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October 27, 2012 6:57 am  #201


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Iwantthatcoat wrote:

VivaCohen:
I am demisexual/asexual. And I went my whole life thinking what you said was true, but apparently it isn't exactly. People do feel lust for strangers. We are talking about /attraction/ here, not / behavior/. That is the key point. A "normal" person wanting to jump someone's bones doesn't mean they actually do it; but a demi doesn't feel the /urge/ to jump strange bones. I think it is similar to being sapiosexual (which is also a very real possibility for Sherlock). A sapiosexual sees intelligence as the most important factor and does not care much about other things ( including gender). Now as far as our dear Sherlock is concerned, I think it is very possible he is a sapiosexual who thinks everyone is an idiot.

Sapiosexual lol I like that... he could be

It just seems odd to me as I know so many people who only lust over people they have an emotional bond with. It's as if half the people I know are demisexual then. And it's almost a female stereotype to only lust over someone you have an emotional bond with. I'm just surprised it's in a category of its own. For one thing, many people have "types" and don't lust over anyone but someone who is their "type" tall, blonde, short, brunette for example... so why is there not a category like "demisexual" for them? Only feeling that type of attraction for someone a person has an emotional bond with is the same thing, in a way. It's feeling attraction only under certain conditions. Yet only feeling attracted to one "type" still falls strictly under heterosexual or bisexual or homosexual etc. while type doesn't even have it's own term. I guess what it is is that all sexuality is on a sliding scale and everyone is just somewhere in between so it doesn't work so well to try and make it black and white.

Anyway, I'm rambling, possibly incoherently. I guess I need to go find a forum about this instead of a Sherlock forum before I derail everything


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“The only people for me are the mad ones, the ones who are mad to live, mad to talk, mad to be saved,
desirous of everything at the same time, the ones who never yawn or say a commonplace thing, but burn, burn, burn!" - Jack Kerouac
 

October 27, 2012 7:49 am  #202


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

But please stay here!
This is a fascinating discussion and on my other Sherlock forum we have an ' Asexuality' thread too.
It is such an important issue regarding Sherlock.
I will make my own personal confession now.  When I was 1st put onto the AVEN website and I began reading about asexuality...it was like a Road to Damascus experience.  I say that as a married woman with 2 kids!
I certainly found it most helpful on my other board, when an asexual member freely shared her experience with us. Gives one a whole new perspective.


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October 27, 2012 1:31 pm  #203


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Which other board-and can you link me? As much as I know I risk annoying others by threatening to drag the post off topic, and as incredibly dorky as I know it sounds, this show changed my life. Visibility of a minority can do that. It does with Uhura, it does with Ellen, it does here too. I am also a married woman with kids. I know that part is a piece of why I ship Sherlock/John sometimes...I want to see "my" relationship work ultimately. (Read the fanfic Thermodynamics to see what I mean) But I am equally fine with them developing the greatest non-sexual love story ever. I trust these writers. They are fans of Sherlock like me (since I was 11).
To return to topic do I don't feel guilty--- the only issue I have with him not being a virgin is that it would likely help him be a better detective. But maybe research would be enough? I think he had a very very extensive knowledge about sex, hence it doesn't scare him. But connecting body and mind? That would scare the hell out of him. I struggle every day with not viewing my body as transport.

 

October 27, 2012 2:10 pm  #204


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Ok, PMd links to you, now for the rest of the discussion:

I think many of us here would say the show changed our lives...for the better.
I think Benedict doesn't really want to be an icon for the asexual community, but he does seem to at least acknowledge that Sherlock probably is asexual....tho maybe that should be either demi or sapiosexual!
I don't know whether people are using the possibility of Sherlock having had a girlfriend as a reason for him being with John or against!
I'll throw another spanner into the works:  on my other board, there was a huge fight about whether Sally was an ex-girlfriend!
I really hope they keep this as a bromance and actually have no doubt they will.
As I've said before. I have to accept Sherlock may have had a girlfriend, tho I would have thought the whole point with Irene was that she was the only one ever.
See I think we have to take Sherlock at his word:  sex doesn't alarm him...but then does that throw the confusion of celibacy into the pot?


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October 27, 2012 2:28 pm  #205


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Iwantthatcoat wrote:

VivaCohen:
I am demisexual/asexual.

So who gave yo the idea that you were asexual/demisexual/anthingsexual???

People do feel lust for strangers. We are talking about /attraction/ here, not / behavior/. That is the key point. A "normal" person wanting to jump someone's bones doesn't mean they actually do it; but a demi doesn't feel the /urge/ to jump strange bones.

