BBC Sherlock Fan Forum - Serving Sherlockians since February 2012.


You are not logged in. Would you like to login or register?



January 3, 2014 4:32 pm  #21


Re: Too many references?

I don´t know anybody who was drawn out of social media. There was first the deciding TV moment, maybe triggered by a newspaper article or a friend, than come the social media. At least I would never go into a Sherlock forum (or tumblr) without knowing what´s that about. Neither do my friends. Maybe we are special but I would bet it´s the normal way. And yes, not the whole show, but TEH seems to be written for people who actually watch it. That exactly is my concern.
And I don´t agree with that: It didn´t survive because of the fanbase, it´s quite the opposite. It has such a big fanbase because Sherlock is exceptionally well written, has outstandingly filmed episodes with great writers and actors and everything. That´s why the fandom is so big. One should never forget that. They should not risk that, long running TV shows always exchange their viewers from time to time, that´s normal.

 

January 3, 2014 4:33 pm  #22


Re: Too many references?

SolarSystem wrote:

...and this is an official statement from the BBC, Moffat, Sue Vertue...?

 I would very much wonder about that and also be a little shocked .

 

January 3, 2014 4:50 pm  #23


Re: Too many references?

I didn´t get really what you wanted to say: Which people watch what or what not? Sorry, my brain cells strike.
But according to the question of what kind of people watch Sherlock: As we can see here from the forum it´s quite a big mix. According to age at least, nationalities, sexual orientations also etc. Outside of forums and therefore the majority: My 11 year old son likes it as well as my brother-in-law, who is an accountant, and my former uni-prof. I would say the viewers are widespread and diverse. Neither of them join any forums but remember well TRFe.g.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 3, 2014 4:53 pm)

 

January 3, 2014 4:56 pm  #24


Re: Too many references?

I think/I know it´s the majority. I can´t give you certain numbers, but so called fandoms in social media are always minorities concerning the viewer number. You can´t believe that the ten million viewers last Wednesday are all active forum users? I would estimate carefully, probably 5 % of these do it. That would be 500000 alone in the UK. Even this seems to be too many.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 3, 2014 5:00 pm)

 

January 3, 2014 5:02 pm  #25


Re: Too many references?

I actually didn't feel that way. My father who actually doesn't know a thing about the craziness of the fandom could understand all the references and felt entertained - same with me.
We should all be thankful that the fandom means so much to the writers and don't feel laughed at.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Falling is just like flying, except there’s a more permanent destination."

"Sherlock Holmes is a great man, and I think one day—if we’re very very lucky—he might even be a good one."

"Would you like to-"
"-have dinner?"
"-solve crimes?"
"Oh"



 

January 3, 2014 5:05 pm  #26


Re: Too many references?

Swanpride wrote:

All the people who watched by "other means" certainly are. Well, not necessarily active Forum users, but connected enough to stay informed about the latest development on the Sherlock front.

A lot of people don´t have TVs anymore at home and watch via web. I would agree if you said "a lot of people watched live from outside the UK" - we certainly outed us a hardcore fans . But I doubt that one can measure how many faked IP-addresses were on the road last Wednesday.
I think one can forget that there is a normal TV-life outside of forums and most people live that. Also I live that with any other show besides Sherlock.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 3, 2014 5:07 pm)

 

January 3, 2014 5:10 pm  #27


Re: Too many references?

Mary Me wrote:

I actually didn't feel that way. My father who actually doesn't know a thing about the craziness of the fandom could understand all the references and felt entertained

Ha, that was my question in the beginning: Does somebody know somebody who saw TEH and has never watched Sherlock before. That makes me feel well, maybe the percentage of insider jokes is not so high as it felt while watching.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 3, 2014 5:10 pm)

 

January 3, 2014 5:21 pm  #28


Re: Too many references?

And I have never even heard of Glee. And I have never even heard of any kind of ships before I watched Sherlock, neither in English or German. And I know a lot people who watch telly but have their 40-hours-work every week, maybe family, and no time and interest in fandoms. These are the majority of people counted last Wednesday, if you like to see that or not . I want to stop it  here, because we are moving in circles.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 3, 2014 5:22 pm)

 

January 4, 2014 3:49 am  #29


Re: Too many references?

