Mattlocked wrote:

Right after rewatching HLV today I asked hubby: "What do you think, did John react to "cool" at the end?"
Hubby, confused: "Cool? What do you mean, 'too cool'?"
Me: "Well, we were discussing, after all what Sherlock did for John, at least a 'Thank you for everything' could have been nice, you know."
Hubby: "Ah, you girls, right? Well, tell your girls, this goodbye was perfectly okay. I mean, they were shaking hands!!?" ^^
Me: "Okay, so it's a "men thing". Cowboys and that."
Hubby: "Yes. You could say so." 

So, now I told you girls. 

 
Yes, that's exactly the point, I guess. We were witnessing the goodbye of two totally straight, casually platonic male friends.
Only the "Casablanca"/"Bodyguard" parallel undermines this a bit.

Hm. I've never been pregnant but I know they do those scans practically all the time. So I don't get your point here.

Hehe casablanca....
Well I get the blokey/manly thing we don't want hugs kisses sentiment...
But maybe when Sherlock offers his hand something more than...sigh yup look  away game over.

Perhaps a line from John in agreement..the best of times.,, or yes to good times I will miss.., idk something.

Last edited by lil (January 19, 2014 5:35 pm)

I am guessing, if they had already booked the scan (possibly Mary did? In between shooting people and climbing walls to go and kill your blackmailer, I mean, you do need to be a good mother-to-be... [I'm being ironic here]) then John would have gone along even if he was in turmoil and upset...

You can determine the gender at about 18-20 weeks. So they either knew the sex beforehand but weren't telling anybody before the birth (in which case John disclosed a sweet piece of information to Sherlock) or they found out between the shooting at Appledore and Sherlock's departure. I think it's the former, it would be weird for a couple of expectant parents to ask for the gender just a few weeks before the birth itself. Usually people find out either the very moment they can have the result or at birth.

besleybean wrote:

I think they each knew how the other felt and there was no need to express it.

Well, yes, but if everybody did that there would be very, very short programmes. Molly knows that Sherlock knows how she feels about Sherlock taking drugs, so why did she bother saying anything? John knows that Sherlock knows how he feels about Sherlock taking drugs so why did he bother saying anything?

Etc., etc., etc...
 

Or maybe they both knew, but hadn't told anybody else.

Well it's hardly for nothing...Mary is now safe.

besleybean wrote:

Well it's hardly for nothing...Mary is now safe.

 
Yes, but Sherlock didn't shoot Magnussen for Mary, but for John and his happyness. And if John had let him know that Mary's safety was less important to him than Sherlock's friendship, that would have left Sherlock feeling like he had done what he did for nothing. Or at least it would have left him feeling worse than he already did.

LightPurple wrote:

Hello Everybody! I'm new to this forum and being sad about how much negative comments John gets after HLV, I thought I just join the discussion.

To me, John didn't seem cold in that last scene at the airport at all. Let me point out why:

a) After Sherlock tells Mycroft that this is most likely the last time he's going to talk to John, we can see that John is upset but bracing himself for this last conversation. Sherlock had just basically thrown away his life for John's happyness and I don't think he wanted his last memory of John being one of a broken man. And I actually think that at that point, John still hopes that the "last time" remark was just meant for Mycroft and Sherlock actually did haven an escape plan. We're talking about Sherlock Holmes here, after all.

b ) The fact that John doesn't find any words to say is prove enough that he's deeply upset. That's something that usually only happens to him when he's upset. And note how he keeps avoiding looking at Sherlock. That's not him being cold, that's him desperatly trying to keep control over his emotions.

c) When Sherlock answers John's question of what's going to happen after those six months in Eastern Europe and Sherlock answers with "who knows", I think that is the moment where John truly realizes that Sherlock doesn't haven an escape plan and they might never see each other again. And his reaction to that is anything but cold: He takes a deep breath and looks away from Sherlock for quite a long time, and when he looks back at him (and finally looks him in the eyes) we can clearly see how hard he just had to fight a breakdown. I really don't see anything cold in that reaction.

d) John's really afraid of what Sherlock is going to say to him, because he knows if it's something emotinal he's going to break down. Sherlock realizes that, so he changes whatever he wanted to say into this "Sherlock is a girl's name" joke. John's laugh after that is not cold at all, it's a mix between a relieved laugh and a suppressed sob. I think at that point, both men are just thankful for keeping each other from breaking down in front of an audience (and worst of all: Mycroft).

e) John telling Sherlock that it's not a girl's name is him letting Sherlock know that he realized that he wanted to say something else. John refusing to call his daughter after Sherlock is not him being cold, it's him telling Sherlock that there's no chance there's ever going to be another Sherlock in his life. Or that he still refuses to believe that their goodbye is final, that he has to keep believingt that they're going to see each other again.

f) When Sherlock offers John his hand, we can clearly see John hesitating for quite some time until he takes it. He's obviously torn weather to say something more, go for a hug are just take the offered hand. I think by that time the lump in his throat had gotten too big to actually say something more, and a hug would probably have caused both man to break down and cry - something neither of them wanted to do in front of the othe and an audience. So he finally went for a silent handshake. But just look at his face when Sherlock boards the plane: That's anything but John being cold.

Finally, I fully understand why John couldn't bring himself to thank Sherlock. A "Thank You" would mean: "Thank you for throwing away your life and our friendship, thank you for making me lose my best friend yet again, I really appreciate that!" I don't think John ever wanted Sherlock to do what he did, he didn't want to lose him again, so I don't think he's actually thankful that he shot Magnussen. Of course it's a relief that Magnussen is gone, but the cost is just too high for John to actually be thankful. On the other hand, John couldn't tell Sherlock that he would have preferred if he hand't done what he did, because that would have meant telling Sherlock that he had thrown  his life away for nothing. And yet again, I fully understand why John couldn't think of a single thing to say in that situation . . .

 
Very well written, nothing to add!
I was a bit doubtful about John's reaction after having seen it the first time. I guess there was just too much going on for me to register things properly. But upon rewatching the episode and paying closer attention to John and esp. his body language (Martin Freeman is a genius of understatement!) during that scene I completely agree with your observations.