And who told you that it is 'normal' to feel such strong sexual urges toward another person?


____________________________________________________________________________________________
Also, please note that sentences can also end in full stops. The exclamation mark can be overused.
Sherlock Holmes 28 March 13:08

Mycroft’s popularity doesn’t surprise me at all. He is, after all, incredibly beautiful, clever and well-dressed. And beautiful. Did I mention that?
--Mark Gatiss

"I know that you believe you understand what you think I said, but I’m not sure you realize that what you heard is not what I meant."
Robert McCloskey
 

October 27, 2012 3:30 pm  #206


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Ok first of all, deep breath so I dont take this as a personal attack. I'm not very good at not taking " who told you and multiple question marks and questions without other commentary as not a personal attack, but I will try.
My definition of my sexuality comes from research on my part. A lifetime of it. No one told me what I was or wasn't. I think all labels are inadequate in some way.. people don't fit neat categories often. I also believe sexuality is fluid and moves along a continuum and can certainly change. Even catch you off guard. Is your issue with how I choose to self-define, or that someone else may have stuck this label onto me without my consent?
As far as lust goes, I said that people have it. Not everyone. I don't. But many do. Lust exists. Nothing wrong with that. 
I put "normal" in quotes for a reason. "Normal" is a loaded concept. There are things that are probably typical, or more or less common. I use the word in terms of " the norm", not to support some false normal vs abnormal dichotomy.

Last edited by Iwantthatcoat (October 27, 2012 3:31 pm)

 

October 27, 2012 3:35 pm  #207


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Sexuality is far to complicated. I am glad Benedict doesn't see himself as an icon for the asexual community. He's just a damn fine actor playing a damn fine character. To be an advocate requires research and I a deep interest on the topic.
Sherlock as a character will probably always be somewhat of an asexual icon. If he springs to life, we will see if he is an advocate. If he springs to life, I want to meet him.

 

October 27, 2012 3:41 pm  #208


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Sally is definitely something. That degree of hostility is meaningful... and she is introduced as an "old friend". I think that means they likely have a past ( the "old" part), and were *once* friends .

 

October 27, 2012 3:53 pm  #209


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

See I don't see this with Sally at all....but don't want to get OT.
Suffice to say I don not think Sally is an ex-girlfriend.


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October 27, 2012 4:54 pm  #210


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Oh I didn't mean she was a girlfriend. I think maybe he might have manipulated her in some way ( like Molly) and it was a long time ago. I can't see him ever wanting any real relationship with her.

 

March 13, 2013 10:26 pm  #211


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

And yet another indication of Gatiss and Moffat being true to canon - bromance isn't dead.. or, what was OK back then.. see http://www.dailylife.com.au/photogallery/news-and-views/dl-opinion/when-real-men-held-hands-20130313-2g04t.html

 

April 14, 2013 3:53 am  #212


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

I imagine that Sherlock would think being in a relationship is trivial and boring. Personally, I believe that he is asexual. I don't think he veiws people sexually, but rather he sees them as puzzles to be solved and taken apart again. He doesn't need physical intamacy because he is satisfied by his own mental pleasures. If nothing else, Sherlock views sex as an unecessary distraction and an emotional vulnerability. As we all know, caring is not an advantage.

As far as Irene Adler goes, I don't feel like Sherlock is physically interested in her. Everyone else is so easy to read, but she's a challenge. He almost sees her as an equal, which is why he goes to great lengths to impress and protect her. He cares about what she thinks of him and what happens to her because she intrigues him.

 

April 16, 2013 9:27 am  #213


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

i believe he never did have, as he said he is "emotionally unattached"


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April 30, 2013 8:37 pm  #214


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

My thoughts: 
 
1.  Cute as I am, I've never really had a romantic relationship and I'm approaching 50.  Abstinence isn't that tough.  I find it unbelievable that unmarried people actually uproot and move (or choose a university) just to maintain a relationship! 
 
2.  Sherlock is inexperienced because he has been a loner, something people choose when other humans have been a source of more pain than pleasure.  As he grows, he will learn how to prevent that pain, and that all worthwhile things in life come from other people.   
 
3.  Because of the criticism and coldness he endured growing up (criticism and coldness create loners) Sherlock probably assumed he was undesirable and therefore incapable of landing anybody he really wanted.  As a result, he probably didn't even try.  Attention and the occasionally stolen kiss from those who fancied him would have been insufficient to persuade him he was desirable.  He would have assumed anybody attracted to a loser must also be a loser.  
 
4.  The show's creators will maintain Sherlock's virgin status because Moffat is correct.  "...it's someone who abstains who's interesting."  Dangle something desirable in front of the fandom, say "No one can have him," and watch the obsession proliferate.  Everybody wins!


