Well, I'll try to not say too much then .  We've just had it screened in cinemas here (UK), with a Q and A after with Peter Capaldi, Jenna Coleman and Steven Moffat.  It was a great experience seeing it in a cinema full of people!  I found this list of screening timesfor other countries. 

Last edited by Liberty (August 23, 2014 10:32 pm)

Did you count the Sherlock references, my friends? There were many. Let's see how many I can remember.


SPOILERS BELOW

'Detective Inspector'
'The game is afoot, let's have a cup of tea'
'You called the police? We should do that more often' (So you did call the police. -John)
The umbrella swinging lady in Heaven

That's all I can remember off of the top of my head. Yeah, the first and last two might not actually be references, but you can't deny the similarities. I do remember there being more, so please add if you do too. 

Sherlock references ... yes.

The scene above London was so like the scene on top of Barts in TRF.  The ambiguous conversation, the possible suicide, with the victim returning from the dead.   They talked about "paradise" instead of "hell", but I almost expected to hear the "angels" line (which actually would have fitted quite well).  Anyway, I loved that whole scene.  The double reflections in the mirror was a great touch.  Peter Capaldi was fantastic.

Yes, I think the "Scottish" stuff was a reference to Amy, but also maybe to David Tennant (who didn't use his own accent), and Capaldi himself.  And Steven Moffat is Scottish too, of course.  But I wonder if it was also a cheeky reference to Scottish Independence?   (There's a referendum coming up in Scotland next month, and it's obviously quite a controversial topic!  Various famous people have spoken out on it - David Tennant was in the news recently saying that he didn't feel he could give an opinion as he was an ex-pat). 

I'm completely unsurprised that I love Peter Capaldi as Doctor Who!  (Yes, I know he's "the Doctor", not "Doctor Who", but I grew up with the series and we all used to call him "Doctor Who" when I was a child).  Love his outfit too, and love that they haven't given him a fez or a scarf or anything like that.  

Was the Q and A screened? 

Last edited by Liberty (August 25, 2014 7:12 am)

Liberty wrote:

Would love to discuss this Sherlockian part of the story, but will put it in spoilers as it's so soon after airing.

I just copied this out quickly so there may be mistakes, but here's the end of the conversation between the Doctor and Half Faced Man.

- It cannot end.
- It has to.  You know it does.  And there's only one way out.
- Self-destruction is against my basic programme.
- And murder is against mine.
- You are stronger than you look.
- And I'm hoping you are too.  This ... is over.  Are you capable of admitting that?
- Do you have it in you to murder me?
- Those people down there.  They're not small to me.  Don't make assumptions about how far I will go to protect them, because I've already come a very long way.  And unlike you, I don't expect to reach the promised land.
You realise, of course, one of us lying about their basic programming.
- Yes.
- And I think we both know who that is.

Very strong hints that the Doctor is responsible for the death, but it's still left ambiguous - what did you think?  I did think that "talking somebody into suicide" was a direct reference to Sherlock, and some of the conversation has some similarites to Sherlock and Moriarty's conversation on top of Barts.  (Not one of the angels, not expecting to reach the promised land, etc.). 

Anyway, the bolded line puzzles me - what does it mean?  Is he hoping that HFM is strong enough to kill himself?  Or what?

 

He's hoping that the robot is strong enough to kill himself so he won't have to kill him.

Liberty wrote:

Ah, so definitely

suicide, then.  That makes sense. And also makes it even more similar to TRF. 

I don't know.  To me it was very ambiguously done, so that you could see it from either side.  But killing is definitely not against the Doctor's basic programming...not when there are lives at stake.  We've seen him take lives when he had no other choice, and this Doctor seems to be a bit darker and less conflicted about that sort of thing.  Makes for an interesting dynamic.

Liberty wrote:

Yes, that what I first thought when watching it, that of course the Doctor would kill to save people.  But if he was planning to kill the guy, he wouldn't be hoping for him to be strong, would he?

The look Peter Capaldi gives after we see the body, is great!  He does look capable of murder ... but also capable of talking HFM into dying.

The world may never know the truth of it

*sneaks in* 
hm, so... I'm new to Dr who, and to fully enjoy this discussion, I should catch up a bit... could you wise people give some advice where to start? there's rather a lot to watch... and I feel a bit lost where I should begin?!? ;)  hints appreciated ...  
*sneaks out*

 

Last edited by Whisky (August 27, 2014 12:27 am)

Whisky wrote:

*sneaks in* 
hm, so... I'm new to Dr who, and to fully enjoy this discussion, I should catch up a bit... could you wise people give some advice where to start? there's rather a lot to watch... and I feel a bit lost where I should begin?!? ;)  hints appreciated ...  
*sneaks out*

I started (just recently) with the Ninth Doctor (Christopher Eccleston), right at the beginning. If you just want to try it out and watch an episode here and there to see if you like it, I would recommend (apart from "Blink") "Midnight", "Gridlock", "The Empty Child"/"The Doctor Dances" and "The Idiot's Lantern". 

 

Last edited by SolarSystem (August 27, 2014 5:21 am)

Davina wrote:

I would suggest starting with the reboot and Christopher Eccleston's Doctor as well. Catch up, if you can. Then I'd go back, back, back in time to the very first Doctor (William Hartnell) and work your way through all the other Doctors. Some of it will be dated but there are some great characters, plus you get to see the very first appearance of such creatures as the Daleks.

I have to be honest...Eccleston's tenure nearly ruined Doctor Who for me.  If I didn't know what was to come, I would have stopped watching.  There are a couple of good episodes (Dalek, Doctor Dances), but the bad episodes are SOOOO bad.  I enjoyed Tennant and Smith's eras MUCH more, though...and I think there are better episodes in their tenures.

My honest opinion, though ^^

You could just watch a couple of the award-winning episodes to start with and see if you like it. 

I grew up with Doctor Who and loved it, but when I've tried watching the old episodes again, it's not quite the same as watching them as a child, and I think it might be difficult to sit through many of them for anything other than nostalgia purposes.  It's probably worth having a look at one or two to get an idea of Moffat's and Capaldi's influences, though, even if it's just clips on Youtube.   Tom Baker was the most popular, I think, but I preferred Jon Pertwee.  In that case, you might as well go for The Green Death (which I thought was terrifying when I was a child!) because it has the same ending as TSOT. 

I think David Tennant might be the most popular of the new Doctors, but I think it would be fine to start with Matt Smith's first episode (it's quite a fun one) and work forward from there.   Matt Smith isn't my favourite, but there are some really good episodes and some good companions (you don't have Sherlock without John, and you don't have the Doctor without companions) who are involved in an overarching storyline.   It's the Matt Smith Doctor who's mainly referenced in Deep Breath, so that would take you nicely up to Capaldi. 

Then if you like it, go back to the beginning of the reboot and look out for Jack Harkness flirting with the Doctor, then follow him to Torchwood (if you haven't seen it.  It's an adult Doctor Who spinoff). 

I'll be honest, I'm not a proper Whovian, and Doctor Who is not (as good as) Sherlock, in my opinion.  But it's pretty good for children's/family TV and it's great to have a series which both parents and children can enjoy so much.  And some bits are really good - moving, exciting, etc.