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June 7, 2017 8:05 pm  #5321


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

tonnaree wrote:

besleybean wrote:

Possibly John's history is rather dull.

John Watson?
Three Contienants Watson?
Captain in the Fifth Northumberland Fusiliers
Three years in Afghanistan and a veteran of Kandahar, Helmand, and Bart’s bloody Hospital.

I must politely disagree.  http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png

And, I suspect, with a less-than-functional family, growing up.  Among other things, the odds are that Harry was not the only alcoholic in his family!

 

 

June 7, 2017 8:08 pm  #5322


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Liberty wrote:

I agree ... but that's just what I mean: it's got to be part of the case and relevant to the story (and of course, involve Sherlock).   What we saw with Mary fitted that bill.  And actually, although it wasn't backstory, but current, what we saw with John grieving in TLD did as well (the case was "Save John Watson").   I'd be more than happy to see something similar with John.  But I don't think too much irrelevant background detail is a good idea for either of them.  And certainly, Mary shouldn't have more irrelevant background detail than John!  We only get three hours every few years after all! 

But that's the problem: Mary's been given more background detail than John, period!  And as someone pointed out, she's one of the more minor characters, not an important one like Sherlock and John.  I, for one, would like that imbalance to be fixed, and to see a plot set up in which John's own family background and his army background become important, so that they'll have to disclose it.
 

Last edited by kgreen20 (June 7, 2017 8:10 pm)

 

June 7, 2017 8:09 pm  #5323


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Wonder if any of us will get our wishes fulfilled.


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June 8, 2017 11:15 am  #5324


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

kgreen20 wrote:

But that's the problem: Mary's been given more background detail than John, period!  And as someone pointed out, she's one of the more minor characters, not an important one like Sherlock and John.  I, for one, would like that imbalance to be fixed, and to see a plot set up in which John's own family background and his army background become important, so that they'll have to disclose it.
 

I agree wholeheartedly.


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June 8, 2017 11:22 am  #5325


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Same here. I must admit, I have a certain problem with a Holmes/Watson adaptation in which the back story of Watson's wife is more important than his own. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

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June 8, 2017 12:23 pm  #5326


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

SusiGo wrote:

Same here. I must admit, I have a certain problem with a Holmes/Watson adaptation in which the back story of Watson's wife is more important than his own. 

Seconded.
I would trade all of TST for 30 minutes of back story on John.

Of course I also really want to see Martin in camos and a white t-shirt.  http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png

 


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June 8, 2017 12:25 pm  #5327


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Bad, bad girl. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/lol.png


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

June 8, 2017 3:36 pm  #5328


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Well, it is as it is...we can't change the episodes we have.
I will take any new episodes...


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June 8, 2017 5:21 pm  #5329


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

besleybean wrote:

Well, it is as it is...we can't change the episodes we have.
I will take any new episodes...

Yes, and it would be really awesome if those episodes contained some back story on John.  http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png


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Proud President and Founder of the OSAJ.  
Honorary German   http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.gif
"Anyone who takes himself too seriously always runs the risk of looking ridiculous; anyone who can consistently laugh at himself does not".
 -Vaclav Havel 
"Life is full of wonder, Love is never wrong."   Melissa Ethridge

I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
http://media-cache-ec3.pinimg.com/736x/aa/2b/35/aa2b352725f4c944599a3ea17cbfe44e.jpg    https://31.media.tumblr.com/bb0f8896a79d19602eeaea0254ff5ccd/tumblr_n5ztxjGDB61stgn3no1_500.jpg
 
 

June 8, 2017 5:37 pm  #5330


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

tonnaree wrote:

besleybean wrote:

Well, it is as it is...we can't change the episodes we have.
I will take any new episodes...

Yes, and it would be really awesome if those episodes contained some back story on John.  http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png

Oh yes, please!


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June 8, 2017 5:49 pm  #5331


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

I would be happy with that, just not convinced we'll get it.


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June 8, 2017 6:17 pm  #5332


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

I kind of think we won't see it, simply because I feel that they've "done" backstory now - this was Sherlock Begins and now we're ready to move on.    And because although they do love bringing things close to home, they have Rosie in the here and now, so could easily make a very personal "John" story using her (Rosie as client?) without having to delve into John's past.  (For Sherlock they had to go back and invent a close connection, a sister, whereas John has a ready-made one in Rosie!).   But since it's going to take so long for another series (if it happens), they could surprise me completely and pleasantly!  I'll just stick by what I said, that it has to be part of the story/case, as it was with Mary and Sherlock. 

