BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » sherlock series 4 (spoilers inside)

This Is The Phantom Lady · December 30, 2016 3:12 pm

I'm panicking!

I'll be watching TST at my friend's place... the next two will be at mine... I've got a few things ready...
I am however planning on watching it at least once the next day at home, all alone. All focused and with subtitles...

Once... okay. Who am I kidding??

ewige · December 30, 2016 4:04 pm

Wow, 221B is really singed here! So maybe Moriarty gets to burn Shelock's heart out of him this time!

Just imagine if the next picture tomorrow shows no Sherlock, just ruined 221B? That would be a PR stunt! Unfortunately, only to the people who follow the whole campaign (us). So it won't happen. But I sort of like the idea.

Also, I'm not reading spoilers anymore, so thank you for the warnings!

Last edited by ewige (December 30, 2016 4:05 pm)

Lis · December 30, 2016 5:45 pm

Pretty big spoilers for TLD here so obviously don't click if you don't want to know.

http://ascandalonbakerstreet.tumblr.com/image/155168438992

Last edited by Lis (December 30, 2016 5:47 pm)

Liberty · December 30, 2016 5:55 pm

Oh. My. Goodness. BIG spoilers in that article!

So we finally know who the enigmatic Lady in Red is!

Now the bit about

Culverton playing games and driving Sherlock insane

I'm so excited, because that's exactly what I was hoping for! And I kind of predicted it back when we were talking about whether the mortuary scene was real or not ... except I didn't actually predict it, I just said that I wanted it. Well, it looks like I've got my wish! I'm over the moon!

Last edited by Liberty (December 30, 2016 5:55 pm)

Lis · December 30, 2016 6:09 pm

I know right!

I'm literally so excited for this episode. Well, I'm excited for the whole series but maybe just a tiny bit more for TLD!

Liberty · December 30, 2016 6:16 pm

Yes! I think it's because I'm really excited about Toby Jones villain. I think Toby just looks like a nice guy and seems nice in interviews - it's really fun that they've kind of cast against type. Well, not exactly because I'm sure I read in the interview that the part was written for Toby (it might have been an interview with Toby - I'll see if I can dig it out). And I'm all for emotional Sherlock. I just know I'm going to love this episode, really love it. Whereas the others, I don't think I can be quite so certain, partly because of the unknowns in TFP (i.e. there might be something I don't like!).

Lis · December 30, 2016 7:06 pm

Toby looks like he is going to be an amazingly creepy villain.

Yeah I'm the same about TFP because so little is known about it. I think I'm equally excited as I am worried!

ewige · December 30, 2016 7:47 pm

Scrolling past the spoilers (in the spoilers thread, I'm pathetic) really quickly, dropping some "Elementary Dear Watson" chemistry set up:

This Is The Phantom Lady · December 30, 2016 8:07 pm

Interesting, I love the face in the smoke btw!

ewige · December 30, 2016 8:20 pm

There was a short ad about the new season on the Russian channel and the "I love you" line was connected with

Irene Adler

This is so bizzarre that I don't know whether I've just been spoiled or trolled

Last edited by ewige (December 30, 2016 8:21 pm)

Liberty · December 30, 2016 8:27 pm

I've just remembered to bring this over here from another thread, because it's too spoilery to discuss!
http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/29/arts/television/review-sherlock-season-four.html?_r=1

The mystery of the busts is reduced to a storytelling convenience, and there’s some inconclusive business regarding Holmes’s nemesis, Moriarty (Andrew Scott), who was supposedly killed off last season. And eventually (slight spoiler alert), it becomes another Mary episode, with the tilt toward sentiment and melancholia that implies. (There’s a baby, which allows Mr. Cumberbatch to do some Uncle Sherlock mugging.) Holmes invokes “the game” that’s afoot, but the episode’s real through line is a repeated analogy to the tale of the appointment in Samarra and its theme of the inescapability of death. If there’s a game being played, it’s a grim one.

I know this is really obvious, but presumably the appointment in Samarra is with Mary. This may actually be a confirmation that she dies at the end of TST ... or at least, seems to (apparently, there's a cliffhanger?). I had my heart set on the messy divorce, but never mind!

Anyway, my first thought was that she was hiding away in London with her changed identity, hoping she was safe, when in fact London was "Samarra". But then I thought it was more likely the other way round ... that she becomes aware of somebody after her in London, so flees to "Samarra", not realising that there is a plan to kill her there.

Then I started wondering if it actually was Samarra that she goes to in real life. (Either that or Agra!) They filmed in Morrocco, didn't they? But I wondered if it was as stand-in for another location.

