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May 27, 2014 9:21 pm  #501


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

nakahara wrote:

Kitty Riley hardly counts. She followed him to the men´s loo, tried to prove he´s fake even before they have spoken together (by painting that black smudge on herself she proved that she didn´t believe in his skills and that she finds him suspicious), then she jumped into his path when he tried to leave the loo in peace after he rejected the chance of an interview and she asked him nasty questions about John´s sexuality, then vaguely threatened him... she was really a repulsive stalker who just wanted to abuse him. "You repell me" were still a very polite words for such a creature.

Yeah, Kitty, not Penny. Glad you knew who I meant, anyway.

Most of her nasty questions thing was done AFTER he said she repelled him, using such an unfriendly tone with her. I think if he'd taken her up on his offer in one of the booths in the men's,she wouldn't have resorted to that knee-jerk reaction. She probably figured, nothing ventured, nothing gained, I've done worse than have sex with a gorgeous man to get the edge on a story. I don't think she was a repulsive stalker, not at all-- wearing the deerstalker and the I heart Sherlock pin, etc, that was all fake-- she was a young, hungry reporter looking for an "in" with a potential hot story. Not the first nor the last journalist to use such techniques.

I disagree that Kitty doesn't count. She was an attractive woman, one of only a few we've seen in the show who have shown interest in Sherlock sexually. But anyway, my point was, the writers use women, dangling them under Sherlock's nose, getting some kind of reaction out of him every time, but so far, they don't actually know what makes Sherlock's sexuality tick. Or if they do, they haven't shown the viewers.
 

 

May 27, 2014 9:31 pm  #502


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

ancientsgate wrote:

nakahara wrote:

Kitty Riley hardly counts. She followed him to the men´s loo, tried to prove he´s fake even before they have spoken together (by painting that black smudge on herself she proved that she didn´t believe in his skills and that she finds him suspicious), then she jumped into his path when he tried to leave the loo in peace after he rejected the chance of an interview and she asked him nasty questions about John´s sexuality, then vaguely threatened him... she was really a repulsive stalker who just wanted to abuse him. "You repell me" were still a very polite words for such a creature.

Yeah, Kitty, not Penny. Glad you knew who I meant, anyway.

Most of her nasty questions thing was done AFTER he said she repelled him, using such an unfriendly tone with her. I think if he'd taken her up on his offer in one of the booths in the men's,she wouldn't have resorted to that knee-jerk reaction. She probably figured, nothing ventured, nothing gained, I've done worse than have sex with a gorgeous man to get the edge on a story. I don't think she was a repulsive stalker, not at all-- wearing the deerstalker and the I heart Sherlock pin, etc, that was all fake-- she was a young, hungry reporter looking for an "in" with a potential hot story. Not the first nor the last journalist to use such techniques.

I disagree that Kitty doesn't count. She was an attractive woman, one of only a few we've seen in the show who have shown interest in Sherlock sexually. But anyway, my point was, the writers use women, dangling them under Sherlock's nose, getting some kind of reaction out of him every time, but so far, they don't actually know what makes Sherlock's sexuality tick. Or if they do, they haven't shown the viewers.
 

No, if you remember, he left the loo after he told her "you repell me", those were his last words to her. All her questions came earlier and during their short encounter, Kitty changed from "the radiant young reporter" to "the threatening media vulture who trashes you in papers if you won´t do her biddings". Sherlock doesn´t responds well to an intimidation (probably because of Mycroft http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png
) and I can quite understand why he turned so nasty to her. If you notice, Kitty awakened his wrath after she asked if he and John Watson are just platonic friends.

Now, Sherlock doesn´t care much about his own reputation, but he knew that this thing is unpleasant for John and he just saw red protecting him.

And I don´t see anything sympathetic on Kitty - she just wanted to use Sherlock as an easy ladder to fame, she didn´t care much for him as a person.


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I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

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June 5, 2014 7:09 pm  #503


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Ben still doesn't write the show. It's all a matter of opinion. I think sherlock is a virginal man who wouldn't categorise his sexuality but has one. From the show and the way he acts around molly makes me think he hass something like a crush on her but doesn't know how to go about it. I also don't believe he's gay. Sherlock is probably more comfortable thinking he's above categories so he dislikes the way Mycroft teases him. Anyway, I think only Gatiss knows for sure. He has more merit with me than Moffat.

 

June 5, 2014 7:20 pm  #504


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Emmacalledroses wrote:

Ben still doesn't write the show. It's all a matter of opinion. I think sherlock is a virginal man who wouldn't categorise his sexuality but has one. From the show and the way he acts around molly makes me think he hass something like a crush on her but doesn't know how to go about it. I also don't believe he's gay. Sherlock is probably more comfortable thinking he's above categories so he dislikes the way Mycroft teases him. Anyway, I think only Gatiss knows for sure. He has more merit with me than Moffat.

