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December 17, 2014 8:23 pm  #21


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

This is really OT but I have been wondering about the whole money thing. Mycroft is clearly very well-off if you look at his house.
What really struck me was the Watsons flat/house and the car we see in HLV. I think it is an Audi if I am not mistaken, a very expensive car, a lavish wedding (with no parents paying for it). And real estate in London is very costly. Mary works as a nurse/receptionist, not an exactly well-paid job. John had financial problems in series 1 and gave up working at the surgery if I am not mistaken. He works as a GP now. No idea how well paid they are in London but they seem to have come into money somehow. 


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December 17, 2014 8:25 pm  #22


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

GPs are loaded.


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December 17, 2014 8:46 pm  #23


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

I know there have been speculations that Mycroft works more or less as an accountant for Sherlock. Not giving him allowances, but handling his finances, investments etc. Sherlock could probably never bother with something that tedious, and it's in Mycroft's interest to make sure Sherlock do ok financely. 


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December 17, 2014 9:32 pm  #24


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

GPs, it depends.  If they're partners (I don't think John would be) then it could be quite a lot.  But it would be well above the national average.   A part-time practice nurse would not get paid much.  John might have some money if he was medically discharged from the army - not sure about that.   Between John and Mary, they'd have a decent income, but yes, living in London is very expensive and the wedding would have cost a bomb. 

Alll of them (Sherlock, John, Mary ... Mrs Hudson) seem to wear more expensive than average clothes.

 

December 17, 2014 9:33 pm  #25


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

SusiGo wrote:

No idea how well paid they are in London but they seem to have come into money somehow. 

I have two theories about this. They are not mutually independent.

1) Mary has money from her past that she told John was an inheritance from her late parents, which she was saving for occasions like this.
2) John started handling the finances as he and Sherlock worked more together, insisted clients start paying, and got a cut from each case.

As for Mycroft, there's no way he got rich working in the civil service. Moftiss was originally going in a different direction with the Holmes boys' upbringing, which would have had them Holmes family as being well off and his house being the family seat. Now that that's no longer the case, I'm guessing he gets his money from freelance consulting work. I was a Canadian public servant for years and worked in Mycroft's field. Our civil service isn't that different from the Brits' (same oath to the Queen and all that), so I have an idea of the pay scales and limits to which you can consult and get supplemental income without gaining suspicion, so this theory works for my head canon.

Mary

 


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December 17, 2014 10:14 pm  #26


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

I had the same idea, Mary. 

I was just going to suggest that Mary has plenty of money from her past hit-jobs and that she lied to John that she inherited all the bucks from her wealthy American aunt. 


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December 18, 2014 6:36 am  #27


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

I personally think John will have paid for the wedding.
A massive loan could have been taken out to pay for it...this is not at all unusual.

Last edited by besleybean (December 18, 2014 6:37 am)


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December 18, 2014 7:34 am  #28


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

I think it would be unusual (or unexpected) for those characters.  I don't get the idea that they're craving public attention, they have no family to invite (apart from one person who doesn't attend), few friends of their own.

 

December 18, 2014 1:10 pm  #29


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

besleybean wrote:

I personally think John will have paid for the wedding.
A massive loan could have been taken out to pay for it...this is not at all unusual.

 
I could always be wrong but I think they must've shared the costs.  My husband and I were both in our late 30's when we got married and we payed for everything together.  For people of a certain age it just makes the most sense.


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December 18, 2014 2:47 pm  #30


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

SusiGo wrote:

I am not a native speaker myself but I learned on this board that Sherlock's "laterz" and "blud" are regarded as highly colloquial and not typical for his manner of speaking. Is that right?
 

 
Definitely colloquial and "OOC" for him, which is probably why he said it in the first place - for effect/shock, and to purposefully annoy Mycroft.

As for the other things...

Money
Mary probably has money of her own in her bank account saved up - possibly from her assassin jobs!

John will have an army veterans pension that goes steadily into his account and although not a vast amount, that will top up his earning as a GP. I know he couldn't afford to live on his own when he first moved to London but that was possibly more being unable to actually SUSTAIN living on his own without a job for any long period of time. He still would have had some disposable cash in the bank. Soldiers don't actually spend very much at all when they're abroad so it sort of just sits in their bank accounts and builds up.

