That was a very thought provoking comic strip, I loved it.


In the same spirit of keeping an open mind, I hope people will read this article:
http://my.xfinity.com/blogs/tv/2015/03/04/whats-the-fuss-why-fans-react-negatively-to-some-but-not-all-same-sex-tv-romance/

I posted it in a new thread about homophobia in fandom, but it also has some great paragraphs which I feel are relevant to the Johnlock discussion. Scroll down to the paragraph that starts with "Surprise! I'm gay!" to see what I mean.

I was particularly interested to note that the TV show Black Sails, which I had never heard of, included a story arc (Spoilers!) in which a male character was presumed to be heterosexual until, to the shock and surprise of many viewers, he kisses another man in the second season. Hints that the character was gay which were included in the first season went unnoticed by many. A similar story apparently occurred in The 100 between two female characters. So yes, it is possible to have a "surprise twist" with same sex characters ending up together and it has been done before. I'm still not convinced it is happening in Sherlock, but it does give one hope. And I think I might check out Black Sails to see how it was done.

Last edited by ukaunz (June 8, 2016 3:03 am)

As you all know I always try and fairly disregard Irene anyway!
For me it's Sherlock's response to her that matters.
It always seemed (because it's so long since I've seen the episode now)to me that there was an attraction, but not an arousal.

It was the "Why would I want dinner, when I 'm not hungry?" line, that always made me think Sherlock was not interested in sex with Irene.

In this theory.
Possibly also on a Kinsey type scale, whereby possibly many of us technically are!
But none of this means we will ever see John in a relationship with Sherlock.
After all, we've only ever seen him in relationship with women and I have no reason to suspect we will ever see anything different.

Last edited by besleybean (June 8, 2016 10:10 am)

Obviously not, as there is no sex involved.

Obviously neither of them have the appetite for it...at least with each other.

Well we're not shown that they have sex and there is no reference to them having done so.
So either it didn't happen or the writers deem it uninteresting/unimportant.
We at least have the smoking gun(as it were), with John and Mary- so I fail to see why they would be so coy in a similar circumstance.
Incidentally we have on at least 3 occasions evidence that John is at least interested in sleeping with Sarah.
I have never seen anything even approaching evidence that either Sherlock or John are in the least way interested in each other that way.

Last edited by besleybean (June 8, 2016 12:02 pm)

Some people perceive they have.

tonnaree wrote:

Well, they've certainly had plenty of eyesex. 

Yes. I will have to say this - even though I don't think Johnlock will happen, that eyesex scene in ASiP is so intense that I feel as if I should look away. It's like I'm looking at something way too intimate and private for me to be watching.

I don't feel that way with Irene's flirting, because to me it feels like "just sex" with very little emotions from the both of them. And that kind of stuff happens in almost every movie/series anyway, so I'm sort of immune. But that "eyesex", oh my. It feels way more intimate than Irene's advances ever did.

Last edited by Vhanja (June 8, 2016 5:00 pm)

Mothonthemantel wrote:

TJLC Explained [episode 18] John is bi.

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=50d_OxKH7io

This is a long video so difficult to discuss in a short reply!  But basically, I don't think the things that are being pointed out show that John is bi.  For instance, John being an army doctor does not make him bi, in my opinion.  He was an army doctor in ACD, and I honestly think that's the reason he's an army doctor in Sherlock.   It might be a nice bit of symbolism if he was already shown as bi, but he isn't.  There is nothing in the show that shows John struggling with his sexuality - I don't think him waking from the dream at the begining of ASIP is really meant to show that.  Mycroft's explanation actually makes sense.    I don't believe that Mary is suggesting that Sherlock and John are lovers (would she really do that at her wedding?), and that John and Sholto were lovers.  (And we've already been set up for a story about friendship, by Mrs Hudson). 

John does more or less say that he's straight  - what else can "of course it's a woman" (the conversation with Mrs Hudson in TEH) mean?   And  when he says he's not gay, it obviously includes bi, or the comment wouldn't make sense.  (If he was bi, then of course he could be in a relationship with a man).   And what he says fits with what we see on screen - we never do see him dating a man.

And Sherlock saying John is attracted to dangerous people and places, doesn't mean that he's sexually attracted to them!  (He has also included Mrs Hudson in the list of people!). 

Again, I think the main thing is that we're being shown a character who denies same sex attraction (while clearly having opposite sex attractions) and we are given no backstory about him being closeted or in denial.   (Growing up in the 80s does not necessarily mean somebody will be closeted or in denial - I lived through that time and had openly gay friends, and had come out about my own bisexuality at the time.  Are we really meant to assume that about all characters of that age?).   It's just not a good way to show a bi character.