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April 30, 2013 8:37 pm  #215


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Oh yes.


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May 2, 2013 5:33 pm  #216


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Even if Sherlock is unattached, maybe he had one experience because he wanted to try...

 

May 2, 2013 7:06 pm  #217


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

dory1006 wrote:

Even if Sherlock is unattached, maybe he had one experience because he wanted to try...

In one of my fantasies, he asks Molly to deflower him after the Irene Adler fiasco because he realizes how desperately he needs greater understanding in this area.


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May 2, 2013 7:09 pm  #218


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

Which kind of ruins the impact of Molly in Reichenbach and(I hope in) the new series.


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May 2, 2013 7:13 pm  #219


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

besleybean wrote:

Which kind of ruins the impact of Molly in Reichenbach and(I hope in) the new series.

Time isn't linear in my fantasies.


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October 3, 2013 7:35 am  #220


Re: D'you think Sherlock has ever had a girlfriend?

I am asexual myself, but I classify as demi heteroromantic (yes, let's hope I never fall in love with a non-asexual. That would be problematic).

I can definitely see Sherlock as being asexual. I can also see him as possibly having romantic attraction to others. One of the things that always gets confused is that most non-asexuals (maybe I should just write sexuals? ) assume or tend to think that asexuals can't have romantic feelings for others. They can. But it's tricky. Many asexuals are afraid to act because, as another poster wrote - we are in the minority.

That said, this could explain why Sherlock seems highly possessive of John (imho) and has crashed John's dates/ said inappropriate things in front of John's girlfriends etc. I don't think he's doing it to be a jerk. I honestly think he's very fond of John, and deep down - he fears possibly losing John.

Also, Sherlock sees and observes everything he possibly can. When Irene Adler confronts him naked, her willingness to show off her body is revealing about her nature and about how she views power. She has no fear in that regard, and Sherlock correctly deduces that her measurements could be the code for the safe. I don't think he was looking at her for any sexual reason.

I do think he was attracted to the idea that she was witty and clever and he found her engaging and interesting. And Sherlock isn't the most in touch with his emotions -- he tries to divorce himself from his feelings, and this seems to be a trait Mycroft encourages (telling his little brother on Christmas that ''caring isn't an advantage'' - to which Sherlock changes the subject and complains about his 'gift' being ''low tar.'')

My guess is, deep down, Sherlock could have been much better with emotions - but he's written them off as irrelevant. However, he's not a robot - and his passion for many subjects and areas comes through loud and clear. Also, I sense a loneliness in him, which isn't atypical - especially for those who may be asexual but want a relationship or romantic connection with someone else. (When Molly said something about Sherlock looking sad - when he thought no one else could see (paraphrasizing)...that could also confirm he's confused by his own feelings).

Sherlock, for all his brilliance, may not even understand the various ways romantic feeling, affection, and sexuality can be expressed. If he's demiromantic, he wouldn't even realize, perhaps, that he could have stronger emotions for someone yet - because demiromantics never feel romantic affection for anyone right away. It's not immediate, like sexual attraction is for some (for most?) By definition, demiromantics have to have established an emotional bond or connection with someone else. Additionally - if Sherlock is not asexual - he could be demisexual - which would mean he wouldn't quickly develop sexual attraction, either. Many people go for a long time considering themselves to be asexual and later learning that they are in fact, demisexual. I guess this is another possibility.

Yet Sherlock often acts so immaturely or says things that push other people away, that perhaps John is one of the first - if not the first person - to really get Sherlock to consider that he can feel something more for someone else.

Just throwing out ideas. Sherlock is asexual in my headcanon, of course - but I can also see why some people feel he could simply be repressed. I think, even if he is asexual - he still represses certain emotions and certain needs (not just hunger, but the human need for friendship: before John, you really get the sense that he's not had any friends. Mycroft even laughs about it).

Anyway...I haven't read through the entire thread, so I hope I haven't just repeated what another poster has already written.

P.S. Romantic affection can exist as heteroromatic, homoromantic, demi-hetero, demihomo, panromantic etc. If Sherlock is capable of experiencing romantic affection, I would still have no idea where he'd fall! XD

P.P.S The idea of 'romantic friendship' was quite common in the Victorian era, especially between members of the same sex. I wouldn't be surprised if ACD was writing Sherlock and John as romantic friends. He seemed to partner them up for life.

And I do think, as much as Sherlock can love anyone, he loves John. That may be the romantic in me, though ;)

Last edited by Manticone (October 3, 2013 7:41 am)

 

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