronunciation, still - in such a great show this kind of mishaps are a bit not good (and my movie pet peeve, BTW )
The reaction?
Oh, the guys got rather defensive, which surprised me. No instant puns! More some excuses, like
...that the part for MHR was shot in the corner of the other set, and in a hurry, that everybody in the industry makes that, that Peter Dinklage has a helluva accent for a Westerosi... It was quite a surreal dialogue. Or half-dialogue, as I had a problem to bring my point against those two. :-) I swear I don't remember how it came to the Duckling, probably I had said something about hiring Polish native speakers if they want to bring Poland into the story next season. At the end I just wished I had kept my mouth shut.

BTW, you don't need native speakers as actors. You just need someone to do the final dubbing. And I bet - one post on Twitter would be enough - and they could find not only native speakers of any language on this Earth, but also people who speak old Klingon or Quenya with Shire accent.

Love your last comment!

This is really interesting information, and just shows that there are some corners cut even though the end result looks so polished. I've noticed other things which don't really convince me in the series, and I suppose they thought this just wasn't important enough? (But I agree, it would have been nice to see it done properly - I wouldn't have noticed, but many would). Also interesting to know that the Ugly Duckling is not only not a writers choice but presumably added without discussion with them. I'm curious about how much the rest of the team add to the show without the writers. Listening to the commentary it seemed to me that although Moftiss are usually present on set, they tend to let the rest of the team do their thing ... and I suppose I wouldn't expect a writer to be directing. Thanks for asking the questions and sharing!

I suppose nowadays they can put down any "mistakes" (like the German and Serbian) down to it being "mind palace"!

JP · June 23, 2016 10:35 am

After following Arwel on Twitter for a while I cannot exclude a possibility that every department has it's own conspiracy going on, and they don't even know about each other. But they all so dedicated those independent details start to make sense as a whole.
I call it the last kind of magic I still believe in.

Liberty, are other things that don't convince you the fake typing and the fake violin playing?

PS: I'm pondering the idea to make me a T-shirt with: "The Woman who baffled Mofftiss" for this year.

Last edited by JP (June 23, 2016 10:48 am)

nakahara · June 23, 2016 11:06 am

Liberty wrote:
I suppose nowadays they can put down any "mistakes" (like the German and Serbian) down to it being "mind palace"!

What? Sherlock is now so dumb, he cannot even "imagine" right accent for these languages?
A violinist who has such a false sense of tones?
Oh, my!

Settercrazy · June 23, 2016 4:19 pm

JP---yes, the violin playing is a shame. BC doesn't do a bad job with posture and holding...but they really should have cared about synching up the music, reviewing a practice and correcting the bow strokes as necessary. I just look to the side in those scenes. LOL I also don't know why they don't watch the foreign language stuff. In the US series "Covert Affairs", the lead character goes to Berlin and supposedly talks in perfect German, acting like a native and it's anything but....I guess they never shoot these shows with people in mind that may be multi-lingual...hahaha...but it ruins the entire impression for sure.

JP · June 23, 2016 4:56 pm

There are so many simple ways to show playing (or typing) without actually showing it... sigh.
I actually expect language mishaps in older US movies. Okay, I can understand that a main actor hired for a movie cannot speak a language with a flawless accent, but to me, each time I hear a really bad imitation of any language I know enough to recognize it, it always kick me out of the story's universe, because it feels so damn fake.

I mean I love Little Favor, but I wish the big bad boy in it would stick to his unrecognizable funny accent instead of trying Russian. *Shudder*