I'm up for that...shall we start a petiton?!
Only joking, well, the 2nd part at least!

Tee Hee.

I agree about the motivation behind Molly slapping Sherlock, but still didn't like that they had her do that - I don't find any kind of violence funny, cute or acceptable, yet the writers presented it as such on several occasions n this series, imo.
And while I can forgive Molly because of the motivation behind it, I find what she did as out if character as John seeing with his own eyes the way Mary threatened Sherlock and the pain she put him through, having shot him, and yet still choosing to find out nothing else about her before taking her back....oh well, I guess I really am going round in circles now - sorry!

Last edited by Tinks (March 2, 2014 12:22 pm)

besleybean wrote:

Yes, Sherlock John and Mary all shoot people directly...I know only 2 of those definitely meant to kill.
John and Mary are both trained killers.
John kills the cabbie.
Mary doesn't kill Sherlock.

I know it's a endless discussion, but Mary DID kill Sherlock. He flatlined. 
I precise I'm not doing Mary bashing, just stating the facts 

Otherwise I agree with you, John and Mary are both trained killer.
But John meant to save Sherlock at the first place.
He probably wouldn't have killed the cabbie if Sherlock wasn't about (stupidly) to swallow this damn pill.
 

Last edited by Ozymandias (March 2, 2014 1:13 pm)

Tinks wrote:

I agree about the motivation behind Molly slapping Sherlock, but still didn't like that they had her do that - I don't find any kind of violence funny, cute or acceptable, yet the writers presented it as such on several occasions n this series, imo.
And while I can forgive Molly because of the motivation behind it, I find what she did as out if character as John seeing with his own eyes the way Mary threatened Sherlock and the pain she put him through, having shot him, and yet still choosing to find out nothing else about her before taking her back....oh well, I guess I really am going round in circles now - sorry!

Well, it is at times like this when I repeat my 'It's the baby, stoopid' mantra to myself; it's the only way I can make sense of the season. Sherlock has a series of highly unappealing choices to make and I think he makes them on the basis of which is the least bad, since there are no good ones.

I agree that John does appear to be in denial, but again I think he may also be going for the least bad; from all we know of Mary she does not appear to be excellent self sacrificing mother material, and somebody has to be there for the child.

Viewed in those terms it brings us closer to the canonical Sherlock and Watson; Dr Watson always was a sucker for a pretty face and a sob story, and so is our John. The canonical Sherlock was good at recognising that love is not always a many splendoured thing, that it can be twisted and perverted; he would have had no difficulty in recognising Mary for what she is. That doesn't mean that a pregnant woman should be abandoned to her enemies; if John and Sherlock had done that then their moral universe would crumble, and they would no longer be ACD's Sherlock Holmes and Dr Watson...


 

Mattlocked wrote:

Yeah, with Sherlock and John sitting on the roof and kissing in the end......

Wheee! 

 

Tinks wrote:

Swanpride wrote:

????? She only had one scene with him before she shot him and in this scene she was more or less the nicest person in the room, because she neither slapped him, nor ripped into him because of his drug habit.

 
She was actually quite sarcastic about him in the opening scenes.
She was also, notably, the only person in his circle who didn't seem bothered by the fact that he seemed to have resumed his drug habit.

Maybe because she was the only person clever enough to understand his actual motive for doing it?

Sherlock Holmes wrote:

Tinks wrote:

Swanpride wrote:

????? She only had one scene with him before she shot him and in this scene she was more or less the nicest person in the room, because she neither slapped him, nor ripped into him because of his drug habit.

 
She was actually quite sarcastic about him in the opening scenes.
She was also, notably, the only person in his circle who didn't seem bothered by the fact that he seemed to have resumed his drug habit.

Maybe because she was the only person clever enough to understand his actual motive for doing it?

 
In which case wouldn't she have spoken up and told Molly and John to back off a bit?
That much depends on how we choose to interpret it, I suppose, but definitely there was a marked change in her - from the person who actively encouraged John and Sherlock to spend time together in the previous episodes, she's now rolling her eyes because John misses Sherlock, having not seen him for a month.
I really don't want to think that Moftiss wrote her as doing that because they see it as "typical" female behaviour, that would be really disappointing.
So my take is, that she was never as keen on Sherlock as she made out, but knew it was best not to antagonise him before she'd married John, for fear he'd start trying to learn more about her to put John off.

Only time Mary wants Sherlock to go with John... the run him like a pet scene.
Every other time Mary , despite Johns objections , insists in going along.
John even writes on his blog "Mary insisted on coming"
She isn't involved in the JW/SH make up at all that we see.

When she tells John Sherlock had a confidante...not John
When she tells Sherlock...John talks about Sholto all the time...not Sherlock
We weren't the first...

Implying...not best friend... And distance..

Last edited by lil (March 3, 2014 2:29 pm)

This only highlights the ambivalent way in which this interesting character is written. Everything is possible.