BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » What is the Special about? (Spoilers)

Zatoichi · November 24, 2015 10:00 pm

I´m a bit disappointed if I´m honest that Benedict sees the curls and the coat as mere surface aspects that he hopes will change.. for me they say a lot about his character, and said things I really adored as well. Now the "stuck-on bits" will change, and what´s going on underneath will have to change a lot, too.. well. I hope I can still recognize him when all the growth and expansion and evolvement is done. I don´t feel I know him too well in the Special.. the way he talks is so different, his hard expressions are softened by nothing, and the smile.. I´m sure it´s supposed to be endearing, but to me it looks really unsettling ^^. Where is his weakness for the touch of drama represented if he doesn´t wear his swishing coat and his tightly fitted clothes in dramatic colours? ^^ Where his hidden emotionality if it isn´t for the "ridiculous mop of curls?" (gasp! ^^) What a pity if all this would be evolved away..

Last edited by Zatoichi (November 24, 2015 10:01 pm)

SusiGo · November 24, 2015 10:12 pm

Well, I do not believe that modern Sherlock will change his appearance completely. There has to be a contrast between Victorian and modern Sherlock, I suppose.

Btw, someone suggested an interesting thing regarding the "tatty" coat. We all know the concept that the coat is Sherlock's armour, his barrier against the world (upturned collar and all that). So they might have him shed his armour = get rid of the coat in one of the coming episodes. Then the farewell to the coat would become a symbolic act instead of a simple disposal. Just an idea.

nakahara · November 24, 2015 10:12 pm

Ah-chie wrote:
I like that BC sees the character as so much more than the "stuck-on bits of the doll" (the hair, the coat) and is much more interested in Holmes evolving and changing.

It makes me wonder how some fans will view this if it comes to the regular series. There are a lot of comments on this board about Sherlock's curls, and many, many posts about the love of "The Coat". It isn't a secret that Ben hasn't much love for the hair (re: the opening lines of this interview "I was thrilled! I went, at last, I can have a fucking haircut [laughter] I can slick it back and not have that ridiculous mop of curls on my head."). I got the distinct impression that one of the things that BC loved about doing the Victorian special was that he saw it as an opportunity to do the same character but without the usual trappings that some use to define him and to let people see that the character is so much more than a curly hairstyle and a great coat. Maybe this special could be considered a trial balloon in regards to shedding some of the surface aspects and allowing the regular series character to develop differently in appearance as well (and thus be a outward way of manifesting inward change).

Actually I saw a blog post about exactly this thing today and althrough I am not as passionate about it as this blogger, I can´t say I do not agree with her on cardinal points:

http://recentlyfolded.tumblr.com/post/133816174580/you-agreed-to-do-it-and-you-got-paid-for-it-so

Why are cheek inserts, wigs, beards, strangely coloured hair or even a lack of eyebrows seen as tolerable, yet Sherlock curls are the permanent "problem"? Why should an actor complain about such a silly thing? Isn´t is his job to embody a character he is playing and embrace the role with all her characteristics, no matter what they are?

Sherlock curls are one of the defining features of the BBC character. It´s what makes this character instantly recognisable among all Sherlock´s from different adaptations. Slicked up hair, even when they are not bad, are not "evolvement" - they are something Jeremy Brett has done in the 80-ties and as such, they represent "regression".

And really, I would await some more interesting observations about this character from Benedict than constant complaints about his hair.

Yitzock · November 25, 2015 12:22 am

I don't think he's unprofessional about it. He's allowed to have opinions about things. Just because we don't know of other bad things he's thought about other characters, doesn't mean he doesn't have them. I don't recall him saying he loved the Julian Assange look. He may not have said he hated it, but he did say it was kind of creepy to see himself looking so different, which isn't exactly positive even though it's not super negatve either. And even for Sherlock, he's not required to like everything. We know he doesn't like the longer hair, but that doesn't mean he won't do it if it's asked of him. He is still professional. I have my doubts about them changing the 21st Century look other than gradually over time. Perhaps, like Susi suggests, there could be a change that is symbolic of something else as well, but I don't see it changing in any other way. The Victorian version had to look different, but there are distinguishing features of the contemporary version that, while aesthetic and perhaps superficial, are still a part of it.

