Okay. Well I can accept the importance of the distinction for you.
As I don't believe in either, it's a moot point for me of course.

Again I understand that, but once again, of course I disagree.

Yes, this again is sometimes what I get confused about with the Johnlock side.
If I have to read/see pairings at all... I would prefer it it be gay pairings.
I also have no issue with Johnlock in fan art/fic/vids etc.
Heck if people want to read Canon or see BBC Sherlock as Johnlock, that's up to them.
Nobody has ever argued against any of these things, well certainly at least I haven't.
Possibly the difference for me is TJLC:
If this mean an assumption that Johnlock was intended, written into the show and is going to happen.
That for me is an absolute no. I think the team has always made this clear and Mark's Mumbai interview finally settles that.

Last edited by besleybean (June 12, 2016 7:41 am)

How old is that interview? I couldn't find a date at the mobile version.

Liberty explained all of this...but maybe on the other thread!
Between series 2 and 3, but the comments closely match those of Mark and Steven on the HLV commentary.

I think they said in the comments that at first, Martin played John so very jealous in the Janine scene that they had to shoot it again. Another contradiction?

I'll dig out the quote, but I know when we discussed this, it seemed as if they meant he looked as if he was jealous because Sherlock had a really hot girlfriend!   They didn't say he looked very jealous, I don't think - but anyway, they didn't want that because John was pleased for Sherlock, not jealous that he'd scored.   I thought it was nice that this fits exactly with what Martin says!

So I looked into the article you pointed out, but I don´t see that this interview can be actually used as an anti-Johnlock argument.
 
I presume you have spoken about this quote specifically:
 
John Watson, famously is written as a bit of a ladies man, so what will he make of Sherlock's love interest in episode one:
 
"John thinks Sherlock would be much healthier if he had a relationship with a human being as opposed to a theory or something. John in the interim, according to the writers, he's had a number of girlfriends, so I think he'd like Sherlock to do the same. I think it makes Sherlock more human in John's eyes."
 
First, the very question Martin is asked is bizarre. Sherlock had a love interest in episode 1? When was this? Are they speaking about ASIB? So that would mean that Irene Adler was Sherlock´s love interest because they exchanged a few witty wisecracks and deep looks into each other´s eyes together (they did not physically made love, that´s for sure)? Then what does it make John who exchanges such wisecracks and deep looks with Sherlock all the time? Why isn´t he regarder as Sherlock´s love interest too? There isn´t any real reason for that except the presumption that people are heterosexual by default and that such signals don´t „count“ in case of two men.
 
And the answer is just Martin´s explanation to how he plays John – as a man who is under the misconception that he knows what is healthy for Sherlock and under the misconception that if he goes after many girfriends then Sherlock certainly wants to do the same. But we know that the thing is a misconception because:
 
[list=a]
[*]Sherlock never once professes any kind of erotic interest in women. The thing is obvious from the very start (established with the first scene between Sherlock and Molly) and remains constant through the series. Is also consistent with the canon, I might add.
[*]Sherlock is obviously the happiest doing his work and spending his time with John. If he wanted to have a female somewhere near him to make him more „healthy“, maybe he would have mentioned this fact at least once?
[*]The amount of self-sacrifice Sherlock is willing to undergo for John´s sake... it speaks for itself, IMHO.
[/list]
 
This Martin´s explanation is interesting, but it doesn´t invalidate Johnlock in any way.
 

Liberty wrote:

But yes, Irene is a "love interest" in that episode, not because she's female, but because of how the story plays out.  And John clearly thinks she's a love interest.  And although Sherlock claims not to be interested in relationships (and never actually gets into one with Irene!) he does fall for Irene - I don't even think John knows that for certain, but there's enough there that he clearly expects him to feel something for her, expects her to be upset after her death and so on, and he clearly picks up on the sexual chemisty later.   And of course, they flirt in a way that John and Sherlock certainly don't - no making each other beg for mercy and all that! 

Irene is an exotic creature while John is an ordinary, commonplace type of a man. He also shares a flat with Sherlock so the novelty has worn off a bit. That´s why Sherlock interacts differently with Irene. But when we compare the body language of both "pairs" around each other, they are surprisingly similar...
...so again, how does this invalidate the possible attraction between these two men?
And yes, Sherlock didn´t flirt with John the way he did with Irene. He openly processed his love and admiration of him during his TSOT speech. He also killed a man for John´s sake and paid a severe personal price for it. In my opinion, he would never do such things for Irene, no matter how hard he was otherwise falling for her.

Liberty wrote:

 But the main thing is that it fits so well with this (from Arianne de Vere, as usual):
MARK: He just can’t believe it! But he is actually pleased for him.
STEVEN: Remember the very first cut? It made him look as if he was jealous.
MARK: Which was not a good idea.
STEVEN: [We were] saying, ‘No, no, no, he’s thrilled, but a little bit “What?! Out of nowhere, you’ve got the really hot girl from the wedding!”’

It seems that at first it looked as if John was a little jealous of Sherlock having such a gorgeous girlfriend, but that took away from the fact that he's pleased for him, as Martin said John would be (although I think his main feeling at the point is gobsmacked!). 

So it helps to clear up what John thinks about Sherlock having relationships. 

Janine scene is a good example as to why John isn´t a reliable source of information when it comes to the question of Sherlock´s love-life. He clearly thought Sherlock and Janine were an item - when he could easily discern that Sherlock is just faking it, based on his knowledge of the man. But John always lets himself be mislead by appearances... so how do we know his regard of Irene Adler as Sherlock´s love interest wasn´t similarly faulty?

Liberty wrote:

 Then there's the TAB conversation too, where mind palace John is asking Sherlock why he chooses to be alone, clearly concerned for him and (I think) hoping he would find somebody.  It all fits together.

Yes, he interrogates Sherlock why he chooses to live as he does, but we can only presume to what goal. He might do it because he hopes Sherlock would find somebody, but he can equally do it simply to understand Sherlock better...

I did mention that above, Tonnaree.   Do you mean we shouldn't count TAB as any sort of insight into John?  Possibly, but it's still interesting that how Sherlock sees John aligns with how Moftiss see John and how Martin plays him - it's quite possible that Sherlock is aware of his concern.  He just uses it to question himself (because actually, it concerns him that he chooses to be alone too, I think, although he pretends that it doesn't).  It's still rather sweet that he picks up on John's concern. 

Nakahara, as I've said, it doesn't negate Johnlock at all.  I just brought the conversation over here because it did seem a little Johnlock-related.   It doesn't really matter whether John correctly or incorrectly assessed what Sherlock felt for either Irene or Janine - the point is that he cares for him and wants him to have a girlfriend - he wants him to be happy. 

(Incidentally, I think the term "love interest" is about Irene's role in the episode, rather than about John's view of the relationship - she's a love interest for the main character, however you think that played out ).