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November 5, 2014 10:23 pm  #941


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Well, maybe the bad things happen to someone else. Just speculating but I fear for Mycroft. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

November 5, 2014 10:24 pm  #942


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I love it when it hurts, as long as there is comfort in the end. We didn't get much comfort at the end of HLV, so I hope that in S4 they first will give us darkness and then, please, some comfort. Would be enough comfort for me if they get the boys back together again in 221B.


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

November 5, 2014 10:25 pm  #943


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I thought Mary´s death was pretty certain, because of the thing Amanda said.. about knowing how it will happen..

 

November 5, 2014 10:26 pm  #944


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Yes, yes, but that's a bit sad, isn't it? You fall head over heels in love with great new TV, you are a happy little poppy for six episodes and crave for the next ones and then you feel like:"Hm, where does this head in general? Will I be in love enough to keep following you?" I didn't feel this before.


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Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.


"If you're not reading the subtext then hell mend you"  -  Steven Moffat
"Love conquers all" Benedict Cumberbatch on Sherlock's and John's relationship
"This is a show about a detective, his best friend, his wife, their baby and their dog" - Nobody. Ever.

 

November 5, 2014 10:26 pm  #945


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

But is 'it' Mary's death? Or just her 'disappearance' from the show?


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

November 5, 2014 10:27 pm  #946


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I think the commentary was quite interesting in that respect. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
     Thread Starter
 

November 5, 2014 10:28 pm  #947


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

It was, wasn't it?


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

November 5, 2014 10:34 pm  #948


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

mrshouse wrote:

Yes, yes, but that's a bit sad, isn't it? You fall head over heels in love with great new TV, you are a happy little poppy for six episodes and crave for the next ones and then you feel like:"Hm, where does this head in general? Will I be in love enough to keep following you?" I didn't feel this before.

It is. I went through all the stages of grief and slowly arrive at acceptance.. life goes on and at least there will be beautiful Sherlock to look at (I´ll just close my eyes whenever they feel the need to make him slap himself or vomit on the floor again..)
 

 

November 5, 2014 10:36 pm  #949


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Or smiling John...
Did I ever mention that I love Martin's smile?


------------------------------------------------------------

Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.


"If you're not reading the subtext then hell mend you"  -  Steven Moffat
"Love conquers all" Benedict Cumberbatch on Sherlock's and John's relationship
"This is a show about a detective, his best friend, his wife, their baby and their dog" - Nobody. Ever.

 

November 5, 2014 10:36 pm  #950


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

From your avatar, one wouldn't guess 


Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.   Independent OSAJ Affiliate

... but there may be some new players now. It’s okay. The East Wind takes us all in the end.
 

November 5, 2014 10:53 pm  #951


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

mrshouse wrote:

Or smiling John...
Did I ever mention that I love Martin's smile?

You mentioned it here, sort of...
http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=194140#p194140
 


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

November 6, 2014 7:08 am  #952


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

This little snippet might be interesting ...

Mark: So you have to sort of backtrack and think, now, is she attached to Mary so she became her friend so that she could go to the wedding.  Is that all part of Magnussen's ...
Steven: ... terrible web?


Although, it's quite clearly posed as a question, not an answer.   I'd been keen on the idea of Mary courting Janine to get to Magnussen, but quite possibly it was the other way round. 

Last edited by Liberty (November 6, 2014 7:09 am)

 

November 6, 2014 7:57 am  #953


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Interesting point. Who targeted who and used her for her own plans? 
Short side trip: Anyway I think there is more to Janine than we are led to believe. One thing I read about and had not thought about before - Sherlock and Mycroft arguing loudly about Magnussen while Janine is in the flat. And she later mentions the shouting going on. So she then probably knew Sherlock was after her boss and possibly even earlier. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
     Thread Starter
 

November 6, 2014 8:11 am  #954


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I am pretty certain that she was knew Sherlock was targetting Magnussen - apart from the shouting (which, interestingly, Sherlock doesn't seem too bothered about - he's just very certain that he doesn't want Mycroft and Janine to meet at that point), it has to be Janine deliberately feeding Sherlock the information about Magnussen being out of the office, so that Magnussen can show Sherlock the "letters" and lure him there.  

 

November 6, 2014 8:29 am  #955


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Which leaves all sorts of interesting scenarios - Janine targeting Mary from the beginning (but why), working for Magnussen or someone else or on her own … 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
     Thread Starter
 

November 6, 2014 5:33 pm  #956


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Janine seems to be under Magnussen's control, so presumably Magnussen had some use for Mary, perhaps even before she was a link in the chain to Mycroft?  But that still leaves the questionf of why? He's certainly involved in some way by the wedding ... but from Mary's expression, it looks as if it could be a surprise to her at that point.  I'm not sure. 

 

November 9, 2014 7:47 am  #957


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

This is very interesting.. It might just be wishful thinking, but from the top of my head it doesn't seem to directly contradict the commentary. I'll have to review their comments on Mary again.. (besleybean was right about us having too much time on hand..^^)

http://mild-lunacy.tumblr.com/post/102028482764/why-does-sherlock-still-trust-mary#notes

Last edited by Zatoichi (November 9, 2014 7:51 am)

 

November 9, 2014 8:40 am  #958


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

I disagree with the conclusion of that piece and think it does contradict what the team have said.
In fact, having just posted on the Janine thread, I'm seeing a pattern with the Sherlock women!
Steven does like them sexy, but he likes then clever and feisty too!
Again, from what they say...well I don't know if you can categorise Mary as either victim or villain.
She has a past...but the team seem to be pushing the fact that she does want to leave this behind and move on from it.
She genuinely loves John and yes will do anything to protect him, but she genuinely likes Sherlock and wants to keep the boys together.  She is at least a support to them in their work,


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http://professorfangirl.tumblr.com/post/105838327464/heres-an-outtake-of-mark-gatiss-on-the
 

November 9, 2014 11:02 am  #959


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

Very good meta, Zatoichi. Thanks for posting. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
     Thread Starter
 

November 9, 2014 11:55 am  #960


Re: My thoughts about Mary (all episodes)

About Mary going to Sherlock for help - yes, I think she should have done, but actually, Sherlock proved to be pretty incompetent when it came to Magnussen.  We'd probably have had much the same scene of Sherlock going to Magnussen's office, except that in this case, without Mary, Magnussen would have been in control.   I'm not sure what he would have said or done, but he definitely had the upper hand at that point.  Sherlock wasn't able to help Mary, himself, or Lady Smallwood. 

In fact, in the end (as the writer points out) he ends up just taking over Mary's plan to shoot him in the head.  Except that Mary's plan would have been a lot more efficient (she's a professional killer) - if she hadn't been interrupted, she wouldn't have been traced, a lot of evil would have been prevented (included Lord Smallwood's suicide, amongst other things), and they could have carried on as normal - no risk to Mary, John, Sherlock or Mycroft.  

 

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