 
What about his behavior around Molly makes you think he has a crush on her?


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June 5, 2014 10:33 pm  #505


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

The way he's so quick to defame all of her boyfriends, make fun of her when he thinks she has a new one, softening when he learns it's him, telling her she mattered the most, looking so sad when he learns she's engaged, asking her to help him on a case, asking her out for chips, etc.
I'm not saying she should date him, no. Unless there is a BIG change in attitude he would be a horrible boyfriend.

 

June 6, 2014 3:25 am  #506


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I really don't think we have enough evidence from the show to determine whether Sherlock is gay, asexual, or straight and the writers could go any route and I'd be convinced it was the right one.

I had a friend years ago who 'came out' as being asexual. She went to support groups and met others who helped her articulate an email explaining what that meant to her -- that she was married to her work, had lots of wonderful fulfilling platonic relationships with both genders, enjoyed masturbation and porn, but had zero interest in a romantic relationship or having sex with anyone. Not what I would have expected, but doesn't a lot of that sound like Sherlock?

Then there's the last guy I dated seriously. Late 30s, never had a romantic relationship, admitted that he was so inexperienced with sex that he had no idea if he had any interest in it, much less whether he was straight or gay, but all his friends were getting married and he thought that maybe he should try out dating.

He knew me through work, thought I was sweet and non-threatening (his words). Half my friends bet that he was gay, the other half went with asexual. He was fun, we had a lot in common, and he treated me well, so I decided to help him figure this out. Well, it didn't happen overnight because even hand holding was too much for him at first, but let's just say we determined that, surprise!, he was straight, and we were together for three happy years.

So because of that, I would totally believe that Sherlock could end up with someone, male or female,  if he ever decided that dating was an experiment worth doing. For all we know, Janine made him realise for sure that, yup, dating and sex are something he wants to pursue, but not with a woman and he'll have a boyfriend in season 4. Or she might have made him realise she's the wrong girl, but he likes girls, and we Sherlolly shippers will rejoice that even more grown up Sherlock is together with Molly.... Or we could get the status quo.

Based on what we've seen in the first nine episodes, the only thing that would surprise me is if Sherlock woke up in bed with Anderson or Donovan...

Mary


John: That's clever. So you scratch their backs and...
Sherlock: Yes. And then disinfect myself.
 

June 6, 2014 3:54 am  #507


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

How does someone who feels strongly "I don't want it to be like that" even watch the show?  The whole show reeks of Johnlock, maybe not in every scene, but in a large portion of them. I don't think I'd watch a show where something was so blatant but that I objected to. I do wonder why the no-johnlock people are even watching. Or how they can.

Well, I'll speak just for myself and say that I don't think "I don't want it to be like that", but more "I just don't see it". Whenever I look at "evidence" provided by JohnLockers, I see a totally different thing than I'm "supposed" to see! There are a lot of "just look at the look on his face" arguments, and they're always (to me!) rather dubious.

IMHO, rabid JohnLockers see what they want to see, whereas non-JohnLockers see nothing at all.

Why is it so important that they should be hot for each other? Is it an example of homosexual love that JohnLockers want? Because that's a legitimate wish in today's world, I would applaud such a high-profile show "coming out" that way. But I just don't see it! Stop trying to convince me! I don't want to be converted!

 

June 6, 2014 4:35 am  #508


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Gilly_sirl wrote:

How does someone who feels strongly "I don't want it to be like that" even watch the show?  The whole show reeks of Johnlock, maybe not in every scene, but in a large portion of them. I don't think I'd watch a show where something was so blatant but that I objected to. I do wonder why the no-johnlock people are even watching. Or how they can.

Well, I'll speak just for myself and say that I don't think "I don't want it to be like that", but more "I just don't see it". Whenever I look at "evidence" provided by JohnLockers, I see a totally different thing than I'm "supposed" to see! There are a lot of "just look at the look on his face" arguments, and they're always (to me!) rather dubious.

IMHO, rabid JohnLockers see what they want to see, whereas non-JohnLockers see nothing at all.

Why is it so important that they should be hot for each other? Is it an example of homosexual love that JohnLockers want? Because that's a legitimate wish in today's world, I would applaud such a high-profile show "coming out" that way. But I just don't see it! Stop trying to convince me! I don't want to be converted!

I prefer the term "Aggressive."    http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German   http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.gif
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
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June 6, 2014 5:35 am  #509


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

In which case I'm a militant non Johnlocker. Ha.


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June 6, 2014 3:13 pm  #510


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

There wasn't much to go on before...it's all very deliberately ambiguous...however in S03 there were quite a few signs emotional teenager Sherlock was interested in relationships.

