BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012 » The comprehensive Johnlock guide (Johnlockers only)

tonnaree · June 20, 2014 11:24 am

Can I be a "bridesmaid"?

SolarSystem · June 20, 2014 11:28 am

Mattlocked, ha, I suppose I'm getting myself a bit confused here right now. I think I need to think about this some more.
But the fact remains, it's always John's fault, isn't it? However you want to interpret it, it all comes back to John. Then again, that link is great btw, Mattlocked, because it clears up once again what Sherlock is up to in that scene. I just really, really hope that they will somehow come back to this in S4...

Last edited by SolarSystem (June 20, 2014 11:28 am)

SusiGo · June 20, 2014 11:38 am

Thanks for the link. Had not seen this one. :-)

Mattlocked · June 20, 2014 12:01 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
Mattlocked, ha, I suppose I'm getting myself a bit confused here right now. I think I need to think about this some more.

Same here.....

SolarSystem wrote:
But the fact remains, it's always John's fault, isn't it? However you want to interpret it, it all comes back to John. Then again, that link is great btw, Mattlocked, because it clears up once again what Sherlock is up to in that scene. I just really, really hope that they will somehow come back to this in S4...

Aaaand: Same here.

SolarSystem · June 20, 2014 12:23 pm

nakahara · June 20, 2014 12:29 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
But the fact remains, it's always John's fault, isn't it? However you want to interpret it, it all comes back to John. Then again, that link is great btw, Mattlocked, because it clears up once again what Sherlock is up to in that scene. I just really, really hope that they will somehow come back to this in S4...

John himself is the reason why this thing came and bit him into his ass.
Because it´s his reasoning, his way of thinking that the whole situation MUST be somebodys fault. It´s him who is trying to find a convenient target on which he can place the blame for the whole fiasco with Mary.
So of course, when it is pointed to him that no, nobody is at fault that he chose to marry the damn woman, his logic leads him to the conclusion that the others are now blaming HIM for his catastrophic marriage.
Sherlock words don´t actually imply guilt - he is just pointing out that John simply chose his partner because he was attracted to certain aspect of her character.
It´s John himself who heard accusation in those words.
If he was less angry and less judgemental maybe he would realise there was no way anybody could predict this outcome of the situation - and that no one is to blame for the fact he ended with Mary.
What I find interesting is that John is only concerned because HE was duped (again), but not for the more serious and valid reason - that Mary shot his best friend.
I also cannot think of some other words that Sherlock could use in this situation. What was he supposed to do? Confess that yes, his absence or his influence forced John to choose Mary? It would certainly stroke John´s ego but it simply isn´t the truth and John would certainly not benefit from that.

Even the words John uses are significant for this accusatory way of thinking. It´s not "Mary, why did you lie to me?" but "What have I done to deserve you?"

Last edited by nakahara (June 20, 2014 12:45 pm)

SolarSystem · June 20, 2014 12:48 pm

nakahara wrote:
If he was less angry and less judgemental maybe he would realise there was no way anybody could predict this outcome of the situation - and that no one is to blame for the fact he ended with Mary.
What I find interesting is that John is only concerned because HE was duped (again), but not for the more serious and valid reason - that Mary shot his best friend.

I know this is getting way off topic here, so let me just say what I already said in probably more than one HLV thread: I completely understand that John is losing it in this situation and that he's looking for someone to blame. His world seems to be falling apart completely, and I'm quite sure that I personally wouldn't be able to think straight if I were in his place. So I get why he's not thinking about Sherlock and the pain that he must be in right at that moment, I get why he thinks that Sherlock isn't on his side and why he's basically pissed off with everyone.

Mattlocked · June 20, 2014 1:39 pm

We should watch it all again. For scientific research.

SusiGo · June 20, 2014 2:32 pm

I just found this on tumblr regarding John. OT therefore I am just posting the link:

http://anigrrrl2.tumblr.com/post/89360983736/john-is-not-ooc-in-s3

nakahara · June 20, 2014 2:33 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
nakahara wrote:
If he was less angry and less judgemental maybe he would realise there was no way anybody could predict this outcome of the situation - and that no one is to blame for the fact he ended with Mary.
What I find interesting is that John is only concerned because HE was duped (again), but not for the more serious and valid reason - that Mary shot his best friend.
I know this is getting way off topic here, so let me just say what I already said in probably more than one HLV thread: I completely understand that John is losing it in this situation and that he's looking for someone to blame. His world seems to be falling apart completely, and I'm quite sure that I personally wouldn't be able to think straight if I were in his place. So I get why he's not thinking about Sherlock and the pain that he must be in right at that moment, I get why he thinks that Sherlock isn't on his side and why he's basically pissed off with everyone.

Of course, it´s understandable that he is so angry in this situation.
And yet - the life would be easier for John if he admitted that awful things happen to good people all the time, for no reason, by stupid chance - just like his relationship with Mary happened. That it was not universes´ conspiracy against his very person that he had such wretched luck and that it isn´t neccessary to lay blame with somebody to cope with this sudden problem.

Mattlocked · June 20, 2014 2:53 pm

Well, but it weren't normal awful things which happened to him!

Mattlocked · June 20, 2014 2:56 pm

SusiGo wrote:
I just found this on tumblr regarding John. OT therefore I am just posting the link:

http://anigrrrl2.tumblr.com/post/89360983736/john-is-not-ooc-in-s3

Great found, Susi!
And now think of the "cold and emotionless" airport scene.....

SusiGo · June 20, 2014 3:13 pm

Oh, you mean the scene in which John is so happy to get finally rid of Sherlock?

ancientsgate · June 20, 2014 3:22 pm

SolarSystem wrote:
Forget it...? Definitely not. Carry on. I could do this all day, you know.
A tube of you know what...

Toothpaste? Both of them should be minty-fresh, after all.
*runs away laughing*

SusiGo · June 20, 2014 3:36 pm

Last edited by SusiGo (June 20, 2014 3:37 pm)

tobeornot221b · June 20, 2014 3:41 pm

Hey - that's clever, Susi, awfully clever!

SusiGo · June 20, 2014 3:45 pm

Thank you. And do you know what? The funny thing is that Sherlock knows full well Bainbridge's stalker is a man. And yet he says this. And John again does not understand anything and corrects him.

Last edited by SusiGo (June 20, 2014 3:46 pm)

Mattlocked · June 20, 2014 3:50 pm

SusiGo wrote:

OH. MY. GOD.

tonnaree · June 20, 2014 7:10 pm

SusiGo wrote:
I just found this on tumblr regarding John. OT therefore I am just posting the link:

http://anigrrrl2.tumblr.com/post/89360983736/john-is-not-ooc-in-s3

This person read my mind. John Watson is a white hot ball of feels tied up with stoic English steel.

SolarSystem · June 20, 2014 9:40 pm

SusiGo wrote:
I just found this on tumblr regarding John. OT therefore I am just posting the link:

http://anigrrrl2.tumblr.com/post/89360983736/john-is-not-ooc-in-s3

Thanks for that link, Susi. I'm really getting a bit tired of all those "Why is John behaving like that?"-discussions, so that little meta was just... perfect. John is damaged, John is falling apart, repeatedly. Maybe it's his own fault to some extent... well, nobody's perfect, right?