SolarSystem wrote:

My personal Johnlock consists of two men who
- repeatedly save each other's lives (ASiP, TRF, ASiB)
- are willing to go to certain death together (TGG)
- commit murder in order to ensure the other one's happiness (HLV)
- are proud of each other (where shall I begin...?)
- are jealous when the other one is with a woman (TBB, ASiB, HLV)
- just can't be without one another (TRF, TEH, HLV)
and lots, lots more and
- who are flatmates, best friends, lovers.

That's great! 

I just don't see it them as lovers. I see them as close friends only. Not because I don't see them in a relationship, but I just see it ruining them(Sherlock isn't good with the sort of stuff which is why I think he chooses not to engage in such as well as the fact that Sherlock really is dominating and overbearing at times). I do enjoy their co-dependancy, but even that has problematic elements to it. Sherlock doesn't know the meaning of personal space and there are moments where John doesn't appreciate that like when Sherlock gets on his computer or follows him on his dates. 

I guess I love relationships were there is an equality to it. John is the loyal companion that Sherlock can count on when he is in trouble or needs support, but he isn't his equal. And that's okay! XD

Those scenes where they are both jealous when another woman is in the room? I don't see either of them as showing that they are in love. Sherlock follows on John's dates or looks angry when John is out with his girlfriends seems to me as Sherlock treating John as a possession. He isn't saying "I love John. He's mine." To me, those scenes say: "He's mine." It's possessive to me. John's just doesn't want to be the third wheel or be alone like Sherlock felt when John and Mary were together. Third wheel. And who can blame him? XD




 

SusiGo wrote:

Neither do I know men counting the text messages their male friends receive from women. But maybe this is just me.  

Maybe he thought Irene was threatening Sherlock. He seemed shock when he found out that Irene's messages were flirtation rather than threats. 

Also, you can see that scene in HLV as John going like: "You have a girlfriend now? Where am I going to get my daily dose of adrenaline from now?" Because that episode seemed to show us how John really is just like everyone. He too is an addict.
 

Last edited by LoveIsAViciousMotivator (May 14, 2014 2:23 pm)

Seconded! I guess what we're debating here is basically the same as debating whether chocolate or vanilla tastes better. Some people find a romantic relationship more interesting, some people find the friendship story more interesting. I'm in the second group.

I don't see why some people need to be so agressive about it. I like a debate for fun, to understand people who think different a little better and to explain my own views. Sometime the debate might get a little heated but I mean no offense. 

So for me the show is about a strong friendship and I'm happy with that. People who ship johnlock think it would be more beautiful if that relationship was a romantic one and they prefer to see it this way. Solar, Suzi, Gently, am I representing you correctly if I frame it like this? I'm assuming we're not discussing what the original makers had in mind, we're discussing how we prefer to interpret it. 

What interests me is why some of us prefer the one and others prefer the other. 

SusiGo wrote:

I do not know any heterosexual man who behaves like John does when meeting Janine in Sherlock's flat. Never. Astonishment, amusement, a clap on the shoulder, well done, mate - but not this exasperation and disbelief bordering on anger. And he does not stop even when Sherlock urgently wants to talk about Magnussen.
Neither do I know men counting the text messages their male friends receive from women. But maybe this is just me.  

I thought he was just surprised. Because this is Sherlock. 

For what it's worth, I'm in the same camp as silverblaze, in that I feel that this is the most beautiful and enduring friendship - even if the writers did try to rock it a bit last season! (Which they'd better not do any more!!), and I'm happy for it to stay that way.
There are a variety of reasons I feel this way, but one of them is this:
I've yet to watch a a TV show where the writers can accurately and believably portray a romance, especially where it's a romance between two people who start out as friends or colleagues; they seem to mess it up every single time.
Having said that though, I've got no problem at all with people interpreting the relationship as a love story In the romantic sense, and I do think the writers have had fun in the past, teasing those who are into Johnlock!

Last edited by Tinks (May 14, 2014 2:48 pm)

SusiGo wrote:

Neither do I. 

Yes, many things are a matter of interpretation. The thing that convinced me of the existence of Johnlock in the show was the sheer mass of narrative, visual, musical and other elements pointing in that direction (which have been analysed by many clever people well versed in film and literature analysis).
But if course I accept when people see it in a different way. It only gets difficult the moment one does not accept the others' point of view and/or gets aggressive about defending one's own opinions. 
 

Yes!  

Everyone is entitled to their intrepretation of the show and I love reading what others see or feel about certain scenes. I love it! Despite my position, I have read great views on Johnlock as well as meta for the pairing.  It's all cool! XD

But I don't enjoy it when people post their opinion as fact and let fanon get into canon to the point where if someone sees something differently, they are told off. That's sad. People should welcome other people's opinions. No need to get aggressive. IF people don't agree, they don't agree. Don't let others spoil the show or your opinion, but don't guilt trip people who don't see or feel it the way you do. 

Let's all just respect other people's opinions. I don't post my opinions to spoil or change people's minds. If you agree me, cool, but if you don't, that's cool too. 
 

It's a fabulous idea.
But doesn't happen in BBC Sherlock....well, at least not with John and Sherlock.

Last edited by besleybean (May 14, 2014 4:44 pm)

Nothing wrong with Johnlock fantasies at all and have indeed produced much fan fic and fabulous fan art.

No and no.

tonnaree wrote:

SolarSystem wrote:

silverblaze wrote:

What interests me is why some of us prefer the one and others prefer the other. 

I prefer Johnlock because in the light of everything I mentioned above it feels right and good and perfect to me.
 

 
Because I really like the idea of two incredibly hot men going........................ah, what Solar said.  Yea, for reasons.

Liar!