BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Johnlock: The Official Debate

besleybean · September 16, 2014 7:07 pm

@ SolarSystem

Well other than marriage and sex and producing a child, I guess.

Last edited by besleybean (September 16, 2014 7:09 pm)

SolarSystem · September 16, 2014 7:12 pm

Always depends on what a marriage like the one he's having right now means to you. In my opinion it's a farce. And concerning the baby, I'll just lean back and wait and see.

Liberty · September 16, 2014 7:14 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
Liberty wrote:
Is there a required amount of people John has to date to know that he's attracted to women? Not everybody is dating all the time. I think it's well established that he dates women, and that's probably enough. We don't need to see every woman and know every name.
Right, we don't need to see every woman and know every name - but John should know the names of the women he's dating! And he doesn't, or at least he's confusing them with one another (as somebody else already pointed out). Why is that? Because he's so damn serious about going out with them?
Sorry, but I can't take it seriously when a man doesn't even know that the woman he's currently dating doesn't have a dog. Yes, he is dating women, and maybe he is dating them for all the wrong reasons. Yes, we can't look inside his head, but when it comes to John Watson's heart I have quite a few difficulties in believing that he will ever find the woman. Doesn't mean that he will end up in a romantic relationship with Sherlock, but so far there is so much more that unites him with Sherlock than with any woman we've ever seen him with.

But you don't need to know names and life details to have sexual attraction. It's quite basic. People have one night stands and can't remember the name in the morning. It doesn't mean they didn't fancy them. It only shows that he isn't serious about that particular woman. I agree that he has a stronger pull to Sherlock, but it just doesn't seem to be sexual.

SolarSystem · September 16, 2014 7:32 pm

Which brings us back to the point that the fact that John doesn't seem to be sexually attracted to Sherlock (and in my opinion he is sexually attracted to Sherlock, but I'll just ignore this for a second) doesn't mean that he doesn't fancy him. In whatever way.

nakahara · September 16, 2014 7:37 pm

Liberty wrote:
nakahara wrote:
But how do you establish that a dream is sexual? What are it´s defining features? Face and a voice of a beloved one and your first meeting that at the time fullfilled you with excitement is not enough? So what other things or symbolic images must it include to be seen as such?
To tell the audience that it's sexual - a kiss would be enough, it doesn't need to be explicit. Actually, that would be some scene, to start of S4 with them kissing, and us then to find out it's John dreaming .... or maybe not. Face and voice aren't enough to let us know, unless the voice was whispering things like "because I took your pulse", etc.

Your criteria are a bit rigid, aren´t they?

This conversation reminds me of an Arabian fairy tale, in which a poet, Al-Asmaí, had to judge which girl loves her boy the most - according to their poems, in which the first sentence was the same and the next one a variation.

First girl said:
"In a a dream your face appeared to me
- oh, if I could only see it in a day as well!"

The second girl recited:
"In a dream your face appeared to me
- then your scent, inebriating me like wine."

The third one composed this:
"In a dream your face appeared to me
- then you took me to your arms and slept with me."

The third girl won because according to Al-Asmaí, if she slept with her boy in a dream, her love was the strongest. He had the same view on those things as you.

If I was a judge in that contest, I wouldn´t know whom to give a price - because in my eyes all three girls were equally in love.

I see it similar when judging John´s dream - for me he doesn´t need to witness Sherlock´s kiss, or to listen to him whisper "I took your pulse". To see his face in a dream and to wish that he saw the same face during the day is enough for me as a sign of his desire.

Liberty wrote:
nakahara wrote:
Homophobia is one thing - the social expectations are another. If you see a TV trailer on a new rom-com what are your chances that it will be about gay, not hererosexual couple? The same with romantic books or Tv series - how many of them would feature gay couples? Harlequin novels being sold in the shops here and there - ever seen the one about gays? I guess not - the cultural depiction of a loving relationship still centers on a man-woman relationships in 99 cases out of 100. It is something stongly ingrained in our culture itself. And that´s what I was speaking about - that people authomatically await that a romantic relationship will take place between a man and a woman, not between two blokes.

Yes, there are still battles to be won (for other minority groups too), but I don't think that's what they're showing on the show. (Mark Gatiss is older than John, but doesn't feel the need to date women to hide his sexuality - but he will have seen the changes for the better which I think the show reflects). There could be more gay characters on the show, but at least it's acknowledged - Harry, the comments, one of the cases in the blog, etc.

