BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Doctor Who

Liberty · October 25, 2014 4:56 pm

Peter Capaldi's Doctor Who is more like Sherlock.

“Well, I’ve had his voice in my head since Local Hero came out in 1980-whatever-it-was. I think the key note Steven gave was that whereas the other Doctors tell you what they’re doing, he’ll keep things to himself for a while. Matt would tell you everything, but [Capaldi’s Doctor] keeps the process to himself until he acts on it.”It’s an approach that Boyce believes echoes another of Moffat’s hyperintelligent leading men. “I guess that’s more like Sherlock Holmes,” Cottrell-Boyce notes, “you know the wheels are turning in his head, but he’s not really letting you in on the process.”

I'm really loving this incarnation, but I'm sure the "not letting us in" business is going to get frustrating (as it sometimes does with Sherlock)!

Looking forward to tonight's episode .

Russell · October 25, 2014 11:53 pm

Liberty wrote:
Peter Capaldi's Doctor Who is more like Sherlock.

“Well, I’ve had his voice in my head since Local Hero came out in 1980-whatever-it-was. I think the key note Steven gave was that whereas the other Doctors tell you what they’re doing, he’ll keep things to himself for a while. Matt would tell you everything, but [Capaldi’s Doctor] keeps the process to himself until he acts on it.”It’s an approach that Boyce believes echoes another of Moffat’s hyperintelligent leading men. “I guess that’s more like Sherlock Holmes,” Cottrell-Boyce notes, “you know the wheels are turning in his head, but he’s not really letting you in on the process.”

I'm really loving this incarnation, but I'm sure the "not letting us in" business is going to get frustrating (as it sometimes does with Sherlock)!

Looking forward to tonight's episode .

Interesting. Inclined to agree with you, though… such as when he did it during the train ride of how to save Maisie/everyone without letting Gus know? Half comes across as mysterious brilliant alien-man, half just being an arse, as Clara was hurt by/rightfully points out (and yet happily runs back along with anyway, but that's another point…) You can be brilliant/sharper in personality while still throwing your friends a bone? Or is that just tv-paced plotting for you...

So looking forward to tonight's, too… neat idea! And love that Mark tweeted about the obvious literary-referenced title!

Liberty · October 26, 2014 7:33 am

They carried on the literary reference in the episode by

adding a tiger!

And carried on the Little Red Riding Hood reference by

adding a wolf! I wish they'd done more with the Red Riding Hood thing, though

Yes, "To The Moon" was another episode where the Doctor seemed to be keeping too much back. I like it sometimes in Sherlock (and in Doctor Who) when it works - I thought it was essential in TRF and ASIB. But I do like things to be explained in the end

.

I wasn't so keen on last night's episode. Possibly even my least favourite of the series.

KeepersPrice · October 26, 2014 4:58 pm

I actually really like the episode last night. Liked the theme of how humans abuse trees; but even though we treat them cruelly, they still protect us.The show moves fast and sometimes I don't catch all there is, but this episode has stayed in my mind today and I continue to mull it over. This usually means it really captured my imagination. Particularly liked that the Doctor did not bow to the pressure of giving the little girl meds, but wanted everyone to try to listen to her. Some thought provoking stuff in this episode.
For all that I like DW though, it makes me realize how glad I am that 'Sherlock' is 90 minutes and has that extra time for emotional development rather than just racing along through an exciting plot.

besleybean · October 26, 2014 5:02 pm

Good post..
I agree.

Russell · October 26, 2014 8:39 pm

Well, that was lovely (to paraphrase Maebh ). If not a bit farfetched and frustrated once or twice again with Clara's lies. I did like how they tied it in to our fairytales, some good comments made by various characters (especially the Doctor with how we treat the earth and people who are 'off') and used more of an unusual 'natural' crisis instead of monster, though!

Liberty - yes! to your spoilers. And episode commentary. Eh… tv plotting for you?