The blog case he only finds interesting when he realises it's a gay woman married to a man.
The experimental / fake relationship with Janine...its very affirming...he read that in a book...he researched relationships.
The time he spent at the wedding prospecting for sexual partners with/for her...
The over interest in the women that dated the ghost..what attracted them..and why..questioning all those different women in many windows..@the whole mindpalace wedding scene.
Investigating Marys relationship with her ex...
Writing the romantic waltz for John@Mary..dancing it with John..
The parodical goldfish convo with Mycroft...where Sherlock comes out as..different..and sentimental...and there's nothing wrong with that..and maybe Mycroft...should try it too.
The thoughts of heartbreak in the mindpalace.
And the repeated sex holiday comments on johnwatsonblog post wedding.

Sure some of this..could be for a case..but Sherlock admits to using cases as opportunities to do things he likes or wants to..and does he ever do anything he really doesn't want to do..and doesn't he always have multiple motives.

So I think...definite interest in attraction and relationships and sex in S03.
Humanising Sherlock is on the agenda..and thats a normal part of being human..when interviwed the writers said..Of course he wasnt having sex with Janine...He wasnt interested in sex.....bleh and then Gatiss chipped in with...Well not yet anyway.

So maybe a real romantic interest is in Sherlocks future...and maybe when Mary takes her exit that will be the next Jlockblock and they can drag that fun  speculation on for another series or two.....heh.

 

June 6, 2014 4:33 pm  #511


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

To paraphrase Sherlock...
I like the crimes to be the mysteries, not everything!


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June 6, 2014 5:36 pm  #512


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I know that to a certain degree we all do "see what we want to see."  But I did not go into Sherlock with any sort of expectations.  The character of Sherlock as written and acted in the BBC series has read as Gay to me from the very begining.  Nothing blantant but little things I noticed, things I would notice when getting to know someone in real life. 

I hate to use the "I have gay friends" claim to add weight to my observation but I do have a lot of gay friends and relatives.  My own daughter is gay and I'm bi.   My radar has always been pretty good.

I'm just trying to say I didn't join this fandom looking for Johnlock.  I noticed it after being here for a while.  Just like I eventually figured out that guy I work with is gay by noticing things he drops into conversations and little quirks he has.

And in the end of course I could still be totally wrong about Sherlock.  We can't know for sure where the writers intend to take us.  But I'm not making up my ideas about Sherlock out of whole cloth.

BB, I think we are all fairly millitant/aggresive in our own way.  http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/happy.png

 


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German   http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.gif
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
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June 6, 2014 6:32 pm  #513


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

tonnaree wrote:

I know that to a certain degree we all do "see what we want to see."  But I did not go into Sherlock with any sort of expectations.  The character of Sherlock as written and acted in the BBC series has read as Gay to me from the very begining.  Nothing blantant but little things I noticed, things I would notice when getting to know someone in real life.
 

I, too, think that if Sherlock discovers sex at some point, he is more likely to be gay than straight. But you'll never convince me that John is bisexual or that the two of them will pair up. I just don't see it.  That Sherlock might fall into unrequited love with John, possibly, but not John with Sherlock.

Mary


John: That's clever. So you scratch their backs and...
Sherlock: Yes. And then disinfect myself.
 

June 6, 2014 8:22 pm  #514


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I certainly don't think we'll see any romance for Sherlock and we've had John's, with Mary.


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June 6, 2014 8:27 pm  #515


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

But they will not stop Sherlock's and John's personal development which is an essential element of the show. It is not an average crime show that is all about the investigation. So we can only speculate in which direction they will go but I do not doubt that they will go somewhere.

Last edited by SusiGo (June 6, 2014 8:38 pm)


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

June 6, 2014 8:30 pm  #516


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

You really think we'll see romance for Sherlock?
Just as well I don't gamble!


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June 6, 2014 8:32 pm  #517


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

If you had read that post, you would not have to ask.

Last edited by Harriet (June 6, 2014 8:33 pm)


Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.   Independent OSAJ Affiliate

... but there may be some new players now. It’s okay. The East Wind takes us all in the end.
 

June 6, 2014 8:37 pm  #518


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I did and apologise to Susi if I have misunderstood.


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June 6, 2014 8:57 pm  #519


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Maybe OT ...but I keep seeing here comments....John@Mary were romantic.....
So....uh...where...when...sleeping together they could have been brother and sister..all their conversations are snarky....John has never looked so bored as he did sat next to Mary at his wedding table...until Sherlock perked him up...and he ran away..so ok the waltz....that Sherlock wrote..orchestrated and taught John to dance.
Hmmmmm.
Maybe the xmas reunion...only took him 4 months..to prepare..some grudging words....
Mary@John romantic....Where...When. ...I must of blinked.

Last edited by lil (June 6, 2014 8:59 pm)

 

June 6, 2014 8:58 pm  #520


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

BB: I did not mention romance, that may have been a misunderstanding. I would like to see it, that is true, but we do not know where they are going. I just wanted to point out that the character development is as important as the case work and one of the biggest attractions for many fans. 

Last edited by SusiGo (June 6, 2014 8:58 pm)


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

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