BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Johnlock: The Official Debate

Vhanja · October 18, 2015 11:10 am

Heh, nice observation.

http://johnlockfanfiction.tumblr.com/post/131400037689/jim-moriarty-is-back-i-worked-these-out-by

besleybean · October 18, 2015 11:38 am

Well it might be amusing, but I think we'd find the marriage certificate made out to John and Mary.
Plus, it is Mary carrying John's child.
Well at least, John didn't deny him and Mary having had sex at least once.

Vhanja · October 18, 2015 11:48 am

No, I personally believe John loved Mary. At least until the assassin reveal. Not so sure after that, but I think he makes the effort to try. Only S4 will show.

But I find it interesting that in the wedding between John and Mary there isn't a single love declaration shown between them. But there is several between Sherlock and John. That doesn't mean John doesn't love Mary, but it says a bit about what the creators wants us to focus on.

Last edited by Vhanja (October 18, 2015 11:50 am)

besleybean · October 18, 2015 12:53 pm

The fact that practically the entire episode is devoted to John and Mary's wedding, could mean that it is meant to be our focus.
It is also called The Sign of Three, the three being the family Watson.
Having said that, the show is called Sherlock, so he has to always be our main focus.
Further, in no way do I underplay the effect of John's marriage upon Sherlock.
I think Sherlock genuinely likes Mary and accepts she is the one.
But there is no doubt in my mind that he misses John...and I personally only hope that John is soon back in Baker Street with Sherlock, where in my opinion he really belongs.
I always knew they would marry John off, because it's canonical and to me was vastly superior to continue showing him with a string of different females.
But for me both the Canon and the show work best when being centred on the remarkable friendship of these 2 men.
I humbly suggest that both ACD and the Sherlock team know this.
You are right of course, that we may be provided with many answers in S4.
I wonder how much they will play on John suffering from losing the love of his life.
Sorry, I just realised that I should have made clear that I am assuming that Mary is in fact going to leave the show...one way or another. But I could be wrong!

Last edited by besleybean (October 18, 2015 12:56 pm)

SusiGo · November 13, 2015 3:35 pm

Just stumbled again over this classic. As Mary would say, "neither of us were the first."

http://monikakrasnorada.tumblr.com/post/133133581347/inkfeathers57-every-johnlocker-needs-to-see

Liberty · November 13, 2015 6:32 pm

besleybean · November 13, 2015 7:57 pm

Indeed, Sholto was John's friend before Sherlock was.
Just as John had slept with other women before Mary.

SusiGo · November 13, 2015 7:59 pm

I was referring to the fact that BBC Sherlock Johnlockers were not the first to promote this idea. The clip for example is from "The Thin Blue Line" (1995-1996) featuring Rowan Atkinson as policeman.

Last edited by SusiGo (November 13, 2015 8:01 pm)

nakahara · November 13, 2015 8:58 pm

SusiGo wrote:
Just stumbled again over this classic. As Mary would say, "neither of us were the first."

http://monikakrasnorada.tumblr.com/post/133133581347/inkfeathers57-every-johnlocker-needs-to-see

Lovely constable Habib! And she is right, of course!

tonnaree · November 13, 2015 10:11 pm

SusiGo wrote:
I was referring to the fact that BBC Sherlock Johnlockers were not the first to promote this idea. The clip for example is from "The Thin Blue Line" (1995-1996) featuring Rowan Atkinson as policeman.

Johnlock has existed since the publication of the original stories. It just wasn't called Johnlock.
There have always been people who speculated that John and Sherlock were more than friends.

besleybean · November 13, 2015 10:28 pm

Yes, I've always been aware of the 'Johnlock' view of The Canon.
Though of course they were Holmes and Watson in those days

Liberty · November 13, 2015 11:15 pm

Holmeson? Watsolmes?

nakahara · November 13, 2015 11:23 pm

Watmes.

tonnaree · November 14, 2015 1:05 am

Behind closed doors they called each other sweetheart..............*swoon*

SusiGo · November 14, 2015 10:21 am

And I love when they simply call each other "Sherlock" and "John" because in this universe it is something very special.

besleybean · November 14, 2015 10:52 am

I think that was definitely one of the best decisions Mark and Steven made.
You need to feel that love.

tonnaree · November 14, 2015 1:51 pm

SusiGo wrote:
And I love when they simply call each other "Sherlock" and "John" because in this universe it is something very special.

I agree. Names carry a lot of weight in their universe.

SusiGo · November 14, 2015 10:17 pm

I just found this very comprehensive analysis of how Holmes and Watson describe the appearance of men and women in Canon. Interesting (coincidence, universe, lazy):

https://archiveofourown.org/works/4707170

Last edited by SusiGo (November 14, 2015 10:20 pm)

Harriet · November 14, 2015 10:22 pm

Thanks, Susi

besleybean · November 14, 2015 10:24 pm

ACD isn't here to answer questions, though biographies do report his views.
But Mark, Steven, Benedict and Martin are very much alive. so we can ask them.
Besides, BBC Sherlock continues and so hopefully all will become clear.