Oh, but I was not speaking about this show being homophobic or asking them to include token gays. I was just citing this as a possible motivation for why John feels neccessary to surround himself with women (even if he sometimes treat them as mere accessories, not remembering which is which) - to appear manly, to appear normal. Because that´s what our society expects from a man.

tonnaree · September 16, 2014 7:38 pm

I once worked for a man who defined himself as gay but married his (female) best friend and had kids with her because they decided they wanted to raise a family together. They both had sexual partners outside the marriage.

Just saying.

lil · September 16, 2014 7:55 pm

@The dream...interesting..
I think it's a bit of a nightmare..a callback to opening scene where John dreamt about being shot on the battlefield...Johns new battlefield was with Sherlock...where Sherlock got kinda shot too..so prob John has new nightmares and had them while Sherlock was dead/away...thats why he wants to see him@misses him when he wakes..
Its like the hat deduction scene in TEH..Sherlock can make new kinds of deductions...about being lonely..because he was lonely while he was away....back in HLV..we see Sherlock misses @ wants to see John too...I wonder how easy it was for Sherlock to find the drugs den Johns neighbour used..and then choose to crash right next to him..and how long he had to wait for JW to turn up....coincidence no..part of his ..'trying to recruit you....'..

@John and relationships..he doesn't seem to do them at all..it's unusual for a army guy not to have a regiment of friends....just seems to be the one on the blog and sholto tht lasted..he doesn't even see his family ..so the dating thing prob more about sex than looking for a relationship.

@maintaining the straight guy only persona...even if had gay or bi tendencies when young...that would have been illegal when he joined the army..so if that was his ambition...he would have to keep it closeted....maybe the three continents thing is / was part of a deliberate rep.....

Last edited by lil (September 16, 2014 8:15 pm)

nakahara · September 16, 2014 8:03 pm

lil wrote:
@John and relationships..he doesn't seem to do them at all..it's unusual for a army guy not to have a regiment of friends....just seems to be the one on the blog and sholto tht lasted..he doesn't even see his family ..so the dating thing prob more about sex tha looking for a relationship.

@maintaining the straight guy only persona...even if had gay or bi tendencies when young...that would have been illegal when he joined the army..so if that was his ambition...he would have to keep it closeted....maybe the three continents thing is / was part of a deliberate rep.....

Very good points, I think! You nailed it.

Liberty · September 16, 2014 8:45 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
Which brings us back to the point that the fact that John doesn't seem to be sexually attracted to Sherlock (and in my opinion he is sexually attracted to Sherlock, but I'll just ignore this for a second) doesn't mean that he doesn't fancy him. In whatever way.

Isn't it the same thing? (Fancying somebody and being sexually attracted to them?). (Sorry, if I'm not understanding you).

nakahara wrote:
I see it similar when judging John´s dream - for me he doesn´t need to witness Sherlock´s kiss, or to listen to him whisper "I took your pulse". To see his face in a dream and to wish that he saw the same face during the day is enough for me as a sign of his desire.

But you're coming at from the point of view of seeing sex there. I'm saying that for the rest of us, if the writers wanted us to see the dream as sexual, they'd need to show something more explicit. Even if they'd just shown Sherlock in the sheet, I'd have raised an eyebrow and wondered. But I've watched it again and I think Besleybean is right. It shows Sherlock acknowledging John's need for excitement and danger, one key thing that draws John to him. That's what it's about, not sex.

Liberty wrote:
Oh, but I was not speaking about this show being homophobic or asking them to include token gays. I was just citing this as a possible motivation for why John feels neccessary to surround himself with women (even if he sometimes treat them as mere accessories, not remembering which is which) - to appear manly, to appear normal. Because that´s what our society expects from a man.