Liberty · October 27, 2014 8:42 am

This episode seems to have mixed responses! I'm not sure exactly why I didn't like it. I liked Robin of Sherwood, which was nonsense, really.

Maybe it was partly because after the previous two episodes being scary, I didn't get any sense of peril from this one, either from the world destruction point of view, or the child lost in the woods. It never felt (to me) like anybody was in any danger. The episode felt like it was filmed in a nice wood where people might walk their dogs, and there was no real sense of being in an overgrown central London. I was intrigued by Maebh's missing sister, who kept coming up, and I felt that was resolved really badly. And the idea that everybody would forget about the woods and things would be back to normal the next day (especially when clearly buildings and infrastructure had been destroyed) was frustrating!

I did like some things, and I thought the girl playing Maebh was really good.

Edit: I was just talking about this episode to somebody and they suggested that everybody forgetting about it didn't mean that everybody would magically forget it had happened. It was a reference to the way people in Doctor Who seem to forget about major events, such as a Cybermen invasion - the in-universe public carry on as if these things haven't happened.

Last edited by Liberty (October 27, 2014 2:26 pm)

Russell · October 27, 2014 5:51 pm

Wow, definitely on point, and my thoughts similar with the sister thing and people forgetting!
Maybe because, while still a neat episode/idea/certain good bits to it, it still felt slightly more unbelievably farfetched than 'Robin'?

besleybean · October 27, 2014 6:12 pm

But isn't it fantasy?!

Russell · October 28, 2014 5:13 pm

Oh, but of course. I know it sounds a little odd to say it that way about a 'fantastical' show, but you know what I mean with a plot, however fantastical or far-fetched, being more 'believable' depending on if they make it seem believable enough to you? Making it make sense in the context of what's going on.

Liberty · October 28, 2014 6:16 pm

Yes, I think all the episodes are a bit unbelievable, but some are more unbelievable than others . I never really felt onboard with Saturday's episode for some reason. Even the children sleeping in the museum at the start - why would that be allowed to happen? I think that set me off on the wrong foot. (And now somebody will tell me that their child has been on a school trip which involved sleeping in a museum!).

Russell · October 28, 2014 7:21 pm

Exactly! What I was trying to get at.
And I'm sorry, but your last sentence made me laugh a lot. May I be the first to say that I myself got to do so? Don't remember when… maybe when 8 or 9? The city's Natural History museum, as part of some educational adventure involving staying down there, but perhaps it was different because it was for just our small group of Girl Scouts (so, not some rowdy class). But it certainly left a lasting impression, remembering almost nothing about the lecture/class portion and everything about sleeping in the dark with just security lights on and the shadows of the dinosaur displays…

Liberty · October 28, 2014 7:35 pm

That's so funny! I just knew I was going to be proved wrong! It sounds like a lot of fun - I would have loved to have spent the night in a museum when I was a child. I do think that nowadays so many rules and regulations would get in the way - health and safety, fire regulations, etc. And with the school being in London, you'd expect them just to have a day trip rather than unnecessarily staying overnight.

Russell · October 28, 2014 8:24 pm

Exactly. I mean, I wish I even remembered why it was an overnight trip or the context of the whole thing, other than it being awesome or getting special tour/class outside of regular busy hours… maybe my mom might as I'm pretty sure she chaperoned. The city was only an hour away, but maybe it was just easier for timing and doing other things while down there and shuffling a whole group of girls and their stuff around.

KeepersPrice · October 29, 2014 12:32 am

I myself spent the night on the cold marble floor of the Museum of Science in Boston with a bunch of girl scouts when my daughter was little. They open it up to groups like that after hours. There are special shows and things for the kids well into the night. It was fun!

Liberty · October 29, 2014 7:24 am

So it's not far-fetched at all then! I'm so used to buildings that have to be locked up at night - and I didn't think a museum would allow a couple of teachers and some children to be there in a deserted building. But maybe they have special arrangements for for school trips. I'm kind of tempted to phone up a museum and see if they'd let me sleep over!