I watched TEH with a lot of family members and one of them-a brother- had not watched Sherlock before. I laughed at the inside jokes-he didn't.  10 minutes into the show-he was annoyed at the show? me for laughing?  It was not a lot of fun for him.  He didn't get it.  You cannot watch TEH without context.  Anyone who just found this episode would have been confused by the excessive amount of fandom references.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Sherlock Holmes, "Perfectly sound analysis but I was hoping you'd go deeper."
 

January 4, 2014 8:16 am  #30


Re: Too many references?

But.... .don't I have problems to understand ANY series if I jump in somewhere in the middle?


__________________________________

"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan
 

January 4, 2014 10:12 am  #31


Re: Too many references?

Mattlocked wrote:

But.... .don't I have problems to understand ANY series if I jump in somewhere in the middle?

Of course you do, at least with the more progressive TV shows. Imagine watching Game of Thrones, Boradwalk Empire or Lost starting with Season Three...


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I still believe that love conquers all!

     

"Quick, man, if you love me."
 

January 4, 2014 10:37 am  #32


Re: Too many references?

Probably you are right. But, as far as I know these series, they have much more and shorter episodes, or? It´s another kind of series, not one, which appears like having independent films. And which has long breaks in between, so has to recollect the fans again (no problem after TRF , but how often can they repeat such a phenomenon?).
I think it´s more a question of the mixture. When I saw once THoB as my personal first episode I did not get all the jokes, I have of course missed a lot of the relationships before. But nevertheless I was following the film with excitement, and it made me curious enough to watch TRF a week later (I saw repeats on our third programmes). And then I bought the dvds because also my son liked it very much. And we started everything from the beginning. The rest is history .
So the mixture was right here - inside jokes with nods on a lot of stuff which happened before, but also an own independent story. I don´t say that TEH does not have that, I am just not sure. And TEH goes a step further: It´s not only nodding on things from the episodes before, but also on the tumblr-fandom outside of the series, which must be invisible somehow for most of the watchers, even for these, who know it already, but are just "simple" fans of Sherlock. One can do this (and I love it), but it should not be overdone in the future imo. Just thinking on the forthcoming of the series, excluding viewers is maybe not the best method to let it run for a long time. And tbh also I would be bored probably if the show is just circling around itself.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 4, 2014 10:37 am)

 

January 4, 2014 10:48 am  #33


Re: Too many references?

Mattlocked and Schmiezi, you are right, of course. "Boardwalk Empire" and "Lost" are good examples, you'd really be lost if you started to watch them somewhere in the middle.

But I still think it might be a little different with TEH (and I say "might be", because I'm not entirely sure about this yet). A bit like anja, I started Sherlock not with ASiP but with Scandal. And as we all know, Scandal starts where TGG left off - which might be pretty confusing for someone who hasn't seen TGG. But Scandal was so well-done, that I was hooked immediately. Yes, I was slightly confused at the beginning of the episode, but it worked. I dare say this had to do with brilliant writing and with the way in which the relationship between Sherlock and John was portrayed right from the start.
Now, I know that at the beginning of TEH Sherlock and John practically don't have a relationship (anymore). But for someone who is totally new to Sherlock, the very first scene must be so very confusing...! In Scandal they at least make clear right from the start that something has happened at the pool before and that this gets picked up now. But in TEH... don't get me wrong, I love how TEH starts, you're right in the middle of the action... and for us fans that's great. As are lots of other things in the episode, that 'normal' viewers just won't get mostly.

So, what I'm trying to say is this: Sherlock can work fo new viewers - it worked for me with Scandal being my very first episode - but I doubt that TEH will work that way. Which is a shame, because I think that as many people as possible should get to know the show...!

Last edited by SolarSystem (January 4, 2014 10:52 am)


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

January 4, 2014 10:55 am  #34


Re: Too many references?

