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April 17, 2014 10:09 pm  #241


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

...and not to forget: domestic bliss.


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

April 17, 2014 10:10 pm  #242


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Yes. Indeed. All the things we never get to see with John and Mary. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

April 17, 2014 10:12 pm  #243


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Or a kind of 'dysfuntional domestic bliss', as Benedict described it.


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April 17, 2014 10:18 pm  #244


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Well, from my experience I would say that the domestic bliss we see with Sherlock and John is far less dysfunctional than in lots and lots of families nowadays...


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

April 17, 2014 10:31 pm  #245


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

And it functioned quite well until the end of TRF. 

And mentioning "dysfunctional" - to me it seems that all of John's relationships were/are sort of dysfunctional (yes, I include his marriage but we do not have to discuss this subject in here). The only lasting relationship is his friendship with Sherlock which would not have ended at this point if not for Moriarty. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

April 18, 2014 1:28 am  #246


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

SusiGo wrote:

Yes. Indeed. All the things we never get to see with John and Mary. 

We never even got to see John and Mary say "I do"!  They got all dressed up to the nines, and then....  the viewers got left out of the church. I found that.... startlingly interesting.
 

 

April 18, 2014 1:29 am  #247


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

besleybean wrote:

Or a kind of 'dysfuntional domestic bliss', as Benedict described it.

He would know, since Sherlock puts the dys (ie, diss) in dysfunctional, for sure.
 

 

April 18, 2014 2:07 am  #248


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Maybe they can't show too much of John and Mary's relationship because of the structure of the show? The spotlight has to stay on Sherlock so we can follow the mystery plot. Keeping the camera glued to Sherlock sounds alot like Sherlock POV, instead of the narator, John's POV. Unless, John intentionally keeps his narration about Sherlock because that's what his blog is about (or the frame of the original book) and therefore cuts out his romance with Mary. I don't even know if POV matters that much on screen.
Haha I really feel like Sherlock dissed John in the 60-min pilot when he called him an idiot. : P And then John so intelligently throws it back at him at the end.

Last edited by Lue4028 (April 18, 2014 2:09 am)

 

April 18, 2014 2:10 am  #249


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

It's almost as if the writers' don't want us to get emotionally invested in the Watsons' marriage?

 

April 18, 2014 2:52 am  #250


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Maybe. For some reason, their relationship ended up on the periphery.. I think it's a necessary structural thing, but it could be an artistic choice. If the case was they don't want us to be emotionally involved, it would make me seriously consider whether Sherlock's relationship with John is competeing with Mary's relationship with John. Or maybe... they don't want us to be mad when they kill her. I say when not if, because that would be part of the plan..

 

April 18, 2014 2:56 am  #251


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Regarding the POV - series 1 and 2 are told from John's POV while series 3 focusses on Sherlock's POV. Therefore we get to know much more about his feelings and the way his mind works. However, this does not change the way in which the Watsons' marriage is depicted, e.g. in the scenes at the beginning of HLV. They chose to show John dreaming of Sherlock and behaving aggressively afterwards. There is a profound change in tone from TSoT to HLV and it starts at the very beginning, not only after Sherlock has been shot. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

April 18, 2014 7:10 am  #252


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

Although, I should point out, however bizarre and fragile John's marriage, tells us nothing about Sherlock's sexuality.


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April 18, 2014 8:42 am  #253


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

From canon, I always thought of Sherlock as asexual.
From the BBC interpretation, it's more difficult to define
I think sometimes, even Moffat and Gatiss have differing views from each other on what makes Sherlock tick (I'm not always convinced that Moffat delves that deeply into the back stories or mindsets of his characters,anyway).
And then Benedict will often interpret Sherlock in a completely different way from either of them!!!!
For my part, the only romantic attraction he seems to have shown, was for Irene.
His devotion to John seems like a completely different thing - loyal love for someone who makes him feel redeemable, but not, I don't think, romantic love.

Last edited by Tinks (April 18, 2014 8:43 am)


"And in the end,
The Love you take
Is equal to the Love you make"
                                             The Beatles
 

April 18, 2014 11:46 am  #254


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I just didn't interpret how Sherlock reacted to Irene as love.  Fascination, challange, curiosity yes.  But love?  Just never saw it.


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April 18, 2014 11:50 am  #255


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

There were a few clues, which I chose to ignore.
Writer and actor both think he was attracred to her and maybe as men, they know!
Either way, what does it tell us of Sherlock's sexuality?

Last edited by besleybean (April 18, 2014 11:51 am)


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April 18, 2014 12:05 pm  #256


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

JNinSoCal wrote:

It's almost as if the writers' don't want us to get emotionally invested in the Watsons' marriage?

We'd better not. She's probably going to die, if the writers even roughly follow original canon. No idea how they're going to do that, or what will happen to the baby, but....  ACD killed her off, so.....
 

 

April 18, 2014 12:11 pm  #257


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

tonnaree wrote:

I just didn't interpret how Sherlock reacted to Irene as love.  Fascination, challange, curiosity yes.  But love?  Just never saw it.

You know when the snake charmer plays his little flute and the cobra comes weaving out of its basket, mesmerizing whoever's looking with it beady black eyes, just before it strikes?  That's how I see Irene, as a coiled cobra, and I think Sherlock was mesmerized, fascinated, not so much as an object of his sexual interest as an object of his intellectual interest-- he was intrigued, admired her cleverness and ingenuity, simply because he hadn't met hardly anyone, ever, who can match him. Love? I never saw it either, not unless, you know, it was a wacky Sherlock brand of what passes for love. After all, Sherlock was "attracted" to the cabbie's poison pills, too, and to the little life and death game he was being offered. That's similar to Irene as well.
 

 

April 18, 2014 12:36 pm  #258


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

ancientsgate wrote:

Love? I never saw it either, not unless, you know, it was a wacky Sherlock brand of what passes for love. After all, Sherlock was "attracted" to the cabbie's poison pills, too, and to the little life and death game he was being offered. That's similar to Irene as well.
 

I agree with that. It appeared more like a game or an 'experiment' than anything else. I think there was deffinitely attraction and chemistry between them but I wouldn't go as far as love.
 

 

April 18, 2014 12:39 pm  #259


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

As Steven so eloquently put it: they were hardly going to settle down and buy a Volvo!


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April 18, 2014 2:20 pm  #260


Re: Sherlock’s Sexuality: An In-Depth Contemplation and Study

I think Sherlock's love for John is the most romantic thing in the world. Just thinking about it makes my heart clench. ^^

 

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