BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 / John's Military standing

**Posted by Golddragon71** January 25, 2014 4:21 pm

So John and Sherlock go to investigate the Bainbridge matter and John talks to Pvt. Bainbridge's CO.
John refers to his having been in the 5th Northumberland Fusiliers to which the CO dismisses him as retired "you could be a bloody plumber now for all i know."
However, when John presented his military credentials at Baskerville no-one questioned him.
Now, there was a considerable amount of time between the two (two and a half years at minimum)
On the other hand it seemed to me that the CO had a bit of an attitude towards John not just as a "Civilian" but also perhaps as a matter of "My unit's better than yours".

anyone else notice this?

**Posted by saturnR** January 25, 2014 8:36 pm

I can't remember the scene in Hound but for Sign of Three, it seems to be that the guy from the Queen's Brigade who doesn't do any actual fighting is turning his nose up at John who's heen in multiple active war zones. Maye he feels a need to be more buff because his men don't have to see combat & he feels like he has to justify their standing as members of the military particularly against someone who has seen combat like John.

Also John is a suspect in that scene so it makes sense that they might not immediately take him seriously.

Last edited by saturnR (January 25, 2014 8:38 pm)

**Posted by Kittyhawk** June 11, 2015 9:10 pm

First of all on the OP's question: In Baskerville Captain John Watson was making an impression on a Corporal (considerably lower in the hierarchy), basically bluffing. In the London barracks John is dealing with a Major, i. e. a higher-up. That's military pecking order for you... (completely apart from the fact that John is now a civilian... BTW, I do like him getting forceful when saving Bainbridge's life - but I'm shocked that the duty sergeant announced Bainbridge dead without checking his vital signs or doing first aid.)

Now I'll hijack this thread because none of the Major Sholto one fits what I want to say: For me the appearance of Major Sholto, what he did, and his relationship to John provide final proof that Kizzia (on AO3) is right (and probably others as well, Wellingtongoose also lists this option): John Watson was a doctor and a soldier, but not an army doctor!

**Posted by Vhanja** June 11, 2015 9:22 pm

I never understood how the Major in TSoT knew that John was retired.

**Posted by SusiGo** June 11, 2015 9:35 pm

Vhanja wrote:
I never understood how the Major in TSoT knew that John was retired.

I suppose it says so on his ID card. I do not believe he would walk in there in civilian clothes and pretend to be still on active duty.

**Posted by Whisky** June 11, 2015 9:42 pm

Kittyhawk wrote:
that Kizzia (on AO3) is right (and probably others as well, Wellingtongoose also lists this option): John Watson was a doctor and a soldier, but not an army doctor!

I haven't heard of this, do you have a link?

**Posted by Harriet** June 11, 2015 9:46 pm

Sherlock says several times (esp in ASiP) that John is an army doctor, trained at St. Bart's.

BBC One says: "Previously an army doctor, shattered by service in Afghanistan, John Watson discovered a new lease of life when he met Sherlock Holmes. Although often infuriated by Sherlock's cold, detached manner, he also sees his flatmate as his best friend."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/profiles/3vT16nZ3kntNN2z8ShLphSf/dr-john-watson

Last edited by Harriet (June 11, 2015 9:50 pm)

**Posted by Liberty** June 12, 2015 6:27 am

I think it's a little bit confusing - John does seem to have been an army doctor, but I'm not sure about his flashbacks (which seem to imply frontline fighting, but maybe not - we don't actually see him, do we?). And then he's only a captain, whereas in civvy life he's a GP - quite a long training, and I think you'd have expected him to hold a higher rank in the army.

Some of the medical stuff is a bit off in the series, so I wonder if some of the army stuff is too.

Last edited by Liberty (June 12, 2015 6:13 pm)

**Posted by Vhanja** June 12, 2015 8:50 am

At Sherlocked, there was a recap telling the story of how John got his injury. I can't remember it myself, but does it say anything in there if he served as a soldier or doctor when he got injured?

Edit: Here are Wellingtongoose's two-part meta on John's role in the army, amended and updated to include the information that John stated himself that he was at one time an army doctor.

http://wellingtongoose.tumblr.com/post/30473137292/semantics1
http://wellingtongoose.tumblr.com/post/30681523063/semantics2

Last edited by Vhanja (June 12, 2015 8:55 am)

**Posted by Harriet** June 12, 2015 8:52 am

I never thought I would say one day: I believe in what the writers and the BBC say - but I do it now

**Posted by Vhanja** June 12, 2015 8:56 am

Harriet wrote:
I never thought I would say one day: I believe in what the writers and the BBC say - but I do it now

We always do as long as what they say are in line with what we believe ourselves. ;)

**Posted by Harriet** June 12, 2015 9:01 am

I just don't see any reason in this matter. Or do you believe they have future plans with John being not an army doctor at all?

**Posted by mrshouse** June 12, 2015 9:02 am

Vhanja wrote:
Harriet wrote:
I never thought I would say one day: I believe in what the writers and the BBC say - but I do it now
We always do as long as what they say are in line with what we believe ourselves. ;)

Nope, all too easy.
We would not torture ourselves like we do in many discussions if it was that simple...

**Posted by Vhanja** June 12, 2015 9:14 am

Harriet wrote:
I just don't see any reason in this matter. Or do you believe they have future plans with John being not an army doctor at all?

No, I don't usually have much trouble believing the creators of the show.

**Posted by mrshouse** June 12, 2015 9:16 am

So, you believed that everything we needed to solve the mystery of the fall was actually on screen and the fans only too dumb to see it?

**Posted by Vhanja** June 12, 2015 9:18 am

mrshouse wrote:
So, you believed that everything we needed to solve the mystery of the fall was actually on screen and the fans only too dumb to see it?

I don't believe anyone to be dumb if they hadn't figured out the fall. Neither had I. (Then again, I didn't have to spend years pondering it as I had the next season already available to me - thank goodness!)

But this is getting slightly OT, I think.

Last edited by Vhanja (June 12, 2015 9:19 am)

**Posted by mrshouse** June 12, 2015 9:21 am

Okay, apologies, I didn't want anyone to be considered dumb, that was not the point. Sorry, if that was what stroke you. My point was to give an example for deliberate misdirection on the writer's part, as you said you believe everything they say.
But I agree that it gets OT.

**Posted by Harriet** June 12, 2015 9:23 am

Vhanja wrote:
Harriet wrote:
I just don't see any reason in this matter. Or do you believe they have future plans with John being not an army doctor at all?
No, I don't usually have much trouble believing the creators of the show.

So why don't you do it here? Is there so much evidence for John not being an army doctor? And reason to contradict to what they say?

**Posted by Vhanja** June 12, 2015 9:24 am

My point was more this: I know that sometimes they delibarately misdirect the fans. And this can very easily be used as we want it. If they say something we agree with, we use it as "evidence" to support our cause. If they say something we disagree with, we use the "But they always lie"-card.

Back on topic:

I do believe he was an army doctor. He says so in the show, no reason to doubt it.

Last edited by Vhanja (June 12, 2015 9:25 am)

**Posted by Harriet** June 12, 2015 9:30 am

I was and am on topic. But I couldn't figure out what your opinion is. Got it now and agree.