Swanpride wrote:

Sure, Sherlock is well written, and no doubt that this is the reason for the success. But the question is what kind of people watch the show. And I somehow doubt that there are a lot of people, who does not pay attention to TV schedules and information about shows would see that it on again and think "oh, right, the show I watched two years ago, I really wanted to know how he survived" or "oh, that's the show everyone is talking about, perhaps I give it a shot now". That's like seeing that there is a 9-parter in TV and deciding to watch the seventh episode. Nearly nobody does that.

Are you trying to say there's 9.2 million people in the Sherlock fandom? Because...that's ridiculous. Sorry. Majority of the viewers on New Year's Day would have been normal non-fandom viewers.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.

Independent OSAJ Affiliate

 

January 4, 2014 10:55 am  #35


Re: Too many references?

But they showed what has happened in the last scene of TRF: Sherlock jumped.
The rest was fiction which was explained directly afterwards by the conversation between Anderson and Lestrade.

Edit: Hubby read about Sherlock in an online magazine and that's how we noticed it. We watched TGG, got hooked and bought the dvd.
So we already got an IDEA it might be a great show by reading that article in advance. This is how people get to notice the show, too. Reading about it and give it a try. Just saying.

Last edited by Mattlocked (January 4, 2014 10:57 am)


__________________________________

"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan
 

January 4, 2014 10:58 am  #36


Re: Too many references?

It wasn't confusing for us because we already know everything...if you were watching that episode for the first time having never seen Sherlock before, I'm not saying that you'd be totally confused because you'd probably already know about the fact that he faked his own death...but you'd be confused and probably slightly annoyed by the fandom references and it might put you off watching another one if you thought all the episodes might be like that.


---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Eventually everyone will support Johnlock.

Independent OSAJ Affiliate

 

January 4, 2014 11:00 am  #37


Re: Too many references?

But then again if you wouldn't have any idea, how would you know that it is fandom reference?
After all in the show it was imagined by Anderson and the girl in the club!


__________________________________

"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan
 

January 4, 2014 11:01 am  #38


Re: Too many references?

Mattlocked wrote:

But they showed what has happened in the last scene of TRF: Sherlock jumped.
The rest was fiction which was explained directly afterwards by the conversation between Anderson and Lestrade.

You're probably right. I just think that the beginning of Scandal made it far easier for new viewers to acclimatize to the show. But maybe that's just me.
And apart from that I'm still not sure if all of those references throughout TEH were really necessary - but that might also be a matter of taste. To me it felt like too much.


___________________________________________________
"Am I the current King of England?

"I see no shame in having an unhealthy obsession with something." - David Tennant
"We did observe." - David Tennant in "Richard II"

 
 

January 4, 2014 11:02 am  #39


Re: Too many references?

@mattlocked: You could be right. I think it will get really exciting when the show comes to Germany. I am looking forward to the reviews, I think these people are really far from knowledge about fandom stuff, so we will get an independent impression of how it works. The critics loved Sherlock last time, although it was not such a paramount success here. Let´s see what they say.
And there is a good friend of mine with whom I watched the show more than once. She loves it, but she is also far from fandoms of any colour. She´s on travel now, so we can only watch it when the dvd is out. This could be also an independent judge for me concerning how it works without fandom knowledge.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (January 4, 2014 11:04 am)

 

January 4, 2014 11:04 am  #40


Re: Too many references?

SolarSystem wrote:

Mattlocked wrote:

But they showed what has happened in the last scene of TRF: Sherlock jumped.
The rest was fiction which was explained directly afterwards by the conversation between Anderson and Lestrade.

You're probably right. I just think that the beginning of Scandal made it far easier for new viewers to acclimatize to the show. But maybe that's just me.
And apart from that I'm still not sure if all of those references throughout TEH were really necessary - but that might also be a matter of taste. To me it felt like too much.

I know what you mean and I felt the same. Still we just can't know what anyone feels who doesn't know the show. And who has no idea of the fandom. That's the point I guess.
He/she might be very confused, but will get it in the end, I'm sure.


__________________________________

"After all this time?" "Always."
Good bye, Lord Rickman of the Alan
 

Board footera

 

Powered by Boardhost. Create a Free Forum