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January 24, 2017 11:56 pm  #261


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Liberty wrote:

Irene - for me it was because of what Eurus said - about you don't understand Bach - "play you".  And apparently you/Sherlock is romantic yearning.   And I'm glad that's just as far as it went.   But I like the idea of Sherlock having those romantic feelings and secretly seeing them as what he is. 

 
I think this has been mentioned a few ties about Eurus asking Sherlock to "play him" and he chooses Irene's theme, but I just took it at face value that he composed that music therefore it was "him" or his music rather than Bach, not necessarily any underlying sexual meaning to it.  Though, I suppose Eurus' comments about sex after hearing it could give the impression of a deeper meaning to his song choice.
Sorry, I know this is a minor point and rather old hat by now, but it had bothered me for some reason!


"Is that why you're calling yourself Greg?" 
"That's his name!"
"Is it?"
 

January 25, 2017 6:41 am  #262


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

I think it's an important point.
Every time Sherlock is linked to attraction/romance, it is with Irene.  The Woman.  She has that title for a reason!


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January 25, 2017 7:03 am  #263


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Yes.  She's more of a symbol than a person.   I don't think the song itself is sexual (it's wistful and romantic), but of course Eurus picks up that it was about a lover, and demeans that sexual urge to something horrible.  I don't think she'd have answered in the same way if Sherlock had played John and Mary's wedding theme (which he also wrote).

     Thread Starter
 

January 25, 2017 7:34 am  #264


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Rewatching TBB, and the opening credits say the episode was directed by Euros Lyn.  Wonder if that's where they got the name.

 

January 25, 2017 7:40 am  #265


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

My guess is that they used the name because of the "east wind" line from canon.  But perhaps that's where they got the idea! 

     Thread Starter
 

January 25, 2017 7:53 am  #266


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

besleybean wrote:

Every time Sherlock is linked to attraction/romance, it is with Irene.  The Woman.  She has that title for a reason!

Interesting though that The Woman herself romantically links Sherlock to John. 
 


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

January 25, 2017 8:31 am  #267


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

SolarSystem wrote:

besleybean wrote:

Every time Sherlock is linked to attraction/romance, it is with Irene.  The Woman.  She has that title for a reason!

Interesting though that The Woman herself romantically links Sherlock to John. 
 

Also, she has the title "The Woman" because he respects her as a worthy adversary, not because he is romantically linked to her.


-----------------------------------

I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

 

January 25, 2017 11:54 am  #268


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

That's true: he respects her as a worthy adversary. Her intellectual abilities are equal to his, if not better. It was so in the original text by ACD. And when you consider when that was written, it was a real sensation. At this time it was seen as an acknowledged fact, even by reputable scientists, that the intellectual abilities of women were inferior than those of men. And that is the cause why Sherlock is fascinated by Irene Adler: she ist a woman, and  nevertheless her intellectual abilities are at least as good as his. Fascinating, indeed.

 

January 25, 2017 12:51 pm  #269


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Irene has the title The Women because that's what she calls herself professionally.


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Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German  
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
    
 
 

January 25, 2017 5:37 pm  #270


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Yes, but when Sherlock stops a moment and looks dreamily out of the window, he entitles her 'THE Woman'.


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January 25, 2017 6:12 pm  #271


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Artemis wrote:

Rewatching TBB, and the opening credits say the episode was directed by Euros Lyn. Wonder if that's where they got the name.

Wow! I like it so much!  
And they mix the story and the reality in absolutely fantastic way

athameg wrote:

That's true: he respects her as a worthy adversary. Her intellectual abilities are equal to his, if not better. It was so in the original text by ACD. And when you consider when that was written, it was a real sensation. At this time it was seen as an acknowledged fact, even by reputable scientists, that the intellectual abilities of women were inferior than those of men. And that is the cause why Sherlock is fascinated by Irene Adler: she ist a woman, and  nevertheless her intellectual abilities are at least as good as his. Fascinating, indeed.

Agreed: fascinating. And we can have no doubts, Holmes was fascinated by her mind, since ACD's The Woman was happily married.
 

 

January 25, 2017 6:14 pm  #272


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Yes, a much better scenario, as far as I'm concerned.


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January 25, 2017 6:23 pm  #273


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

besleybean wrote:

Yes, but when Sherlock stops a moment and looks dreamily out of the window, he entitles her 'THE Woman'.

Which is the title she gave herself.


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German  
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
    
 
 

January 25, 2017 6:24 pm  #274


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

I believe the episode shows Sherlock attracted to Irene and the BBC Sherlock team agree with me.


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

January 25, 2017 7:19 pm  #275


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

besleybean wrote:

I believe the episode shows Sherlock attracted to Irene and the BBC Sherlock team agree with me.

That's fine.  I wasn't talking about Sherlock's level of attraction.
I was just pointing out that The Women is what Irene calls herself so it's not unusual for Sherlock to refer to her as such.
 


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German  
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
    
 
 

January 25, 2017 7:21 pm  #276


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

I assume he hasn't called her that through all their years of texting.


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

January 25, 2017 7:25 pm  #277


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

besleybean wrote:

I assume he hasn't called her that through all their years of texting.

But we don't know for sure!  
Maybe he calls her Adler.


----------------------------------------------------------------------
Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German  
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
    
 
 

January 25, 2017 7:27 pm  #278


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Of course he possibly doesn't call her anything at all.


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

January 25, 2017 7:34 pm  #279


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Exactly. Because he usually ignores her texts as Steven stated in a recent interview. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

January 25, 2017 7:43 pm  #280


Re: The Final Problem: First impressions

Yes, but even he occasionally cannot resist responding to her.


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