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March 18, 2013 3:13 pm  #21


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

'Why would you want to replace a well done show with something equally well, just newer?'

- We all belong to a new generation, many people don't read anymore, they watch TV. We should let people meet the Holmes from the books on television, but then in a true and representative way.

I think especially that series brought a lot of (young) new readers to ACD, very likely more than other adaptations today do.
And sorry, times are changing, I for myself have a 10 year old son, and sometimes I am a little sad, that he doesn´t appreciate, what I liked when I was young. But that´s life, and there is also a lot of new good books and he can´t read them all (my old favorites and his new). Art is no tin can, and it only survives, when it has a kind of eternal everlasting spirit and truth. Moffat and Gatiss found one possible way to bring that out of the old ACD stories.
 
My son KNOWS Sherlock Holmes now and that´s because of BBC´s Sherlock! I wonder if he had become aware of him without these films.

Last edited by anjaH_alias (March 18, 2013 8:58 pm)

 

March 18, 2013 3:15 pm  #22


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

Please explain, because I don't see it...

Nobody saw it comming. After series 1 fanfic archives were filled with stories in which fans speculated on how it would be continued. Many of those stories included an explosion, caused by Sherlock shooting at the semtex. I don't think there was a single story that included no confrontation at all, but a simple call. It was such an amazing turning point.

That is why I love "Sherlock": It surprises me.

Last edited by Schmiezi (March 18, 2013 3:16 pm)


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March 18, 2013 3:21 pm  #23


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

That's great Be, but the thing I am afraid of is that people will see Sherlock as the real Holmes, he isn't, it is a clever adaptation, likable, good quality and all, but it isn't the real Sherlock Holmes we see in the stories. It is great if Sherlock makes people interested in the stories, but, judging of some reactions (mostly annoying Sherlock and John lovestory reactions) some people don't get the essence of who Sherlock Holmes is.

But what's wrong with that? I'm not interested in the canon and I have no idea how ACD Holmes is like. And what you said about the lovestories... well, everything we see on television must be open to interpretation. In my opinion there's no 'right' and 'wrong', so just let people go ahead.

*Sorry if this has been pointed out before, I didn't read the newer posts.

Last edited by Mary Me (March 18, 2013 3:22 pm)


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"Falling is just like flying, except there’s a more permanent destination."

"Sherlock Holmes is a great man, and I think one day—if we’re very very lucky—he might even be a good one."

"Would you like to-"
"-have dinner?"
"-solve crimes?"
"Oh"



 

March 18, 2013 3:26 pm  #24


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

It is not right or wrong, it is just a danger that the Sherlock Holmes books will be forgotten in the long run. (which, IMO, is wrong)


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March 18, 2013 3:29 pm  #25


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

It is not right or wrong, it is just a danger that the Sherlock Holmes books will be forgotten in the long run. (which, IMO, is wrong)

There is no danger at all. The series keeps also the canon alive. I'm sure the series will be forgotten in a few years but they will still remember Sherlock Holmes. Original is original and it won't be forgotten (that quickly)
 

Last edited by Mary Me (March 18, 2013 3:30 pm)


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Falling is just like flying, except there’s a more permanent destination."

"Sherlock Holmes is a great man, and I think one day—if we’re very very lucky—he might even be a good one."

"Would you like to-"
"-have dinner?"
"-solve crimes?"
"Oh"



 

March 18, 2013 3:31 pm  #26


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Let's hope so.


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March 18, 2013 3:47 pm  #27


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

It is not right or wrong, it is just a danger that the Sherlock Holmes books will be forgotten in the long run. (which, IMO, is wrong)

I think that adaptations like 'Sherlock' lead to the exact opposite. I read some of the stories many years ago and after watching the show I was motivated to read them again and to finally read the ones that I hadn't read back them. The show keeps Sherlock Holmes alive, especially because of the many nods to the canon - for me it makes the canon stories even more enjoyable when I recognize story lines or dialogues that can be found in the show. When I love something as much as I love Sherlock then I want to know where it's roots are. If it hadn't been for the show, who knows when I would have read the Sherlock Holmes stories again?
As far as I know the sales figures of the novels and stories have more than doubled since 'Sherlock' first aired - and that's simply amazing. 

Of course there are people who love the new adaptation but have no interest in the canon - but that's fine. I don't think that the original will be forgotten, really quite the opposite. 


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March 18, 2013 3:49 pm  #28


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Does this show keep Sherlock Holmes alive, or does the show create a shadow of Holmes, and keeps that alive?


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March 18, 2013 3:51 pm  #29


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

In some cases sticking to the original stories is not the best way of doing adaptation. While I have always adored Agatha Christie crime stories, I have yet to live to find a single adaptation I could really enjoy, for the simple reason that I remember the plot and I know immediately who, how and why. No whodounit left and even if some movies had excellent cast and production values, the are still boring for me. For the same reason I am not a great fan of Granada production: superb acting but it like "watching" instead of "reading" the original book. 
A truly creative adaptation, IMO, should on one hand never loose the tie with the original source, nor use it in a pure instrumental way (Ritchie, Elementary), on the other, however, should ADD some creative material and establish a valid dialogue with it. 

 

 

March 18, 2013 3:53 pm  #30


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

Does this show keep Sherlock Holmes alive, or does the show create a shadow of Holmes, and keeps that alive?

No, I don't think so. As mentioned, original stays original. There are so many adaptions - do you remember them all? Surely not, but you will definitely remember the canon if you've read it. 


