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Use of New Villains
We already had a thread where we discussed some of the villains we'd like to see in the new series (I'll post a link to it here when I'm not on my mobile), but I was wondering how you guys think they will be utilised...for example:
Moriarty was a running theme throughout both Series 1 and 2. His name was first mentioned in Study In Pink by the dying cabbie, then in Blind Banker the instant messages the Tong gang leader woman received were from a mysterious M who then had her snipered - definitely Jim's style! Great Game we meet him in person for the first time and again at the beginning of Belgravia as well has him working with Irene throughout to disrupt Mycroft's plans. Even in Hounds there's that bit at the end where we see Mycroft letting him go, which is a set up for the big finale of Reichenbach. So basically, Moriarty is present in some way in every single episode.
Will they do a similar thing with a new nemesis, or will each episode just have its own villain and with no running theme? And if they opt for the latter do you think the series will lose any impact with having each episode contained within itself and no connection between them all?
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- Smoggy_London_Air
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Re: Use of New Villains
Yay, zombie thread!
That's an interesting question. The Holmes stories in themselves are, after all, not part of a bigger plot. They are about a consulting detective living his life and having self-contained adventures that are not part of some grand scheme of things. I would like to see that in this series, because that will definitely give it a longer life. Whether or not Moriarty returns (and to do the canon justice, he really can't, as much as I want to see Andrew Scott again) I would rather we not have some larger plot.
Last edited by Smoggy_London_Air (July 8, 2012 3:34 am)
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- Davina
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Re: Use of New Villains
We've had a dodgy red-headed newspaper reporter in TRF so if they do Silver Blaze In some form they can have an equally dodgy racehorse trainer who happens to be...the husband of Kitty Riley. (Ref: The Leverson Inquiry).
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- veecee
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Re: Use of New Villains
In the canon, Moriarty had a second-in-command who had to be taken care of later. Not really as exciting, but Moftiss could probably make it so.
- Arya
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Re: Use of New Villains
Yes, we haven't met Moriarty's Watson (if he has one) yet, have we? Although that plot might end up getting a little repetitive...
- veecee
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Re: Use of New Villains
Didn't he say something like "Ordinary people are so cute. I should get one." And then something even ruder about Sherlock having one?
- Arya
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Re: Use of New Villains
I think so... And then he said something Johnlock-y, if I remember correctly...
- KeepersPrice
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Re: Use of New Villains
He said, "Aren't ordinary people adorable? Well, you know, you've got John. I should get myself a live-in one".
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- kazza474
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Re: Use of New Villains
I have been thinking about this subject for a while now.
When you look back, moriarty had a huge slice of time allocated to him, spread over two series. Way more than in the originals.
And there really was no other villain who popped up through different stories. What I could see happening, as I have mentioned before, is the lead up story being spread over a few episodes with other crimes or puzzles taking the main plot (as happened with Moriarty in the Great Game for example.
And of course my favourite for that would be Charles Augustus Milverton.
So there is provision for any of the old stories to be used in that way & avoid the fickle fans getting bored with only one plot to follow.
Moriarty's right hand man is Sebastian Moran, we might have seen him as the sniper who took aim at John. he was also the villain in the original Empty House so it will be most probable that we will 'meet' him.
Veecee & Arya, by your posts you obviously haven't read the Adventures of the Empty House or this would all be old news to you. I urge you to find it online or in a book and read it; it really would get you more information about what's coming up.
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- veecee
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Re: Use of New Villains
I am reading the entire canon now, and have relatively recently read The Adventure of the Empty House. And I brought up Moran in my post, if not by name, so I don't know what you mean.
- Sherlock Holmes
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Re: Use of New Villains
@ Veecee...it's just the way you worded your post made it sound like you hadn't actually read it because you didn't mention his name, just that you'd heard about it somewhere.
But back to the topic...
I really love the Milverton story too and think it would make a great through thread for the series. Milverton's a blackmailer and blackmail can make people do all kinds of things ie. murder...so you could use some of the other stories and still have the same murders and victims and general characters but behind it all you could have Milverton as the manipulator.
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Thread Starter- veecee
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Re: Use of New Villains
I thought the same thing about Milverton. I just don't know how they're going to top Moriarty. So brilliantly written and brilliantly performed.
(I guess I mean "brilliant" in both American and British.)
- saysomething
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Re: Use of New Villains
Some of my thoughts to Sebastian Moran as most likely new villain in " The Empty House " ( at least) ( as he IS it in the ADC canon story).
Maybe Moriaty had got his "own Watson" - a "ordinary" person who was very loyal to and emotionally deeply involved with him
-as John was/ is with Sherlock.
One can perceive Moriaty as a " dark mirror image" of Sherlock in some way - both are brilliant, self-absorbed, crazy - but Sherlock "stands at the side of the angels".
Would that not mean that "Moriarty`s Watson" would represent a dark counterpart of John (s` personality) ?
Moran is a sniper, he could be probably a ex-soldier, sharing with John the experience of being in war, the lust of being in danger - but unlike John he (M.) could have lost his moral compass - enjoying to make people suffer and to cause them pain.
In season 2 Sherlock was confronted with his the darker sides of his personality ( fear - in Hound) and causing damage and pain to the people he loves ( TRF) , even with the (almost) complete lost of his identity ( by faking his one suicide, losing everything and everyone he loves, losing his reputation, having to leave London/ Great Britain), he was confronted with his dark counterpart Moriarty.
It would be a narrative challenge to also do this to John in season 3 - showing him being confronted and tormented by the dark
(er) side(s) of his charakter, coming face to face wíth someone ( Moran) who embodies this dark characteristics and potential what also may lurk hidden in John`s personality?
John will be most likely in a emotional deeply troubled of mind in TEH - shocked by Sherlock`s return of the dead, feeling betrayed and deceived by Sh., Molly and Mycroft so many months ( even years) ... maybe this could resulti in some unpleasant impact on his so far so loyal and kind character ...
Moran could be a ex-Afghainistan-campaigner himself, maybe even some ex-comrade of arms of John`s.
Last edited by saysomething (August 10, 2012 2:25 pm)
- sherlockskitty
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Re: Use of New Villains
I think they should just have one villain per 90 min episode
I didn't want to start a new thread for this subject, but--in one of the canon stories, we see John getting shot. I'd like to see a 90 min episode devoted to this. That would show us a side Of BBC Sherlock that we haven't seen before.
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