I am not sure I think any of them are gay, though. John enjoys chasing women, and in my view (which I don't know if anyone agrees with), Sherlock was imitaded by Irene's sexual advances. Probably because of his lack of experience, so he didn't know how to deal with such a situation. And I don't think he would be sexually intimated by a woman if he was gay. 

I think that in the case of Sherlock and John, they just love each other for who they are and that their geneder is sort of less important. 

Vhanja wrote:

I think that in the case of Sherlock and John, they just love each other for who they are and that their geneder is sort of less important. 

I agree, and a lot of Johnlockers don't really say that they are or have to be gay.
The way I see it, Sherlock is johnsexual and John is not interested in men, for him it's just this one man. (A bit like with Ianto in "Torchwood", if you happen to know that show)
 

I see it a slightly different way. I think Sherlock is probably gay but has been repressing his sexuality for a long time. I do not see him attracted to women in a sexual way. 
As for John - this is a bit tricky. He feels mainly attracted to women but I think he might be bisexual or just attracted to this one man. He is a man who represses a lot of things, who has difficulties in trusting people or talking about his emotions. We know next to nothing about his relationship with Harry and why she became an alcoholic but we can assume that her life has not been easy. In series 1 and 2 we see John serial dating, always in search of the "right woman" and always failing because Sherlock either crashes his dates or John chooses Sherlock over the respective woman. It is a fact that John only manages to have a longer relationship when he thinks Sherlock is dead. 

besleybean wrote:

Though continues  it, marries her and makes her pregnant after he knows Sherlock is very much alive.
He is also prepared to risk everything, to make Mary safe.

I think that he loves them both. 
 

The 'nonlock' thread is here http://sherlock.boardhost.com/viewtopic.php?pid=199378#p199378

Maybe discussion about what it should look like should also go there so that this thread can be used for debate. I'm not sure how much need there is for a nonlock thread, I just thought I sensed some frustration and mayby it might be nice to be able to talk about ones views on their relationship without it having to be a debate. 

SusiGo wrote:

I see it a slightly different way. I think Sherlock is probably gay but has been repressing his sexuality for a long time. I do not see him attracted to women in a sexual way. 
As for John - this is a bit tricky. He feels mainly attracted to women but I think he might be bisexual or just attracted to this one man. He is a man who represses a lot of things, who has difficulties in trusting people or talking about his emotions. We know next to nothing about his relationship with Harry and why she became an alcoholic but we can assume that her life has not been easy. In series 1 and 2 we see John serial dating, always in search of the "right woman" and always failing because Sherlock either crashes his dates or John chooses Sherlock over the respective woman. It is a fact that John only manages to have a longer relationship when he thinks Sherlock is dead. 

With John, I think his lack of success with women is partly just to do with the relationship with Sherlock being central.  It's never going to be about John's other relationships (they've actually added in a lot more about Mary than was necessary, I think - although I do see that that they wanted the best man's speech on screen, so had to do the wedding, and couldn't then have her as a minor character). 

Sherlock Holmes in the book, I could very much buy him being gay (and I think he admires Irene Adler, but I don't get the feeling of sexual attraction that I do with TV Sherlock).  For someone who thinks emotions are a flaw anyway, it's easy to see a gay man thinking that even more so of sexual/romantic love - there could be no traditional happy ending there, but the risk of heartbreak, imprisonment, blackmail, etc.   It would make sense for him to turn to drugs instead, and to feel slightly bitter and alone over it (which I think is hinted at the end of TSOT). 

But modern day Sherlock has no need to suppress his sexual orientation, and it's carefully shown that it's NOT that kind of world - homophobia has virtually disappeared from the Sherlock universe and there would be no problem with him having sex or relationships with men.  I think he just chooses not to express his sexuality in general, whatever his orientation is (I think it's ambiguous, but I definitely saw an attraction to Irene - that's part of the point of the episode, isn't it?).   The point is made that he's a virgin, not that he's gay.  He thinks those feelings are a disadvantage so suppresses them  - it wouldn't matter what sex he was attracted to.   But what I see is that it does become a disadvantage with Irene, when he lets the practiced repression slip a little.   That never happens with John - what he feels for him never becomes a "disadvantage".   John is good for him - work-wise, personally, etc. usually.

Regarding Irene.  I don't see it as sexual.
I've always read Sherlock's interest in her as a puzzle he wants to solve. He can't easily figure her out and that annoys the hell out of him.

Irene has always been problematic for me, since Canon and into BBC Sherlock,
I never agreed with the team's representation of her and any attraction between her and Sherlock.
I tell you what I think is interesting, though:
I was impressed on the DVD extras, with Lara talking about Irene.
Even better, Lara gives an extensive piece about Irene in The Chronicles and it is really excellent.
I think she has a different take from the male point of view.

I agree, buit could certainly be seen as Sherlock being thought of as straight, then...otherwise, why not have him challenged by a male?

Oh yes, there are some portrayals of sexually submissive/masochistic women expressing their sexuality rather than being paid for a service.   It's just extremely rare to see it with dominant/sadistic women.  So rare that I'm really struggling to think of any right now at all.  I don't expect the show to be a trailblazer, but it's disappointing.  (It's a bit of a bugbear of mine!)

In the show, the Royal story was kind of a sideline - it wasn't really those pictures that were the important things on Irene's phone.  That was used to mislead Sherlock. 

And I agree, Besleybean - they could have made Irene male (especially considering the type of story) - or perhaps used another male character to challenge Sherlock in that way.   It's not confirmation that he's straight, but it's the most we see about his sexuality. 

Last edited by Liberty (December 13, 2014 4:23 pm)