But there's nothing in the show that suggests he's doing that. Nobody else is doing it. Sherlock (who he admires) doesn't have a single date. Mycroft certainly doesn't. LeStrade has some sort of dysfunctional relationship with a wife. Mike - who knows? The only guy I can think of off-hand who is having some casual sex is Anderson, at the beginning. Clearly, nobody gives a stuff if John is dating or not. He does it because he likes women.

lil wrote:
@The dream...interesting..
I think it's a bit of a nightmare..a callback to opening scene where John dreamt about being shot on the battlefield...Johns new battlefield was with Sherlock...where Sherlock got kinda shot too..so prob John has new nightmares and had them while Sherlock was dead/away...thats why he wants to see him@misses him when he wakes..
Its like the hat deduction scene in TEH..Sherlock can make new kinds of deductions...about being lonely..because he was lonely while he was away....back in HLV..we see Sherlock misses @ wants to see John too...I wonder how easy it was for Sherlock to find the drugs den Johns neighbour used..and then choose to crash right next to him..and how long he had to wait for JW to turn up....coincidence no..part of his ..'trying to recruit you....'..

I like your thoughts on that (although I think Sherlock was genuinely on a case in the drug den, and the setup seems complicated - but whether or not that was planned, I think he would have contacted John anyway once the story went public).

@John and relationships..he doesn't seem to do them at all..it's unusual for a army guy not to have a regiment of friends....just seems to be the one on the blog and sholto tht lasted..he doesn't even see his family ..so the dating thing prob more about sex than looking for a relationship.

Yes, the dating is about sex . I agree that he's not too good at making friends, etc., so I think he does quite well to find people to date (at least a couple are through work).

@maintaining the straight guy only persona...even if had gay or bi tendencies when young...that would have been illegal when he joined the army..so if that was his ambition...he would have to keep it closeted....maybe the three continents thing is / was part of a deliberate rep.....

See above - there is no backstory like that given and there's nothing in John's current world to make him feel that he should date women unless he wants to. It would be a ridiculous charade to keep up. No, he does it because he fancies women, I'm sure..

Last edited by Liberty (September 16, 2014 8:50 pm)

nakahara · September 16, 2014 9:10 pm

Liberty wrote:
nakahara wrote:
I see it similar when judging John´s dream - for me he doesn´t need to witness Sherlock´s kiss, or to listen to him whisper "I took your pulse". To see his face in a dream and to wish that he saw the same face during the day is enough for me as a sign of his desire.
But you're coming at from the point of view of seeing sex there. I'm saying that for the rest of us, if the writers wanted us to see the dream as sexual, they'd need to show something more explicit. Even if they'd just shown Sherlock in the sheet, I'd have raised an eyebrow and wondered. But I've watched it again and I think Besleybean is right. It shows Sherlock acknowledging John's need for excitement and danger, one key thing that draws John to him. That's what it's about, not sex.

If you rewatch that dream sequence, you will see that John´s dream is very stormy, filled with combat and shooting... up to the moment when Sherlock appears in it. After that there is suddenly a sense of calm, of security in that dream, all loud shouts and strife disappear and Sherlock dominates the vision as some messenger of bliss... he does not bring John excitement but the opposite - the sense of belonging, of security and peace. Just as a loved one would in such circumstances.

Liberty wrote:
nakahara wrote:
Oh, but I was not speaking about this show being homophobic or asking them to include token gays. I was just citing this as a possible motivation for why John feels neccessary to surround himself with women (even if he sometimes treat them as mere accessories, not remembering which is which) - to appear manly, to appear normal. Because that´s what our society expects from a man.
But there's nothing in the show that suggests he's doing that. Nobody else is doing it. Sherlock (who he admires) doesn't have a single date. Mycroft certainly doesn't. LeStrade has some sort of dysfunctional relationship with a wife. Mike - who knows? The only guy I can think of off-hand who is having some casual sex is Anderson, at the beginning. Clearly, nobody gives a stuff if John is dating or not. He does it because he likes women.

Nobody else is doing it is not exactly an argument, is it? Every person is unique. Those people do not have John´s past, his trauma from Afghanistan, his distrust towards people, his past in the army, his insecurity towards his place in the world... John tries to find that place by deciding to lead a life of an ordinary doctor, but that wish comes to bite him in the ass very soon after he tries to practice it. Because he only forced that role on himself - it was not in his heart to begin with.

Liberty wrote:
@maintaining the straight guy only persona...even if had gay or bi tendencies when young...that would have been illegal when he joined the army..so if that was his ambition...he would have to keep it closeted....maybe the three continents thing is / was part of a deliberate rep.....
See above - there is no backstory like that given and there's nothing in John's current world to make him feel that he should date women unless he wants to. It would be a ridiculous charade to keep up. No, he does it because he fancies women, I'm sure..