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Falling is just like flying, except there’s a more permanent destination."

"Sherlock Holmes is a great man, and I think one day—if we’re very very lucky—he might even be a good one."

"Would you like to-"
"-have dinner?"
"-solve crimes?"
"Oh"



 

March 18, 2013 4:29 pm  #31


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

The Sherlock Holmes Society of London has seen their highest rise in membership EVER in the last two years, even more than when the Jeremy Brett series was on.

This series is bringing more and more people to the canon and to Sherlock Holmes in general. When I first went to a BBC Sherlock meet up in January 2012 I was a little disheartened that no one seemed to know much of the canon. When I went to one a few months later in May 2012 I was amazed by the change in the fandom - so many more people now aware of and appreciating the originals, as well as watching all the different adaptations.

Sherlock is helping to expand the world of Holmes and bring new Sherlockians to carry on the game for many years to come. I know that there are some people who watch Sherlock who might never read the canon, but then there's a larger percentage who will and I honestly have no criticism for the series at all.

Just don't watch Elementary. Then you really would be worried about the future of Sherlock Holmes. :-P


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March 18, 2013 4:39 pm  #32


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Sherlock Holmes wrote:

Just don't watch Elementary. Then you really would be worried about the future of Sherlock Holmes. :-P

My husband and me watch it regularly to tell each other why "Sherlock" is so much better. It's great fun!


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I still believe that love conquers all!

     

"Quick, man, if you love me."
 

March 18, 2013 5:44 pm  #33


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

I watched everything about Sherlock Holmes, Elementary too, I just didn't saw Sherlock Holmes in that series...


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March 18, 2013 6:19 pm  #34


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

- The current revival of Sherlock Holmes is great, but the shadowside is that the real Holmes is being forgotten, he is replaced by Sherlock and Robert Downey Jr.
- We all belong to a new generation, many people don't read anymore, they watch TV. We should let people meet the Holmes from the books on television, but then in a true and representative way.

The character has survived worse treatments than the ones received in its recent incarnations. And will continue to survive even after we are all gone. He's just that sort of man.

I don't think we should be unduly worried that recent interpretations are going to 'murder the canon.'

For me, personally, I reckon one would have to be in possession of a very limited imagination if they could only envision other people's versions of Holmes. You cannot 'replace' a fictional character with their on-screen representations. Whether you are being true to the source material or whether you go off on a wild tangent. You can never replace the vision that goes on in someone's mind. What I like about Sherlock is that it seems to have struck a nice balance for a wide range of people. It is loyal in spirit to the source material without taking a sledgehammer to either people's headcanons or indeed to the canon itself.

It's surely a myth that people don't read anymore (everyone loves to demonize technology.) Then again I've always been an avid reader so I can't imagine a world without books. The only thing that has changed is the format, not the words. (I think I may get my iPad/Kindle surgically grafted onto my body.)

On a bright note I love this fandom... it's the only one I've seen where someone could post a topic mentioning the word 'overrated' and for it to engender sane discussion rather than an outbreak of internet rabies.
 


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March 18, 2013 6:25 pm  #35


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Mnemosyne wrote:

On a bright note I love this fandom... it's the only one I've seen where someone could post a topic mentioning the word 'overrated' and for it to engender sane discussion rather than an outbreak of internet rabies.
 

We are gentlemen and ladies here ;)


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     Thread Starter
 

March 18, 2013 6:29 pm  #36


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Jacco111 wrote:

I watched everything about Sherlock Holmes, Elementary too, I just didn't saw Sherlock Holmes in that series...

Well, me neither. You could pretend that it's like watching a normal crime series, only until female Watson shouts "Sherlock!" - it's annoying. 
 


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

"Falling is just like flying, except there’s a more permanent destination."

"Sherlock Holmes is a great man, and I think one day—if we’re very very lucky—he might even be a good one."

"Would you like to-"
"-have dinner?"
"-solve crimes?"
"Oh"



 

March 18, 2013 7:07 pm  #37


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Mary Me wrote:

Jacco111 wrote:

I watched everything about Sherlock Holmes, Elementary too, I just didn't saw Sherlock Holmes in that series...

Well, me neither. You could pretend that it's like watching a normal crime series, only until female Watson shouts "Sherlock!" - it's annoying. 
 

I watched the pilot but I didn't like it much.
I just didn't see Sherlock Holmes in it at all. I had the impression that they simply made a typical American crime series, called the protagonist Sherlock Holmes, gave him a drug problem and threw in some bees.
Maybe it gets better later but I didn't find the pilot that interesting, so I don't think I will watch another episode.


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March 18, 2013 7:42 pm  #38


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

It is a nice series though. Just not Sherlock Holmes.
 


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March 18, 2013 8:17 pm  #39


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

Sad that we cannot ask ACD for his opinion anymore.
Sorry, if you already posted, but what is your favourite adaptation?
For myself I can repeat some of the others. I owned some Sherlock Holmes stories a while ago (paperback) and never read it, finally lost it.
After watching Sherlock I bought the ACD stories again. (Didn't manage to read, yet, but surely will.) So Sherlock led me to the original. Somehow.


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March 18, 2013 9:11 pm  #40


Re: Sherlock perhaps a little overrated?

I think the Jeremy Brett adaptations are the best. I do like the Rathbone version of  'The Hound of the Baskervilles' too.


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