So who/what is after her? We know she has many enemies and people who would want her kept quiet. Is it something to do with the sharks? I'm also still wondering about the Mycroft connection ... and if Mary was working for him, or for MI5/6.

Last edited by Liberty (January 1, 2017 9:07 am)

Liberty · December 30, 2016 8:32 pm

ewige wrote:
There was a short ad about the new season on the Russian channel and the "I love you" line was connected with
Irene Adler
This is so bizzarre that I don't know whether I've just been spoiled or trolled

Isn't it the case that TFP hasn't been screened yet, so they can't know for sure? I'm not sure how these things work.

I kind of like to think of Irene as just that one episode, even though she has come back for cameos ... and I although she isn't officially in the cast, I'm sure they'd have fun secretly sneaking her in, as they did with Moriarty in TAB. However, I feel that the issue with Irene is kind of resolved for Sherlock within the episode - I'm sure he thinks of her, but I don't think he obsesses over her, and I don't think he loves her in the true sense.

On the other hand, we're kind of short of candidates!

ewige · December 30, 2016 8:40 pm

Liberty wrote:
Isn't it the case that TFP hasn't been screened yet, so they can't know for sure? I'm not sure how these things work.

I kind of like to think of Irene as just that one episode, even though she has come back for cameos ... and I although she isn't officially in the cast, I'm sure they'd have fun secretly sneaking her in, as they did with Moriarty in TAB. However, I feel that the issue with Irene is kind of resolved for Sherlock within the episode - I'm sure he thinks of her, but I don't think he obsesses over her, and I don't think he loves her in the true sense.

On the other hand, we're kind of short of candidates!

There have been a lot of drama around the Russian translation of the last episode's title so I figure the First Channel knows what's going on in the last ep even tho there have been no official screening yet.
I love Irene but she needed a complex intrigue to be a great character. Her cameos are nice but really not special.
So I really don't think it's about her. Or maybe Sherlock realizes he loved her (on an intellectual level?) and that unlocks something pertaining to the current happenings. But in this case they could take Mrs. Hudson or John or Greg for that. Sherlock loves any of them more emotionally than Irene.

Last edited by ewige (December 30, 2016 8:41 pm)

Liberty · December 30, 2016 8:53 pm

I think he was clearly infatuated with her, but I agree that it wasn't emotional love - he only really met her a couple of times - for a short time at her house, the time she stayed over at his house, and with Mycroft later that day. There are another couple of times - when she talks to him in his sleep, and when he overhears her with John - where he's in her presence but doesn't interact with her. I just don't feel it's enough. They would have to have her back as a character and let the relationship develop, not have him realise years later that he "loved" her. In my opinion, anyway.

I will happily eat my words if they manage do something very clever with it.

One thought that came to mind was the stories of enchanted people who can only be redeemed by true love/a kiss - you know the fairytales of kissing frogs, Sleeping Beauty, Snow White, Beauty and the Beast, etc. I wonder if he somehow has to save somebody with a declaration of love, even if it really is just a code to get out of a locked cell!

ewige · December 30, 2016 9:01 pm

In connection with the line being shown in a trailer, it may refer to something insignificant. Maybe Sherlock mirrors Irene's password which was a declaration of love too to get out of the cell or make a connection or something.

I can't believe it's only two days left to wait. I'm trying to finish up my projects by that time because I already know I'll be useless for anything but Sherlock discussions in two days' time.

Lis · December 30, 2016 9:48 pm

Russian trailer with some new footage here.

https://twitter.com/Anythingbatch/status/814946785013669888

ewige · December 30, 2016 9:55 pm

Oh, cool, thanks for the link!
Sherlock says: "This is the most dangerous, the most despicable man I've ever met. That monster must be dealt with."

Lis · December 30, 2016 10:00 pm

Ooh thanks for the translation. I was trying a spot of lip reading to work out what Sherlock was saying at the end but couldn't make it out

ewige · December 30, 2016 10:02 pm

Lis wrote:
Ooh thanks for the translation. I was trying a spot of lip reading to work out what Sherlock was saying at the end but couldn't make it out

You're welcome. I'm glad I can be useful in these trying times
Based on the lightning, Sherlock tells that apparently to John who's standing in front of that window with the blue curtain. I don't think it's John's house (looks too bright and sort of modern for that).

ewige · December 30, 2016 10:06 pm

Molly is there looking warily at John who walks by without paying her any attention in his "punch Sherlock" suit. I assume Molly is on Sherlock's side. John definitely isn't.