But, yes, there is. John feels secure appearing normal, he forces himself to have normal life as we can judge from his marriage to Mary, althrough right then we witness him suffering for it, wishing for a different kind of life where he has adventure and Sherlock - the real things his heart strives for. He could have those things right away, yet he forces on himself that false persona of an ordinary middle-class doctor. That speaks volumes about how he desires one thing but outwardly does the opposite, trying to conform to the rules of society. As we can see in HLV, that does not make him happy. This is not his real wish.

Last edited by nakahara (September 16, 2014 9:11 pm)

Zatoichi · September 17, 2014 12:29 am

Oh, I like "In denial", "forcing that role on himself" and "trying to conform to society´s pressure" - instant remedies for deviant behaviour.^^

He´s dating women - look at that poor guy weighed down by society´s pressure to surround himself with females.
He´s looking at naked women on his computer - desperately trying to reassure himslef of his heterosexuality.
He continues denying a relationship with Sherlock (that society kind of forces on him) - The Lady doth protest too much!
He just gives a resigned look to the Innkeeper - Ha, he isn´t even denying it anymore!
He says that of course he marries a woman - Oh John, how deep you are in denial, what has your time in the army done to you.
He continues to marry Mary although his love is back - He is still so hurt, he has to numb down the feelings of rekindled desire and flee into marriage, oh John, poor John..

^^ I´d feel bad for him if he was a real person, the poor guy just can´t win.. ^^

(Just to be sure I´m not making fun of anyone who prefers that explanation, just everything I´ve ever read about John being so repressed and in denial kept popping up in my head and formed some fun combinations and hyperboles - no offense!)

Last edited by Zatoichi (September 17, 2014 1:23 am)

Zatoichi · September 17, 2014 1:08 am

nakahara wrote:
But, yes, there is. John feels secure appearing normal, he forces himself to have normal life as we can judge from his marriage to Mary, althrough right then we witness him suffering for it, wishing for a different kind of life where he has adventure and Sherlock - the real things his heart strives for. He could have those things right away, yet he forces on himself that false persona of an ordinary middle-class doctor. That speaks volumes about how he desires one thing but outwardly does the opposite, trying to conform to the rules of society. As we can see in HLV, that does not make him happy. This is not his real wish.

Or, I don´t know, maybe he just picked any job that would give him an income without too much additional stress while recovering from emotional trauma.. and now he knows he could have his old life back (which we all know he craves), but just giving up a secure life like that is not an easy decision to make in his age and life situation - with a baby on the way and all that.. and it haunts his dreams and keeps him up at night. But I´ll freely admit your interpretation with the false persona sounds juicier. ^^

Last edited by Zatoichi (September 17, 2014 2:07 am)

SolarSystem · September 17, 2014 4:44 am

Liberty wrote:
SolarSystem wrote:
Which brings us back to the point that the fact that John doesn't seem to be sexually attracted to Sherlock (and in my opinion he is sexually attracted to Sherlock, but I'll just ignore this for a second) doesn't mean that he doesn't fancy him. In whatever way.
Isn't it the same thing? (Fancying somebody and being sexually attracted to them?). (Sorry, if I'm not understanding you).

No, it's not, at least not exclusively (as far as I know). It can also just mean that you like someone or something very much, for all sorts of reasons. Brainy is the new sexy, if you like.
But like I said, I personally see sexual attraction there, and the fact that John dates women (not very successfully) doesn't change that perception of mine. Your comparison of those women and the fact that John can't tell them apart to a one night stand is rather telling, if you ask me. Following that comparison he might be sexually attracted to them, but not much more. And I'm so glad that I see so much more than just sexual attraction when I look at him and Sherlock. How boring would that be: sexual attraction and nothing else, the show about a detective and his blogger would have been over after three episodes.

Liberty · September 17, 2014 6:27 am

Nakahara, Sherlock is a loved one. (Just not a lover ). And the things you mention (a sense of belonging, security and peace) don't strike me as overtly sexual (and it's got to be overtly sexual if the writers wanted us to see it).    Those are things that we already know about his relationship with Sherlock and his attitude to danger - that's all established in the first episode. Mycroft confirms that it calms him, rather than stresses him.   It's a twist on the idea of a traumatised soldier having nightmares after the war - in John's case he has those dreams because he's missing it (the characters confirm that). Sherlock fills that gap for him. (When you walk with Sherlock Holmes you see the battlefield ... You're not haunted by the war, Doctor Watson, you miss it).

