BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » What did CAM say about Janine at the end?

josabby · February 4, 2014 3:23 am

In the final scene when CAM revealed his mind palance, he made some comment about Janine and Sherlock had some strange reaction. I didn't catch the line. Did anyone. I'm just mildly curious.

NoSheetSherlock · February 4, 2014 3:34 am

When CAM flicks John's face (and then his eye), he taunts him with 'see if you can keep it open.'

and then says to him 'Janine managed it once'. Followed by:
'She makes the funniest noises' while CAM looks over at Sherlock.

eew.

Clancy · February 4, 2014 3:45 am

CAM said Janine had managed to keep her eye open once when he flicked it and that "she makes such funny noises" when he did so. I also noticed the look on Sherlock's face when the camera cut to him but wasn't sure if that was about Janine or because Sherlock had heard the helicopter, which became obvious a second or so later.

Could have been both.

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 5:05 am

I still wonder if that might have been CAM's way of telling Sherlock and John that Janine is dead...

the_dancing_woman · February 4, 2014 6:52 am

SolarSystem wrote:
I still wonder if that might have been CAM's way of telling Sherlock and John that Janine is dead...

I am still wondering about this too, don't remember the exact wording anymore, though. I really hope she isn't dead, because I truly and absolutely liked Janine right from get go! I would love to have her back on the show in series 4.
I loved the canon reference about the house with the beehives she bought in Sussex.

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 7:20 am

At the moment I don't recall the exact wording, either. First CAM says something like "Janine managed it once" - and everytime I watch it this feels so final to me, as if she'll never get a 'chance' to try again (and not because she's not working for him anymore, but because she's dead).
And then his "She makes the funniest noises"... seems to me he's not really talking about the noises she made when he flicked her face, but when she was killed...

besleybean · February 4, 2014 7:26 am

I had several thoughts about this.
But I did wonder if CAM was trying to get at Sherlock, cos he thinks Sherlock really cares about Janine.

miriel68 · February 4, 2014 8:02 am

This Magnussen's remark struck me as kind of strange in the context: it wasn't important and it didn't add any substantial information & tension or whatever. Given that Sherlock scripts tend to be very tight and every verse usually does "mean" something, I was wondering what would be a purpose of sucha a throw away sentence. I am almost certain we will yet discover it.

the_dancing_woman · February 4, 2014 8:12 am

I really have to rewatch the episode, that is when I am emotionally up for it, and pay close attention to what it is exactly he says there.
I thought that house and beehive comment could possibly point to Janine somehow playing a part again in the future (not necessarily as Sherlock's girlfriend but in some way).

gently69 · February 4, 2014 8:19 am

I don't think that Janine is dead. As Magnussen pointed out again he wasn't a murderer. I think he prefered to use people than to kill them, because they are useless then... wasted somehow. Debasing someone was more satisfying for him.

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 9:18 am

Oh, but he is a murderer, isn't he, sort of? Maybe not in the exact sense of the word, he certainly doesn't fire a gun at people. He has far more subtle methods - just look at Lady Smallwood's husband. People commit suicide because of him, because of his knowledge, because of the power his knowledge gives him over them. Knowledge is his weapon.

gently69 · February 4, 2014 9:38 am

Ok, he is a murderer... somehow. But how would he have killed Janine? Driven her into suicide? I haven't got a clue...
Driven someone to kill her? Why?

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 10:19 am

How does he drive anybody into committing suicide? I'm sure he has his methods, I'm sure he has a file on Janine just like he has a file on almost anybody. And she hasn't exactly proven to be a reliable employee - although I have to admit that I'm not absolutely sure whether or not CAM may have played her and made use of her 'relationship' to Sherlock Holmes for his own purposes. But even if that were the case, he'd have no use for her any longer. And let's not forget that she sold her story to all sorts of newspapers which don't belong to CAM.

Anyway, like miriel already said: CAM's mentioning of Janine seemed out of context, I don't really understand why he mentions her at all - if not to make a certain point. Only to let John know that he's done the very same thing to her that he's now doing to John?

gently69 · February 4, 2014 11:50 am

SolarSystem wrote:
Anyway, like miriel already said: CAM's mentioning of Janine seemed out of context, I don't really understand why he mentions her at all - if not to make a certain point. Only to let John know that he's done the very same thing to her that he's now doing to John?

To let Sherlock know what he did?

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 11:56 am

You mean to let Sherlock know that CAM also flicked Janine's face? Why? Why would Sherlock need to know?

SusiGo · February 4, 2014 12:22 pm

Sorry for not referring to your question, Solar, but I have a more general thought that came to me only now:

Was it not very risky to let Sherlock into the office at all? Janine had to assume that CAM was there and could walk in any moment. She may not have known that Sherlock was after CAM but the office is strictly private and high-security and she just lets her boyfriend in so that he can propose to her? Or because she is curious?

gently69 · February 4, 2014 12:44 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
You mean to let Sherlock know that CAM also flicked Janine's face? Why? Why would Sherlock need to know?

Well, nevertheless they had been a couple for the some time. Even if it wasn't anything serious from Sherlock's side. Maybe Magnussen just wanted to demonstrate that is able to harm anybody who is related to Sherlock... no matter how.
A demonstration of power.

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 12:44 pm

Susi, I'd say it was very risky! One should think that she knows only too well what CAM is capable of - or maybe not? Can she be that blind?
The beginning of this whole scene leading up to the Mind Palace still confuses me a bit. Why does she let Sherlock in, indeed? Or did she assume that CAM had already left the office? I don't think so, she's his assistant, she should know. How long did it take Sherlock and John to get to her? How much time was there for Mary to knock Janine out - without whitnessing her talking to Sherlock?

SolarSystem · February 4, 2014 12:52 pm

gently69 wrote:
SolarSystem wrote:
You mean to let Sherlock know that CAM also flicked Janine's face? Why? Why would Sherlock need to know?
Well, nevertheless they had been a couple for the some time. Even if it wasn't anything serious from Sherlock's side. Maybe Magnussen just wanted to demonstrate that is able to harm anybody who is related to Sherlock... no matter how.
A demonstration of power.

Hm, Magnusssen being the man that he is probably knew very well that Sherlock already was aware of what CAM is capable of. It would be more of a demonstration of power if Janine was indeed dead.

the_dancing_woman · February 4, 2014 12:52 pm

Concerning Janine: Seems she will be back in series 4, very pleased about that.

http://www.uk.ign.com/articles/2014/02/04/sherlock-team-on-the-big-changes-in-season-3-the-villains-milverton-and-the-return-of-moriarty?page=2

I hope the link works...