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belis · March 14, 2014 2:49 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I should go to my doctor and ask for pain meds for these times when my back is being a total btch. But I won't... my doctor doesn't even know the extend of my pains. I used to be addicted to pain meds once and I just don't trust myself enough to have stuff like that lying around... so I just have to learn to deal with the pain...

You could be prescribed small quantity each time to avoid boxes of stuff lying around at your place if temptation is way to much. I do that all the time as many of my patients have a tendency to overdose on medication. Also there are stronger painkillers that are not particularly adictive. Other options like facet joint injections may also be available to you. Go and see your doctor.

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 14, 2014 3:02 pm

I might... I am considering it.

My last doctor didn't really take it seriously... I saw her for psychosomatic attacks in my stomach and told her about my tendencies... and other stuff as well. She prescribed me a large box of morphine like meds.

The thing though, is that I was not just addicted to the mediciation... I was addicted to harming myself no matter the means. I'm better now, saw a therapist; but it's a pitfall that scare the heck out of me...

I just lost my trust in doctors I suppose...

-Said the Healthcare Service Secretary aspiring to become a medical secretary. xD

Last edited by This Is The Phantom Lady (March 14, 2014 3:29 pm)

belis · March 14, 2014 3:51 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I just lost my trust in doctors I suppose...

Like with any other job there are good doctors, not so good doctors and also totaly crap doctors. Don't let a bad experience put you off. The next doctor you see may be more understanding and if they aren't just keep looking.

It's a funny thing about doctors and psychosomatic complaints. They tend to create all sort of anxieties in my collegues and they often do some pretty silly things as a result. Also after they have seen someone with a psychological problem they tend to see every other symptom through the prism of that. It's called diagnostic overshadowing. For a patient it often creates an impression of not being taken seriously.

Lack of trust in doctors is not a bad characteristic for a medical secretary. Our secretary keeps her tabs on me and that esures I stay on the straight and narrow. At least in terms of my paperwork. lol

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 14, 2014 4:14 pm

In that particular doctors defence I should say that she was the one who convinced me to see a therapist... and she got me to open up about some stuff.

I didn't change doctors myself... I had to when I moved away from my mother. The doctor I have now is really inexperienced. I know you have to start somewhere... but she has really shakey fingers and just doesn't seem to trust herself. When she gave me my HPV vaccine most of it ran down my arm because she forgot the cotton swab and band aid.

I get what you mean about secretaries not trusting the doctor they work for blindly. I trained at a childrens ward specializing in childhood obesity... I was training with 4 other women and two of them were totally smitten with one of the doctors... I was the only one who was asked to stay although they couldn't pay me.

belis · March 14, 2014 4:33 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
The doctor I have now is really inexperienced. I know you have to start somewhere... but she has really shakey fingers and just doesn't seem to trust herself. When she gave me my HPV vaccine most of it ran down my arm because she forgot the cotton swab and band aid.

The good thing about being inexperienced is that you tend to be a bit more open minded and question what you do a bit more. After a while there is a bit of a tendency to fall upon certain patterns and jump to conclusions. Inexperienced doctors also refer quicker and refer more patients to a specialist or for a second opinion. That's usually not a bad thing from patient's perspective.

She may just be a bit uncoordinated. General practice isn't a bad choice for doctors who don't have great manual dexterity. It may also be that she never really had much chance to develop this skill. I don’t know how it works in Denmark but in the UK it’s nurses who tend to give injections. When I need to give one once in a blue moon I need to think carefully about the steps involved despite being a doctor for quite a few years now.

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 7:30 am

It usually is the nurses who does it, but the nurse was sick and I had a double appointment so she said she would do it... Good thing I'm not afraid of needles though. But I bet she'll be a great doctor in a few years.

I am still debating if I should or shouldn't get an appointment. It feels like a big step. And being depressed it's not easy putting my own body first. I'm trying to remember what my therapist said. That taking care of your body is the first step to getting better. I know she was right.

