BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » the pirate line in ASiB

tehanu · January 30, 2015 6:13 am

Hello. Yes, can you perhaps explain it to me? I won't mind not figuring it out on my own.

When Mycroft says, "My brother has the brain of a scientist or a philosopher, yet he elects to be a detective. What might we deduce about his heart?", I sort of vaguely understand what he means. It's along the lines of "he is misuing / wasting his brain, and his heart is similarly misapplied / underexercised". Fits the context. Could mean something slightly different.

But when John says he doesn't know, why does Mycroft echo that? Surely he's leading John on to a realization (the one I can't spot, haha), so his "neither do I" can't be honest. Well no problem really; why should he be honest or straightforward. But then:

Why pirate? Why "initially"?

I guess I would understand this little structure of analogies better if I remembered for sure how Mycroft feels about Sherlock's work. Can you spell it out to me somebody? Thanks!

Liberty · January 30, 2015 7:44 am

I'm not sure, but I thought it might mean that despite pretences, he's interested in people, and he cares. He could have lived in a cerebral world, but he prefers to be out there dealing with human motivations, and putting the world to rights. (But it also seems to be something specifically about Irene too, as that's what they're talking about. John thinks Sherlock despises her, Mycroft thinks he's saluting her as the one woman who matters. Whatever it means, I think it's showing that Sherlock really does have a heart.).

The pirate thing - he kind of wanted to be a swashbuckling anti-hero, but was drawn to the good side - but I think there's still a bit of the pirate there in the way he rescues Irene. (I wonder if Mycroft knew? But if so, then put John through having to hide the death story?)

tehanu · January 30, 2015 7:59 am

Hey thanks. I just realized too that this was the wrong place to post it, but since you answered, it's out of my hands .

That's how it feels, yes, Mycroft telling John and the audience that Sherlock does have a heart (although they overdo it a little; if we must be reminded explicitly at all, then it would work better more understated, said less often). But it doesn't quite follow a logical pattern that I can see... And pirates are not nice. Okay, they are, but a "heartless pirate" or "heart-breaking pirate" makes more sense than a "caring pirate". Out of my head now, mister Depp.

Anyway, I can't wrap my brain around Mycroft's reasoning here. There are two contrasts: one between the detective he is and the scientist / philosopher he could be but chooses not to be (and Mycroft seems to disapprove), and the other between the pirate he "initially" wanted to be (sounds like a child's dream, very sweet and possibly slightly disturbing since it's about hearts) and the detective he's actually become.

Harriet · January 30, 2015 8:48 am

A mod can move it to the right place

Vhanja · January 30, 2015 8:53 am

I might be wrong here, but I interpreted that line more as "He was once just a regular boy wanting to be a pirate, just like anybody else". Meaning that even though Sherlock now seems almost otherworldy in his ways, as a boy he was normal, with the normal dreams a lot of boys have.

And perhaps it says something about Sherlock being drawned to adventures? Adventure, danger, following his own rules, dramatic life, being hated and loved at the same tim, having his own code of morale - well, he more or less lives like a pirate, doesn't he?

tehanu · January 30, 2015 8:58 am

Ok Liberty I got what you were saying. Thanks.

tehanu · January 30, 2015 9:02 am

Vhanja wrote:
I might be wrong here, but I interpreted that line more as "He was once just a regular boy wanting to be a pirate, just like anybody else". Meaning that even though Sherlock now seems almost otherworldy in his ways, as a boy he was normal, with the normal dreams a lot of boys have.

And perhaps it says something about Sherlock being drawned to adventures? Adventure, danger, following his own rules, dramatic life, being hated and loved at the same tim, having his own code of morale - well, he more or less lives like a pirate, doesn't he?

And since becoming a pirate was not practical, he settled for the second best thing, and maybe it even turned out better in the end. And on the side of the angels, which is apparently a small bonus after all. YES. Thank you.

Schmiezi · January 30, 2015 1:31 pm

The interesting question to me is: Why does Mycroft tell John about it?

(There is an answer to it within the M-theory that works for me, but maybe someone else does have another idea here.)

Vhanja · January 30, 2015 1:53 pm

I think he tells John about it because John seems interested in Sherlock - as a person.

I don't know what the M-theory is.

Davina · January 30, 2015 2:57 pm

Well, pirates operated both within and outside the law and their lawlessness or otherwise depended upon your viewpoint and nationality. For example: during the reign of Elizabeth l pirates were officially encouraged. They were 'privateers' (hence the corrupted form 'pirate'). They were used by the state as a source of harassment against the Spanish and their galleons, especially in the Caribbean. Whilst pirates are sometimes seen as being violent and dangerous they have also had a certain mystique and glamour. As a child he may have been attracted by all those things: being the outsider but needed by the establishment, being glamorous, being a bit 'mad, bad and dangerous to know', being a real 'swashbuckler'.

I think Mycroft is suggesting that these qualities are still alive and well (if subsumed) in Sherlock.

Schmiezi · January 30, 2015 4:00 pm

Vhanja wrote:
I don't know what the M-theory is.

It's a very interesting meta that links certain characters to others because they share the same theme in the soundtrack. See here:

http://archiveofourown.org/works/1295917

Last edited by Schmiezi (January 30, 2015 4:01 pm)

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January 30, 2015 6:13 am #1

the pirate line in ASiB

January 30, 2015 7:44 am #2

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January 30, 2015 7:59 am #3

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January 30, 2015 8:48 am #4

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January 30, 2015 8:53 am #5

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January 30, 2015 8:58 am #6

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January 30, 2015 9:02 am #7

Re: the pirate line in ASiB

Vhanja wrote:

January 30, 2015 1:31 pm #8

Re: the pirate line in ASiB

January 30, 2015 1:53 pm #9

Re: the pirate line in ASiB

January 30, 2015 2:57 pm #10

Re: the pirate line in ASiB

January 30, 2015 4:00 pm #11

Re: the pirate line in ASiB

Vhanja wrote:

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