Post-TRF, I do think it's a flaw that John doesn't try to seek out anything else to replace that.   But I think it's just because indulging that need caused him such pain - he lost Sherlock.   However, it's not about what people think. He doesn't care what people think - he's loyal to Sherlock through TRF and beyond, regardless. He doesn't mind being associated with somebody thought to be a murderer and child abductor. He won't deny him.   He's hardly going to plan to marry somebody just to cover up the fact that he's gay, in a world where it's fine to be gay.

And it does matter that it's fine to be gay in that world, if you're saying that the writers are trying to tell us that John is under such extreme pressure to hide his sexuality that he not only keeps it quiet for years but dates women and even marries a woman, just to hide from some disapproval that clearly doesn't exist in the story.   If other people don't care about John's sexuality and John himself doesn't care what people think, then why on earth would he create a cover-up? We need to be given a reason why it would be imperative for him to deceive those women and live a lie, and we're not.

@Solar, I see - I've been using the terms interchangeably. If I say I fancy somebody, it means I'm sexually attracted to them.   So, no, John does like, love and admire Sherlock, but he doesn't fancy him (that I see). When he does have sexual relationships, he seeks out women.

Last edited by Liberty (September 17, 2014 6:29 am)

SusiGo · September 17, 2014 6:46 am

About the dream - strangely enough, there seem to be quite a lot of people detecting sexually overtones here. So it does not have to be in bold lettering for everyone to see it.

Again, IMO John is not gay so what he says is strictly no lie. He is attraced to women and men/a man, i.e. Sherlock. So he actually is not covering up anything by dating women, he is not deceiving anyone (but himself?). He is interested enough to date them but not interested enough to build up a stable relationship or to move out of Baker Street. After Irene he gives up his halfhearted attempts with the exception of Louise Mortimer in HoB which is for a case and instigated by Sherlock. He only moves out after Sherlock has died. This traumatic event is what it takes John to leave Baker Street and finally start a long-term relationship with a woman.

As for the reason for suppressing this part of his personality - and I know that I am moving into the field of speculation - but what about Harry? His gay sister who is an alcoholic with a broken marriage?We do not know much about her, just that she is gay and an unhappy person with whom he seems to have issues. That much is fact. We do not know what it means for John's own life. But even his rare contacts with his family - the Christmas plans in ASiB and the wedding invitation in TSoT - came to nothing.

Last edited by SusiGo (September 17, 2014 6:46 am)

Liberty · September 17, 2014 7:07 am

I'm getting confused by the different explanations. I've got to ask - what's wrong with the very simplest one? That John and Sherlock's love is platonic, not sexual? Doesn't that just very easily explain everything - why they don't have sex, why they're comfortable together, why John dates women, etc? There's nothing in the story that needs to be explained by a sexual attraction between them.

Anyway, not everyone sees the sex in the dream. For everyone to see it, yes, I do think it needs to be a stronger message. What I said about the dream and John's drives and his relationship with and need for Sherlock all fits into what we see in the dream, so why would I look for sex there? Where is the sex, anyway? If there's anything seductive about Sherlock with John, it's when he's luring him into working with him - the danger and excitement is their shared "thing". Not sex. So if the writers are going to convince the average viewers that this is sexual, I do think they need to be more explicit.

I don't think we now for sure how much John dates - it's enough that it's established that he does. Why would he move out of Baker Street? He loves being with Sherlock, he likes the flat, the rent is cheap and ideal. What would be the point of him moving out? He only moves out when Sherlock isn't there.

Harry's problem seems to be alcohol, not her sexuality (it's definitely alcohol that John mentions as the problem - her sexuality is "incidental"). I'd love to know more backstory about John's family, though.

Last edited by Liberty (September 17, 2014 7:08 am)

SusiGo · September 17, 2014 7:24 am

If you have a look at my posts you will see that I have always said I regard John as bisexual, not gay.

