BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / IOU a fall.... : what fall?

**Posted by NatureNoHumansNo** April 17, 2014 7:34 am

I really wonder what " fall" does Moriarty owes to Sherlock.
When did he get a fall, or at least a failure, because of Sherlock?

**Posted by zeratul** April 17, 2014 8:36 am

Well he says he wants to solve the final problem... meaning Sherlock must die... so he owes him a fall, "falling is like flying except there is a more permanent destination"... implicating that Sherlock will die by falling down from somewhere...

**Posted by NatureNoHumansNo** April 17, 2014 8:42 am

Yes, I get all that... but " I owe you" means it's a revenge, no?
I see moriarty wanting to play a game and want to see Sherlock " dance", but I don't get the reason of a "revenge".
To me, the game between them was equal.
I maybe could see a fall in the meaning " fall in love" ( mariarty had a crush on Irene Adler and Scherlock spoilted it ( but it's farfetched)).

**Posted by zeratul** April 17, 2014 9:42 am

Why would he need revenge...

Well there are also theories about the sentence with "the other one" of the latest episode...
Which was actually the one, which wasn't in the script, I always thought it would have been the "Oh, Sherlock what have you done?"...

Maybe we will find out later...

**Posted by NatureNoHumansNo** April 17, 2014 10:41 am

"why" indeed, john !

Last edited by NatureNoHumansNo (April 17, 2014 12:15 pm)

**Posted by Marta** April 18, 2014 2:37 pm

Wasn't it in The Great Game? "If you don't stop prying... I will burn you. I will burn... the heart out of you." Moriarty wanted Sherlock to stop interfering with Jim's crimes and "the fall" is a revenge for not listening.

**Posted by Arabella Trefoil** April 19, 2014 9:48 am

I take "fall" to mean "fall from grace." This ep is loaded to references to a fall from grace, but most of these references are obscure. If Moriarty thinks of himself as the arch enemy, the ultimate evil, the personification of antihero, he is the tempter. He is Satan. (Which shows his ego has run amok. What grandious ideas he has.)

Holmes is smart enough to see through Moriarty's weakness - a desire to the anti-God. On the roof Sherlock tells Moriarty that if Moriarty wants to shake hands with him in hell, he is ready to do it. Moriarty taunts Sherlock for being on the side of the angels.

Holmes counters with (paraphrase) "I may be on the side of the angels, but don't think for one second I am one of them." This deflates Moriarty's ego because he sees that he and Holmes are "equals." Moriarty is not Satan. He is not special.

The scene runs by so quickly that I had to watch it many times before I saw the gamesmanship involved.

**Posted by lil** April 20, 2014 12:51 am

Correct @ Arabella
Yes the final problem is good v evil.(always was always is)
Neither can exist without the other.
The final solution for Moriarty is everyone is evil.
The fall is the fall of man..Sin...tempted to sin with the apple.
Thats the whole point of this...to die in disgrace.(Moriarty says so)
Disgrace means to sin..dis -cast out..grace the - eye of god.
Suicide...to sin..to fall..to get burnt...in hell.
Moriarty thinks we should all be Sinnermen like him.
(and have tht great nina simone theme tune)
Sherlock thinks thats all bollox and is ressurected by an unexplained miracle.Sherlocks higher power is himself !
( sh is a modern idol god rockstar etc its very funny imo)

Simples.

The real solution to good v evil and sin and why its necessary. ?
....is a pregnant Mary.
life without end and all that easter chocolate coloured stuff.
Thats the real solution to TRF.
Its symbolic of course.
But clever.
Bleh.

posted stuff about this a few but...might be a bit too not squee for here.

Last edited by lil (April 20, 2014 12:53 am)

**Posted by Arabella Trefoil** April 20, 2014 1:24 pm

Well said, lil. Your post pulled together the complex elements elegantly.

Moriarty looked pathetic on the hospital roof waiting for Sherlock to join him. There he is, "the master villain" listening to "Stayin' Alive" and looking like a tired commuter waiting for a bus. When he tries to engage Sherlock in conversation, Moriarty says something along the lines of how boring staying alive is. He moves his hand along in the air in a line. No more invention left, Moriarty?

It is Moriarty who is the loser. You can only play wicked if you have a good enough adversary. Moriarty is no genius. His philosophy has no depth. His life is meaningless. How many games of flash light tag (referring to lazer sites on his cronies' guns) can you play before you realize you've run out of ideas?

I hope Moriarty's "come back" at the end of season three is the result of one of his cronies "going viral" and messing with telecomunications. As far as I'm concerned, Moriarty should be dead. The writers have exhausted the possibities of this character. If we get a peek at Moriarty in the mind palace now and again, that is enough to satisfy me.