I think that John and Sherlock have had comparable middle class upbringings.

Having seen the Holmes parents, I believe that Sherlock and Mycroft try to pass themselves off as 'posh', but they obviously aren't. Mummy was a homemaker, who knows what dad did, but they're still buying lottery tickets. So they're obviously not well off.

John likely has more formal education than Sherlock does. We know from TSOT that Sherlock did graduate in chemistry, but there's no evidence of any more formal schooling than that. John's a doctor, so he's gone well beyond a BA.

You're right that Sherlock doesn't swear much. We did hear him say, "P*** off" in ASIP, but he was quoting other people. He did very clearly to myself, friends, and Ariane DeVere, our beloved episode transcriptionist, very clearly exclaimed "F***!" when he hit the roadblock with the motorcycle in TEH and it's also implied that he quoted John as saying "F*** off" in the same episode. He does say shut up a lot, which irritates me to no end.

As for John, I can't believe that the BBC allows the word s*** (as in defecation), which John says in ASIB when Mycroft says that Sherlock took the cigarette at the morgue.

I find it interesting that Sherlock uses the word 'toilet' while John uses the word 'loo.'

I've caught Sherlock making making grammatical mistakes, most notably in ASIB ("Did you know there were other people after her too, Mycroft, before you sent John and I in there?"). I can't even think of one instance off the top of my head that John has. This is likely just a writer's error, but it bugs me to no end.

Mary

This is interesting and not something I know a lot about, but here's my opinion anyway (and I'm sure there are details I can't remember or have missed!).  I think they're both some form of middleclass, but class isn't as clearcut in the UK as it used to be. 

John's ex-army and I've met ex-army officers who have a "posh" accent, regardless of their background.  It seems to be more of an "army officer" background.  And of course, they often don't stay around in the town they were brought up in, and they mix with people from different backgrounds, so I suppose the native accent is more likely to go.   So it's possible that he could have come from a working class background originally.

Mycroft and Sherlock come across as being public school (i.e. a school that charges fees rather than a free state-run one - I'm just mentioning that because I think the phrase "public school" must sound like the opposite of what it is to anyone not in the know!), but it's not a given. 

Sherlock's mum seems to be highly educated - middle class.  The cottage doesn't look like council/social housing - middle class. (And depending on where it is, it could be a very expensive dwelling!)  Both his parents are "well spoken" - likely middle class. 

John would be social class 1 (used to be A) by occupation.  I don't know if there's a class for consulting detectives, but he's probably a 1 too. 

There is a time and a place,...but they are just words!

'Bog' is one of the more polite Brit slang terms for a toilet.
I also don't like 'bathroom', unless it actulaly HAS a bath in it!

Oh, I don't know.  You can have a bit of a sitdown and a read of the paper - sounds like a rest to me!

No, I'm kidding - it does seem incredibly coy.   Although I suppose even "toilet" and "loo" are kind of euphemisms originally. 

Wow, I'm confused. If I were to politely ask an Englisman to use their facilities, I would probably ask "where's the bathroom? Loo seems to be as a very informal slang word that I wouldn't use in front of someone I don't know well. And I would never use a word like bog!

And thank you for clearing up the bit about public school. Public school is to me the state school, as opposed to private school, which is non-state and costs a fee.

Not easy being a foreigner in England and know all the nuances...

To my foreign ears, Sherlock speaks more "posh" (in lack of a better word) than John. Is that just me hearing hallucinations, or does anybody else hear the same?

I know toilet originally referred to the whole washing processs...but to me it still seems the best term to use for the evacuation process!

Yeah, in Norway "toalett" would be the form word, and it means the ceramiic thingy itself. The informal use is "do", which I guess it's the same as "loo".

Hm, I thought Benedict spoke just as "posh" as Sherlock (except he curses more). Sherlock just speaks more... technical/scienc-y.

I know and I hate using 'potty' for adults!

Funny, in my original country, we still use WC (is the informal to the toilet), especially when is not a whole bathroom. Does any english country use WC as a name anymore? 

I find funny that in Germany some women say " i have to go for the little girls" . It does sound weird translated in english thought (and is very informal, like potty i supose). 

Question: Is Jesus! or Christ! seen as cursing in UK? In my original country is just a sign of surprise or upset, but not cursing or seen as vulgar (or my grand grand mother has cursing a lot without me knowing it , lol).

As for Sherlock vs John: from the show we see that Sherlock has no anxity that he won't have the money for the bills or rent and gives his credit card very easy to John, while John is plagued by worries about money. Sherlock doesn't work for money with the police and perhaps start to get money from clients when is pushed by John (as we see at the Bank).  So it seems to me that Sherlock, despite having a job in which money doesn't come regularly has some savings, while John has not. While in army for so many years, John should have earn quite ok, he doesn't seem someone who would spend easily his money, so perhaps he had to pay back his uni /school. In HLV we get the information that he has 10% debt - what does this mean? If John parents are dead like is implied by their absence at the wedding (plus the deleted scene in the Chronicles), he didn't inherited too much, so i suppose his parents were not very well-off.

It might be that Sherlock gets money from Mycroft, which is very clearly very well-off. 

 

Last edited by A lovely light (December 17, 2014 6:36 pm)