Btw, the psychosomatic diagnosis was made in conversation with me; I sort of came up with it after a list of really uncomfortable test. All coming back negative... there's nothing physically wrong with my stomach and yet when it feels like it I get horrible cramps that last up to 18 hours. I haven't had one in a while thank goodness! I figured out they were triggered by stress

Last edited by This Is The Phantom Lady (March 15, 2014 7:36 am)

Mattlocked · March 15, 2014 8:06 am

When I read that you have a psychosomatic diagnosis I don't think you were a stupid teenager at all. Of course if there IS a damage the pain is probably both: psychosomatic AND physical. BUT.
Just read a bit about spine surgery and you will find again and again that a big part of back surgeries these days are useless waste. They often don't help at all or can even make everything worse.
(My husband had a herniated disc about 15 years ago, it was very bad and he (probably) really needed a surgery. So they did. After that he was fine and has no big problems anymore. I guess he was lucky.)

A high percentage of people have quite big spine damages and don't even notice their whole life long. Others have bad pain but no indication at all.

I have quite a lot psychosomatic problems, too, like problems with my stomach, pain in my back and such. The pain was very bad some time ago and they found a damage in my spine. One foot and part of my leg were already numb, but (thank god) nobody suggested surgery then. I got some treatment and some pills; both of it didn't help much, really. But after a while the main problems just "vanished". I still have pain in my back every day but I can live with it if it stays like this. If it's too bad it causes me a migraine and I need pills. But in general I got "used to it" and leg and foot are not dumb anymore. I now try to at least keep it like that (or make it better?) by walking, exercising a bit and do some anti-stress exercises. The last seems to be the most important thing, which I couldn't believe for a long time. Now I try being nice to myself, that's all, really.
It's still a lot of work and I have no idea what might be in some years, but I would never, ever agree to a spine surgery if it's avoidable somehow.

And I know from experience that one can have really bad pain and such - feeling like you gona die - and it's all "just" psychosomatic.

Last edited by Mattlocked (March 15, 2014 8:07 am)

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 8:23 am

I really want to avoid surgery, It can never be a good thing to touch a persons spine... I am trying to do exercises, mostly they make my back worse though... My back has two problems. There are the times like right now when the pain is located at the actual twist; my lower back and it feels like it's coming from my spine. I'm started to suspect there might even be damage to the disk. I've never had my back X-rayed but the twist is visable...

My other issue is my shoulder. I get knots under my right shoudler blade and I am sure it's linked to my twisted spine. The way I understand the little anatomy I had during my Healthcare Service Secretary training it would be pulling at my muscles. I was told no one can even touch those knots because they are hidden by bone. But eventually they let off... come back again and then let off. The most helpful thing I tried for that was accupuncture; although I broke most of her needles being so tense.

I know pain meds would help me too; to ease my tensed muscles and take away the brunt of the pain

What I meant by being a stupid teenager is that I got myself addicted to pain meds back then; which now mean I won't allow myself to have more than 2 tablets of the mildest kind in the house... Back then I didn't even have issues with pain like this. If I could back in time I would give myself the biggest slap ever.

It's good to hear you are dealing with your pain. I am happy for my good days; when it's only my feet... I really don't notice my feet much anymore.

Last edited by This Is The Phantom Lady (March 15, 2014 8:25 am)

Mattlocked · March 15, 2014 8:33 am

Right, those exercises they told me to do back then made everything worse, too. That's what I meant by doing "nothing", just be nice to yourself.
And I fully understand your problems with pills and such. I always almost panic when I need some because I don't want them to damage me more. And it's hard to consider each time how many of which I might take today, if the pain is really bad.
But then again, as you mentioned, they help easing and relaxing your muscles. They are usually the main problem, causing most of the pain. Maybe you can get different one, maybe, if you are afraid of getting addicted again, take them under strict regular control of your doctor. But you shouldn't condemn pills completely. Having been addicted to them in former times doesn't mean it happens again. As far as I know it's quite different to alcoholism and such.

If you really consider surgery you should ask several doctors first. And not just the "usual" ones. I don't know how it's in Denmark, but here most of the "orthopaedic specialists" are really crap. Try also a good osteopath first.

I have to leave now for my pottery course. I know that my back will be much worse when I come home later today, but still it's good for my soul, so I DO it!