The thing with the women is that John's dating attempts constantly collide with his attachment to Sherlock.
Take Sarah: quite an unfortunate evening when you end up nearly killed by Chinese gangsters. And yet this does not discourage either of them because at the beginning of TGG they are still together (even if John sleeps on the lilo). And then, nothing.
In ASiB we get Jeanette. John cannot even remember she has no dog from which she concludes that someone else must be far more important in his life.
The string of women Sherlock enumerates do not even have names.
He hits on Anthea, he hits on Irene's messenger, he seems to be constantly on the scout but the only stable thing in his life is Sherlock and their life at Baker Street.

Sherlock is, as you correctly said, the very centre of his life. To quote ACD his "one fixed point". Is that not enough to establish a relationship that is more important than all everything else for John? Sherlock saved him from a lonely existence in which he felt he was nobody, in which nothing ever happened to him.
Sex or not, I cannot see anyone else providing this for him. And I cannot see ever being happy while living with someone else (because I think we can agree that he is not happy in his marriage).

nakahara · September 17, 2014 7:29 am

Zatoichi wrote:
Oh, I like "In denial", "forcing that role on himself" and "trying to conform to society´s pressure" - instant remedies for deviant behaviour.^^

He´s dating women - look at that poor guy weighed down by society´s pressure to surround himself with females.
He´s looking at naked women on his computer - desperately trying to reassure himslef of his heterosexuality.
He continues denying a relationship with Sherlock (that society kind of forces on him) - The Lady doth protest too much!
He just gives a resigned look to the Innkeeper - Ha, he isn´t even denying it anymore!
He says that of course he marries a woman - Oh John, how deep you are in denial, what has your time in the army done to you.
He continues to marry Mary although his love is back - He is still so hurt, he has to numb down the feelings of rekindled desire and flee into marriage, oh John, poor John..

^^ I´d feel bad for him if he was a real person, the poor guy just can´t win.. ^^

(Just to be sure I´m not making fun of anyone who prefers that explanation, just everything I´ve ever read about John being so repressed and in denial kept popping up in my head and formed some fun combinations and hyperboles - no offense!)

I did not mean those things in such an extreme manner (but I guess you know it). But essentially, yes, some of those can be easily read as a sign of John´s repression and self-denial. Why do so many of his dates end in disaster? It cannot be all Sherlock´s doing. If he wanted to lead a married life, why is he not happy when he reached his goal - that´s what he wanted all along, didn´t he? And he is not happy - the moment he start to live as a married man, he incredibly deteriorates, starts projecting violent tendencies, all of his warm-hearted kind persona is gone and is replaced by the grumpy, angry, hostile individual. Why? John has everything a normal man wants - please, explain, why is he not in bliss, but seems as if a world had ended for him?

My explanation is that he tried to conform to the norm of normal middle-class life with that - yes, because it´s much more secure than chasing criminals through the streets, as you correctly pointed out in your next post - but in his heart he would rather have this other kind of life and rather have Sherlock than any of his women. John as we see him in HLV is distincly struggling between those two facets of his character, between his two "faces" he shows to the world. Please, don´t tell me you never saw similar people in real life.

Or, OK, you want the real-life example of a bisexual man whose life was a similar struggle and whose "admirers" to this very day deny his bisexuality? We must not go very far towards him, because he is featured on this site quite frequently. His name is Jeremy Brett. And here is some article aimed at his "fans" who want to deny this part of his life:

http://jeremybrett.livejournal.com/285844.html

SusiGo · September 17, 2014 7:39 am

Thank you for posting, nakahara, I did not know about that.

And I fully agree with your interpretation of John's behaviour at the very beginning of his marriage. We do not see a happy man. And the thing is that they could have done without that, the drug den scene would have worked without presenting us with all those signs of frustration and anger. But the writers chose to show it for some reason.

SolarSystem · September 17, 2014 7:53 am

Liberty wrote:
I'm getting confused by the different explanations. I've got to ask - what's wrong with the very simplest one?

And I've got to ask: Why does the most simple explanation (or what you consider to be the most simple explanation) have to be the right one (if we're talking about wrong or right here)...?
You make it sound as if Johnlockers are going out of their way to find an explanation for Johnlock that makes sense. Please believe me when I'm saying: I see what I see and I feel what I feel when I watch the show. I don't feel anything when I see John and Mary together. Yes, I know that John is married to Mary at the end of S3 - but I don't feel it. What I see and feel when I see Sherlock and John on screen on the other hand is a completely different thing, it makes total sense to me. It's as simple as that.