Zatoichi · November 25, 2015 7:17 am

SusiGo wrote:
So here is a little summary from Radio Times:

Sherlock: The Abominable Bride
Sherlock goes back in time to 1895… or does he? The Benedict Cumberbatch and Martin Freeman drama returns for Christmas with a twist. As the BBC statement has it: “We've been here before - but what if this wasn't the modern day but the late Victorian period? What if the world's most famous consulting detective and his best friend lived in a Baker Street of steam trains, hansom cabs, top hats and frock-coats? Welcome to 'Sherlock' in 1895!
“Some things, though, remain reassuringly the same. Friendship, adventure and especially, MURDER...
“Why is Thomas Ricoletti a little surprised to see his wife dressed in her old wedding gown? Because, just a few hours before, she took her own life...
“Mrs Ricoletti's ghost now appears to be prowling the streets with an unslakeable thirst for revenge. From fog-shrouded Limehouse to the bowels of a ruined church, Holmes, Watson and their friends must use all their cunning to combat an enemy seemingly from beyond the grave and the final, shocking truth about...the Abominable Bride!”

http://www.radiotimes.com/news/2015-11-24/sherlock-doctor-who-david-walliams-and-dickens-lead-bbc-tv-christmas-offerings

So maybe while thinking about how Moriarty could still be walking the earth one of them remembers the old story of a bride who was seen as a ghost after her public suicide.. while they find clues about her like her gravestone (hence modern Mary and John on the graveyard) the story unfolds in backflashes, and finally reveals the shocking truth about... both the Bride and Moriarty? Could explain all the comments about furthering the story and "going back in time but not really". I´m breathlessly awaiting the gifs on tumblr to find out.

SusiGo · November 25, 2015 8:43 am

Yes, I think the parallels between Moriarty and the bride are interesting. From what we have seen during setlock and in the trailer, she shoots herself in the head since there is no blood on her body. She shoots herself after having shot at/killed others. And then she (apparently) returns to do further mischief.

But there is of course another parallel - in HLV we also get to see a shooting bride.

nakahara · November 25, 2015 8:56 am

For a change, Martin´s interview about the Spesh:

http://sherlockian-1881.tumblr.com/post/133871415951/cupidford-constancecream-den-of-geek-why-would

Vhanja · November 25, 2015 4:47 pm

I like reading his thoughts about this. It's still this strange balance between being able to speak more open about it, but still not telling too much.

Edit:

Also,Moftiss talks about a question John asks Sherlock that he thinks is one of his favorite scenes of the special, and something he always wanted asked. I believe that question is: "What made you like this?"

What do you guys think?

Last edited by Vhanja (November 25, 2015 4:54 pm)

SusiGo · November 25, 2015 5:23 pm

nakahara wrote:
For a change, Martin´s interview about the Spesh:

http://sherlockian-1881.tumblr.com/post/133871415951/cupidford-constancecream-den-of-geek-why-would

Not sure if I always share Martin's humour:

People only get angry because they’re still engaged by it.

Absolutely. They’re the angriest! They’re absolutely the angriest people, who hate us most, are the…

Ones who watch it over and over…

Mark Chapman, ladies and gentlemen! He wasn’t a Kinks fan, he was a Beatles fan, he was too much of a Beatles fan.

Vhanja · November 25, 2015 9:05 pm

I thought it was funny.

SusiGo · November 25, 2015 9:12 pm

Passionate fans being compared to a mentally disturbed murderer? I suppose I have a different kind of humour.

besleybean · November 25, 2015 9:20 pm

I think he's trying to make a serious point in a humorous way and yes it is humour: black humour...very British.

nakahara · November 25, 2015 9:25 pm

I don´t see into his head of course, but couldn´t he be reffering to those crazies that sent death threaths to his wife, sprouted all that vitriol about Benedict and Sophie on the internet and stalked the members of the cast? We know there are some nasty haters out there - I myself often likened them to "Annie" from Steven King´s "Misery"....

nakahara · November 25, 2015 9:30 pm

And the best for last, to have all the insults together under one roof. Mofftiss in their full glory. Of corse, they once again try to persuade us that Sherlock is "horrible"... it´s folklore by now, really.

http://57circlesofhell.tumblr.com/post/133928734226/constancecream-den-of-geek

besleybean · November 25, 2015 9:38 pm

They've succeeded in getting me very excited about seeing it at the cinema, in just over a month's time!

nakahara · November 25, 2015 10:00 pm

Martin´s and Ben´s interview in a nutshell:

http://57circlesofhell.tumblr.com/post/133859950826/interviewer-asks-martin-freeman-an-innocuous

http://57circlesofhell.tumblr.com/post/133860185221/so-is-there-still-a-bromance-between-john-and

nakahara · November 25, 2015 10:02 pm

So the open fly was distraction maneuver... I see.

http://57circlesofhell.tumblr.com/post/133865065926/martin-freeman

SusiGo · November 25, 2015 10:03 pm

Brilliant!

Vhanja · November 25, 2015 10:08 pm

Well, I've seen it before, what Martin refers to. It's called "I'm the biggest fan, nobody hates it as much as me!"

I've seen people posting a page-long rant about a game they thought was so horrible that it might as well have been programmed by monkeys (his words). Turned out he had played over 300 hours in the game and made a few mods for it.

So, yeah, I've seen that before.

nakahara · November 25, 2015 10:15 pm

The words "I´m your biggest fan" were pretty scary in the aforementioned "Misery"...