John also would have earned cash from his jobs with Sherlock. I very much doubt that Sherlock would have just kept all the money to himself. Sherlock isn't interested in money particularly and would have been happy for John to split it seeing as they were essentially partners working together. And if you think of the amount of money they earned in Blind Banker you can imagine that some of their private jobs were very lucrative.

By the time we see John in TEH he has settled down and obviously has a full time job working as a GP. We don't know whether he runs his own practice or whether he just works at a general NHS practice but either way GPs earn a very decent amount of money, particularly ones living in London. YES, it's much more expensive to live in London, but all of the jobs are better paid in London too, so it matches up and works out OK.

They wouldn't have had any problem paying for the wedding. That would have just come out their earnings without them really noticing it much. Buying a house and getting on the property ladder is difficult, but with John being a steady earner in a respectible profession, they would definitely be able to get a mortgage, which is probably what they have. The car is a nice one but again, how much is it, really? £30,000 maybe? That's less than a third of John's yearly wages. They can afford it.

Class/Background
I always assumed Sherlock was from a posher background than John too, that was until I saw his parents! I actually think it's a rather neat idea that they've gone for. Mummy and Daddy Holmes are basically an ordinary couple who have some extraordinary genius kids. They're clearly not struggling for money as they own a nice little cottage in the countryside, but they're not sprawling estate type people either. They're not upper middle class. They're middle class. It's quite possible that both Mummy and Daddy Holmes came from working class families and they bettered themselves and worked up to have good careers and earn decent money. They actually remind me a lot of my own parents, who did exactly that, and are now middle class (which makes me middle class too).

Sherlock is quite clearly frivolous with money and he doesn't really care about it, whereas John seizes on it when it comes along and makes sure they actually earn. That makes me think John probably comes from a family where money hasn't always come that easily ie. a slightly poorer family than Sherlock's. This is just my head canon but I've always imagined that he was the first one in their family to actually go to University.

Swearing
None of the swearing used in BBC Sherlock is particularly shocking to me. I should imagine that in "real life", they both use the 'f' word a lot more frequently, Sherlock less so than John.

I really dislike it when people use the word 'bathroom' to refer to the toilet in Britain. It's an American expression, I'm quite sure. I wouldn't call it a bathroom unless there was a bath in it. I'll always remember how amusing I found it though, when we went to America and my Dad went up to someone and said "where's the loo?" and they just looked at him like he'd gone mad and said "The what?" so my Dad said, "You know, the loo...the bog..." Still nothing. Finally, my mum had to go over and rescue him to ask for the bathroom.


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April 20, 2015 2:00 pm  #31


Re: Cursing and classes - Sherlock & John

maryagrawatson wrote:

.... Mummy was a homemaker, ...

Actually, Mummy was a mathematician who wrote a book titled "The Dynamics of Combustion" before she gave up her career for her children. I always thinks "Cambridge" - both for her and Sherlock (the Natural Sciences course sure looks like fun). And most probably public school beforehand...

John shouldn't be really out of money in the first episode - Wellingtongoose (http://wellingtongoose.tumblr.com/) calculated he should have received some £ 11,000 when discharged (and then an annual pension of approx. £ 3800). He shouldn't really have debts from his studies because tuition was free back then. Assuming Sherlock managed to turn not all the well-paying clients away, Dr. John Watson should be rather well-off by now. And who knows, maybe the car was bought used... However, I still thought that the wedding was completely over the top - do British weddings normally look like this? The German weddings I've been to were a much more low-key affair.

I can add the French terminology to the loo/bathroom issue: Here it's important to ask for "les toilettes" or "les WC" ("we-ce", not "doublewe-(ce)" as the letter w would be normally pronounced"). I. e. to use the plural. "La toilette" (singular) as mentioned above, is the whole washing/grooming process. A vulgar expression, but you can hear it in "normal life" would be "les chiottes". And while I checked this, I discovered that the dictionary gives as definition "cabinet d'aisances" which I have never ever heard (or read) anywhere in 15 years in France (however, I believe I have come across "seat of ease" somewhere - maybe in O'Brian?)

As for the s*** vs. f*** - I've heard (in a DVD commentary, probably Die Hard 4) that s***was perfectly acceptable whereas f*** was banned. Which is why the uncut version of "The King's Speech" (a movie completely without sex or violence) was R-rated in the U.S. ... But things might be changing - they let a f*** slip through in one of the recent Fast & Furious.


 

 

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