 

June 8, 2017 10:48 pm  #5333


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Well, that's easy enough for Moffat and Gatiss to do, if they'll only decide to do it; I've sent an email to Hartswood West, with a request for those two producers.  All they have to do is create a plot in which John's own past comes back to haunt him.  Perhaps someone he previously knew either as a child or as a doctor/soldier (or both) is plotting to kill him; as a result, just as Sherlock has done on 2 episodes, he ends up in the hospital fighting for his life.  (Having a strong moral principle can cause one to have enemies, as we all know.)  Sherlock can't be the only one with demons underneath the road he walks; it's a good bet that John does, too.  And in the process, ghosts from his own boyhood and army years could rise to torment him, so that he has to deal with them even as he and Sherlock are seeking to get this would-be killer before he succeeds in murdering John.  If it's going to be many years before they can ever produce a 5th season, they could produce this scenario as a one-shot, as they did with TAB; it would be much easier for everybody connected with the show to get back together for a one-shot episode than it would be for a whole season.  (Hopefully, John'll appear in that episode without a beard or mustache! =))
 

Last edited by kgreen20 (June 8, 2017 11:08 pm)

 

June 8, 2017 11:28 pm  #5334


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

That seems like a rather intense course of action, but I guess you might as well let us know if you get a response and anything comes of it.


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Clueing for looks.
 

June 9, 2017 6:07 am  #5335


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

I trust the talents of both Mark and Steven to give us whatever they choose and I am fairly certain they don't need help from others.
Other people are always free to make their own shows, of course and again: that is why we have fan art/fics/vids.


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June 9, 2017 6:14 am  #5336


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

That would be good as a one-off.  I would be happy to see John with a beard, though! 

Generally, though, I don't think it's necessary for both of them to have things from the past - Eurus didn't appear until TFP, and yet I think Sherlock worked well as a character up until then.  And we kind of have John's past already, what we need to know.   It was always Sherlock who was more of a mystery.   (And Mary, of course).   I think the obvious thing would be to go for a Rosie story for John if they wanted a personal one, especially as Rosie, like Mary, has the connection to Sherlock too ... but a flashback story would be good too. 

 

June 9, 2017 7:21 pm  #5337


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Oh, I would love more backstory on John! If there ever is a S5, it would be awesome if we had some of that. As Liberty mentioned, rolled up into a case for Sherlock and John.


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June 9, 2017 7:32 pm  #5338


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

Vhanja wrote:

Oh, I would love more backstory on John! If there ever is a S5, it would be awesome if we had some of that. As Liberty mentioned, rolled up into a case for Sherlock and John.

I would love that a lot too!


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June 9, 2017 8:04 pm  #5339


Re: Mary – the subject of discussion

I've been pondering this and thinking that although they are very much a duo, Sherlock is still the central character, and everything relates back to him.   For instance, although Mary was John's wife, her story affected him personally, partly through John and partly through his own relationship with her (and how much he cared for her and his vow to her).  Obviously losing Mary was John's story, but it was also very much a story of Sherlock's loss (of Mary and John) and reconciliation too.   In contrast, for instance, Sherlock's relationship with Irene was key to ASIB, but John didn't really have much relationship with her at all.   The same with Moriarty, to some extent.  Eurus, obviously.    Even characters like Jeff Hope and Culverton Smith, I suppose - they have a particular relationship with Sherlock and not so much a relationship with John.

Sorry, this is kind of OT, but the whole "how much backstory do we want" idea got me thinking about it, and I suppose I hadn't noticed before how much the show is Sherlock-centric.  Of course, it's called "Sherlock", and Sherlock is the detective!   But I hadn't really noticed in terms of relationships - the relationships of the clients and the villains to Sherlock are important, but their relationship to John is secondary.   Even (to get back OT) with Mary whose major relationship by far is with John, the writers created a relationship between her and Sherlock, with him going as far as vowing to protect her (when they could have still have had a "Mary" case without that relationship).

 

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