BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

SusiGo · June 6, 2014 8:59 pm

lil wrote:
Maybe OT ...but I keep seeing here comments....John@Mary were romantic.....
So....uh...where...when...sleeping together they could have been brother and sister..all their conversations are snarky....John has never looked so bored as he did sat next to Mary at his wedding table...until Sherlock perked him up...and he ran away..so ok the waltz....that Sherlock wrote..orchestrated and taught John to dance.
Hmmmmm.
Mary@John romantic....Where...When. ...I blinked.

Yes. Just yes. My impression and not only in HLV.

besleybean · June 6, 2014 9:00 pm

Again I apologise, I was just trying to indicate the kind of relationship or the status.
But ok, John and Mary are married...is what I mean.
Sherlock isn't and I don't think he will be, or live with a partner, or date or have casual relationships.
Oh and yes Susi, I agree with you on your 2nd point.

Last edited by besleybean (June 6, 2014 9:02 pm)

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 2:23 am

besleybean wrote:
I certainly don't think we'll see any romance for Sherlock and we've had John's, with Mary.

I don't think I see "romance" in what we were given of John and Mary's relationship. I do see that there probably was some, up till the evening that Sherlock made like Lazarus, emerging from his tomb-- after all, John set up a pretty romantic-looking setting for the proposal he'd planned. But the rest, the John-Mary dynamic we were actually shown, all were pretty Twilight-Zoney, even the wedding itself, with Sherlock being so strange and hovering around as he did-- poor Mary was like a guest at her own wedding. John seemed very much pulled between her and his loyalty towards her, and Sherlock, and his loyalty to him. To John, Sherlock is his North Pole, and I believe, he always will be.

As for actual Johnlock, I don't believe we'll actually see it happen on the show. Their personal relationship just exists in this BBC canon to give the viewers a strong dose of "what if" (it's intriguing, whether or not someone "believes") and a degree of UST-- unresolved sexual tension. The writers and actors have left us languishing in the la-la land between Johnlock and no Johnlock, as it were.

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 2:26 am

SusiGo wrote:
But they will not stop Sherlock's and John's personal development which is an essential element of the show. It is not an average crime show that is all about the investigation.

I agree-- without the Sherlock/John friendship dynamic, this show would become a pale imitation of itself.

So we can only speculate in which direction they will go but I do not doubt that they will go somewhere.

It certainly will go somewhere, you got that right. And wherever that somewhere it is, it will be guaranteed to make us all howl, 'cause that's the way these writers roll.

besleybean · June 7, 2014 7:29 am

It'll go the same way as Canon.

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 1:30 pm

besleybean wrote:
It'll go the same way as Canon.

I don't know orginal ACD canon hardly at all, but my understanding is that the BBC writers are putting their own clever twists on it, in order to form their own canon. I wouldn't put *anything* past them, as long as it didn't completely betray Doyle's original vision for Sherlock. After all, simply moving the story and backstory up 100+ years from when Sherlock was first created, lots and lots of details will be different but can still stay true to the spirit of original canon. Including Sherlock taking up with John, Sherlock taking up with Molly, Sherlock taking up with Mrs. H. (bwahahahaha!), Sherlock taking up with some OC we have not yet met, or Sherlock taking up with no one, happy to spend his free time roaming his mind palace. Wherever the writers take Sherlock (and us), I'm sure it will be fun and a real adventure, and that's all that matters (to me).

Last edited by ancientsgate (June 7, 2014 1:31 pm)

Harriet · June 7, 2014 1:35 pm

besleybean wrote:
It'll go the same way as Canon.

You mean, with a lot of ejaculations?

Last edited by Harriet (June 7, 2014 1:37 pm)

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 1:51 pm

Harriet wrote:
besleybean wrote:
It'll go the same way as Canon.
You mean, with a lot of ejaculations?

Oh, do explain, Harriet. Now you have me wondering. Ejaculations? ??

besleybean · June 7, 2014 1:58 pm

It's another word for exclamations.

Harriet · June 7, 2014 2:01 pm

Here's a nice list

"Watson ‘ejaculates’ twice as often as Sherlock Holmes in Conan Doyle’s stories. There are 23 ejaculations in total, with 11 belonging to Watson. On one occasion, Holmes refers to Watson’s ‘ejaculations of wonder’ being invaluable; on another, Watson ejaculates ‘from his very heart’ in the direction of his fiancée. Holmes is only responsible for six ejaculations, although it is not clear which of the two men ejaculate in the passage below:

So he sat as I dropped off to sleep, and so he sat when a sudden ejaculation caused me to wake up, and I found the summer sun shining into the apartment. The pipe was still between his lips, the smoke still curled upward, and the room was full of a dense tobacco haze, but nothing remained of the heap of shag which I had seen upon the previous night.
The Man with the Twisted Lip, 1891

A chap called Phelps ejaculated three times during the story of The Naval Treaty. The only other ejaculator is Mrs St Clair’s husband, who ejaculates at her from a second-floor window."

Source: http://qi.com/infocloud/sherlock-holmes

More canon quotes: http://thetaleofsirbob.blogspot.de/2013/07/watson-and-other-excitable-characters.html

Last edited by Harriet (June 7, 2014 2:04 pm)

besleybean · June 7, 2014 2:04 pm

Back to Sherlock's sexuality.
Holmes and Watson did on occasion share a room(if not a bed), but it was never implied that this was anything unusual for men of limited financial means.

Harriet · June 7, 2014 2:08 pm

And in their shared room (or bed) they ejaculated, according to canon

Last edited by Harriet (June 7, 2014 2:09 pm)

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 2:15 pm

besleybean wrote:
It's another word for exclamations.

So it is. But startlingly, glaringly..... different from the commonly-used meaning of the word. Got my attention, anyway.

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 2:16 pm

Harriet wrote:
And in their shared room (or bed) they ejaculated, according to canon

*giggle* I wonder if ACD had his tongue firmly planted in his cheek when he wrote that, because that is really too damned funny.

ancientsgate · June 7, 2014 2:18 pm

besleybean wrote:
Back to Sherlock's sexuality.
Holmes and Watson did on occasion share a room(if not a bed), but it was never implied that this was anything unusual for men of limited financial means.

I'm sure it wasn't unusual. It still isn't, actually.

besleybean · June 7, 2014 2:20 pm

Quite.

Harriet · June 7, 2014 2:27 pm

Now, this makes me curious: Do you use this word on a daily base?

besleybean · June 7, 2014 2:30 pm

No, I think we were referring to the bed sharing of poor males.
But ejacualtion was a common word in ACD's time.

Harriet · June 7, 2014 2:32 pm

So you think bed sharing of poor males does never include ejaculations of any kind - then and now?

maryagrawatson · June 7, 2014 2:36 pm

In that time, 'making love' also had a different, more innocent, meaning. I was reading the Windibanks story last night (seen in TEH as the step-father posing as online boyfriend) and the term came up in the context of courting. I knew about it being used that way in the 19th century because I'm a fan of the Anne of Green Gables books.

Mary