Edit: it turns out the Science Museum does organised sleepovers once a month! Not quite the same as the Doctor Who situation (not just one school group but many - up to 460 campers!), but I wonder if that's where the sleepover idea came from (somebody involved having a child who went to that). Sadly, they don't do an adult version.

Last edited by Liberty (October 31, 2014 7:24 am)

Liberty · November 1, 2014 9:29 pm

So now we finally know who Missy is! I didn't see that coming! I thought this was a great episode. Really dark, though,

especially, the idea that the dead are conscious and feeling while being cremated .... or being endlessly dissected by medical students. *shivers*. And the Cybermen were scary in both of the forms we saw.

Last edited by Liberty (November 1, 2014 9:49 pm)

Russell · November 2, 2014 3:20 am

Oh… For… *facepalms* Ha. Missy!! (and a thousand theorizing fans just punched the air!)
What did you guys think? How is that entire 'area' possible? (no spoilers here!)
In looking back, now, what do you think of Missy's comment at the end of Flatline, when we see her looking at video of how events ended and saying 'Clara, my girl. I have chosen well.' With what… her personality and/or ability to 'do' the kind of thing the Doctor does?

Eesh… yeah, Liberty! Unnerving mental images, too. Also didn't see that stuff coming.

Last edited by Russell (November 2, 2014 3:21 am)

Liberty · November 2, 2014 9:21 am

I'm going to have to do my research and watch

the last episodes that the Master was in, because although I saw them at the time, I can't remember exactly what happened to him! I'd a feeling that he'd kind of destroyed himself or something ... but I presume he has regenerated. And like the Doctor, could come back as any sex. If I'd known about Missy, I'd have done some catching up before watching Dark Water.

It's funny, I don't normally like the Cybermen. But seeing their insides made them a lot more sinister.

I don't know about Missy's comment - I've been thinking about that, but just not sure. It was right after Clara had kind of been the Doctor - possibly a slightly less "human" Doctor too. Interesting. I suppose an alternative might be that Missy is saying that she has chosen well herself - chosen who she is - that she will interact with the Doctor and Clara in a particular way. I don't think so though, just playing with that idea!

Last edited by Liberty (November 2, 2014 8:54 pm)

Russell · November 3, 2014 6:53 am

Ha… love your comment, again! Definitely interesting 'sinister' touches, with Cybermen, and various bits of Missy to now. And just went 'ack' in surprised thought at your suggestion. Doesn't seem quite the way that phrase is said, but I love the idea.

Yeah… true, might be nice to watch

'The End of Time' again, where basically Master dealing with the interesting 'sound of drums' he still hears and trying to take over the world (for the sake of bringing Gallifrey back, through the evil machinations of it's Lord President), by using his clones/special technology and link apparently. Doctor stops him, of course, and has to make another horrible decision, again, of not sacrificing Earth for their sake, and severs the connection between worlds. President pissed, tries to kill Doctor at the last minute, but the Master sacrifices himself, angry they used him, and their whole world is sucked back into the Time Lock, leaving Doctor alone again. So yeah, like you said, he was sort of destroyed! Until of course regenerated and been doing who knows what. Pretty good ep. Heh, um, sorry if didn't need recap! I guess could have read wiki - couldn't help self… making me think about neat scenes all over again and where did he end up…

Aw, man…! Now realizing that since then, we had the whole 'Gallifrey's not gone!' thing, for which Eleven dies after watching over them for a year and saving, Twelve takes over, not too long after it seems is when they crash to their first adventure in Victorian London (at the end of which we see Missy, with 'Heaven' apparently already set up). No mention of that darn story tease with Gallifrey all season long, til boom, hello old friend again, who somehow escaped back to Earth!?

We'll just have to wait and see how they wrap it up...