Zatoichi · March 15, 2014 8:53 am

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I really want to avoid surgery, It can never be a good thing to touch a persons spine... I am trying to do exercises, mostly they make my back worse though... My back has two problems. There are the times like right now when the pain is located at the actual twist; my lower back and it feels like it's coming from my spine. I'm started to suspect there might even be damage to the disk. I've never had my back X-rayed but the twist is visable...

My other issue is my shoulder. I get knots under my right shoudler blade and I am sure it's linked to my twisted spine. The way I understand the little anatomy I had during my Healthcare Service Secretary training it would be pulling at my muscles. I was told no one can even touch those knots because they are hidden by bone. But eventually they let off... come back again and then let off. The most helpful thing I tried for that was accupuncture; although I broke most of her needles being so tense.

I attended a great program once that is really not comparable to normal exercises or the things physiotherapists do to you.. very subtle and very kind to the body, relieving pain and tensions by training the muscles to keep an anatomically substantiated posture.. I thought it was great for body and soul. If you want I´ll send you a link..

Last edited by Zatoichi (March 15, 2014 8:54 am)

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 9:12 am

I'd like that link thank you Zatoichi!

And ooh Pottery sounds fun! I spend a lot of time on my writing, cross stitching, painting and I've even started practising acting. Especially writing is great; I can really escape with that!

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 2:05 pm

My back is slowly getting better.

But now I'm close to tears. My mother just called me and in the middle of the conversation she told me that my youngest cat, Findus, is still sick! I was convinced he was doing better... the poor thing can't keep food down!

She is trying to change his diet and some of it seems to work for a while but then he's back at being sick again. I wish she'd take him to see a vet. I can't afford it, and I guess it's an expense for her as well. But I don't know what I'd do if I lost him.

It's hard enough not to have my 3 cats with me and only being able to visit them on the weekends I go and see my mother.

I feel absolutely useless right now

Mattlocked · March 15, 2014 2:36 pm

Since when is he sick? I mean, she didn't go to a vet with him? Sounds as if she really should! Reg. the money the vets usually agree to deferred payment if you explain your situation to them.

Now after the pottery course my back is aching, as expected. But it was great fun again and we will go on, probably an evening every second week.

I think I maybe know those kind of programs Zatoichi is talking about. There are several and I tried "Feldenkrais" and "progressive muscle-relaxation" so far. Both are nice, the latter I like most.

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 2:46 pm

He's been sick about a month now I think. It's times like these I really hate our arrangement... It's just strange really, I don't think she really sees this the way I do. She's always had a big heart for animals. I wish there was more I could do for him! I think a clinic close to where I live once in a while take care of animals free of charge. But I doubt my mother would let me take him with me.

She can be awfully stubborn when it takes her, ugh. Wonder where I got that from?

belis · March 15, 2014 2:51 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I really want to avoid surgery, It can never be a good thing to touch a persons spine...

Surgery isn't something that anyone takes lightly. Even if you are refered to a spinal suergeon they would look at all the options including conservative management, which is almost always preferable. In the end of the day it's up to you if you go ahead or not but if you discuss it with professionals at least you know exactly what options are there for you to choose from.

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I know pain meds would help me too; to ease my tensed muscles and take away the brunt of the pain

What I meant by being a stupid teenager is that I got myself addicted to pain meds back then; which now mean I won't allow myself to have more than 2 tablets of the mildest kind in the house... Back then I didn't even have issues with pain like this. If I could back in time I would give myself the biggest slap ever.

It's only natural that you are aprehensive about pain relief after your past experiences. The problem with pain is that it creates a bit of a downwards spiral. When you are in pain you instinctively avoid certain movments and hold yourself in certain way. That makes muscle stifness worse, which in turn creates more pain. Decent pain relief helps to break that cycle.

There are medications out there that don't have dependence potential. From simple things like paracetamol to various strengths of anti-inflamatories and things like tricyclic antidepresants. Again the final decision is up to you but it help to know all the options.

Sorry to hear about your cat. I presume that you have already tried to deworm him? I know in the UK veterinary schools often see pets at reduced rates. Would that be an option where you live?

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 3:10 pm

I mentioned deworming to my mother but she doesn't think that's the cause, so she won't try that. In her head she owns the cats when she pays for their food and I'm lucky that I get to pet them when I'm there... *sigh*. I will try to mention veteraniry school but I doubt she will bite. She's set on using the same expensive vet; recently it's been for the dogs fungal infection in his ear and his anxiety meds for New Years.

I really should start trusting myself again. The thing is; I think I was more addicted to aspect of hurting myself by swallowing large doses of pain meds (Nearly enough to kill me, should have damaged my liver too... I still don't understand how I didn't). So I just feel like any form of medication could get out of control for me. I'm not a child anymore though; I've grown stronger since then and I've found other outlets than doing stupid and dangerous things to myself... Okay, Tuesday I'll call my doctor and have a good talk with her about my back, shoulder and how I feel about pain meds...

Not doing anything about my back is just as destructive.

Mattlocked · March 15, 2014 3:14 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
Not doing anything about my back is just as destructive.

That's for sure.
At least you should start doing something about the pain. It maybe not healthy, but having no life quality at all isn't really healthy, either.

belis · March 15, 2014 3:40 pm

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I mentioned deworming to my mother but she doesn't think that's the cause, so she won't try that. In her head she owns the cats when she pays for their food and I'm lucky that I get to pet them when I'm there... *sigh*. I will try to mention veteraniry school but I doubt she will bite. She's set on using the same expensive vet; recently it's been for the dogs fungal infection in his ear and his anxiety meds for New Years.

Vomitting is pretty common in worm infestation in cats (and other animals including humans). It's easy enough and cheep to treat so I think it would be worth a go. You don't want a vet to charge arm and leg for treatment that is availble over the counter. Sometimes I wish I was a vet, I would have been rich by now. lol

This Is The Phantom Lady wrote:
I really should start trusting myself again. The thing is; I think I was more addicted to aspect of hurting myself by swallowing large doses of pain meds (Nearly enough to kill me, should have damaged my liver too... I still don't understand how I didn't). So I just feel like any form of medication could get out of control for me. I'm not a child anymore though; I've grown stronger since then and I've found other outlets than doing stupid and dangerous things to myself... Okay, Tuesday I'll call my doctor and have a good talk with her about my back, shoulder and how I feel about pain meds...

Not doing anything about my back is just as destructive.

It sounds that you know yourself and have developed some better coping strategies. An important part of recovery is to do a bit of theraputic risk taking. I'm not saying that you should have boxes and boxes of dengerous medication at home but you can probably trust yourself with more than you give yourself credit for. If you are particularly worried discuss with your doctor if you could pick up your prescriptions on weekly basis. Over here it can be arranged with pharmacy so it doesn't make any more work for the prescriber but medications are dispenced in small chunks. I love this system, makes me sleep so much better at night

Good luck for Tuesday.

Mattlocked · March 15, 2014 4:29 pm

But if the cat is that sick since weeks now you should already see the worms. She really should go and see a vet. Sorry, I am a bit worried now and it makes me sad when people have pet(s) but somehow don't take full responsibility for them....

I wish you all the best for tuesday and I hope you and your doctor will find an acceptable solution - at least for the beginning.
I had to take quite strong pills for a while but stopped taking them after several weeks. The "specialist" asked me: But if you have pain, why did you stop taking the pills? - Because I didn't what to take that sh*t for the rest of my life!?
As I said, the worst pain "vanished" later on and now I take those pills only when really needed, which in that case is no problem for me.

This Is The Phantom Lady · March 15, 2014 5:31 pm

Thank you, all of you!

It's breaking my heart about my cat; I really don't understand my mother this time. I know this particular cat has had a history of being a total pain in the rear (Not his fault, he appears to be brain damaged). But she's always been willing to do anything for a pet. She would even put them before her own child... and now what? Ugh. At least she says she's glad he's keeping his food down for about 30 minutes and he's not lost his appetite at all.

And I feel horrible, I should be able to do something. But that's just not how our relationship works.