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June 28, 2016 6:21 pm  #5901


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

It's from ages ago.
I really wouldn't get too excited by this.


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June 28, 2016 6:33 pm  #5902


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

I'm not, I'm just curious about it. Where is it from?


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June 28, 2016 6:34 pm  #5903


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

I seem to think it was a paper interview.


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June 28, 2016 7:29 pm  #5904


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Of course they would do it if it was in the script.  Benedict has already done kissing scenes with Louise, Andrew and Yasmin (almost forgot Yasmin!).

Last edited by Liberty (June 28, 2016 7:31 pm)

 

June 28, 2016 7:30 pm  #5905


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

But the chances of it being in the script?
Personally, I wouldn't bet on it.


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June 29, 2016 5:53 pm  #5906


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

He and Andrew never really kissed, though. The cut the scene before their lips met (I think Ben said that somewhere, but can't remember where).

I am actually starting to wonder if Ben and Martin would refuse if it was in the script. Not because any of them are homophobes - I know Ben has played gay at least twice, and Martin doesn't seem to mind in the slightest either. But more because of the Johnlock and craziness surrounding it. They have already both been exposed to rather unpleasent experiences because of it - can you imagine what they would have to suffer from journalists and talk show hosts if they ever actually kissed in the show?!

Last edited by Vhanja (June 29, 2016 5:53 pm)


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June 29, 2016 6:17 pm  #5907


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Can't imagine it could get any worse than what they've already been exposed to, tbh.


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June 29, 2016 6:23 pm  #5908


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

I think it could get a whole lot worse, though for me, the point is moot.


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June 29, 2016 6:25 pm  #5909


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

It's still a kissing scene, and I don't imagine it was cut due to the actors refusing to do more (although, obviously, I don't know!).  And, the other two scenes do have actual kissing, so it's not as if Benedict refuses as a rule.

I remember this subject coming up before, and although I don't think the actors would refuse, I do wonder if they might feel kind of cheated at being misled.   I think it's pretty clear from interviews that they don't see Johnlock and haven't played it that way.  I know Amanda was misled over her character and seemed quite happy with it, but then her whole story evolved over one series, it was a character who was supposed to not be what she seemed, and I don't supposed she would ever have publicly denied being an assassin!   It seems almost insulting to Benedict and Martin to mislead them for years, assuming that they could play the characters as well if they "knew". 

Of course, a kissing scene wouldn't necessarily mean Johnlock, in the sense that the Molly scene clearly doesn't mean .. Mollock? (I'm sure there's another ship name that's escaping me).   It could be in somebody's imagination, like that one.  That would mean that they hadn't been lied to and they might be happier with that - I don't know.  Maybe they wouldn't mind being lied to any more than Amanda did!

In some ways, I think they might get less hassle if it WAS in the show, and they could just talk about it - I know people would ask about it, but they would be able to talk about a romantic relationship, openly, and the questions about it would not seem like harassment.

Last edited by Liberty (June 29, 2016 6:40 pm)

 

June 29, 2016 6:26 pm  #5910


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Well, I guess it's just semantics but I don't really consider Amanda was misled, but rather not told and some actors prefer it that way.


Sherlolly, is the word you are looking for!

Last edited by besleybean (June 29, 2016 6:28 pm)


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June 29, 2016 6:30 pm  #5911


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Yes, I did think that maybe "lied" is a strong word to use there.   But I agree, Amanda would have read and filmed the first two scripts, and then the third one would have come as a surprise - but all before the character was properly revealed to the audiences.   I think it would definitely be misleading Benedict and Martin if they were to get the script for, say, S4 Ep3 and it had a kissing scene AND (the important bit!) it turned out their characters were supposed to have felt that way all along.   Because Moftiss have presented it as a friendship since 2010. 

 

June 29, 2016 6:32 pm  #5912


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Incidentally, I am not a Sherlolly believer.
However, from watching Sherlock, strikes me it's no less possible to read a Sherlolly conspiracy, than a Johnlock one.


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June 29, 2016 6:35 pm  #5913


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

I think they are both professionals and would not shy away from doing their job. There are lots and lots of actors who are playing gay love scenes - for example Michael Douglas and Matt Damon come to mind - so why not them? 

As for Sherlolly and Sheriarty - the fact that both were shown in TEH as somebody's fantasy and in a way made fun of while we did not get any such scene with Sherlock and John is quite telling if you ask me. 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)



 
 

June 29, 2016 6:54 pm  #5914


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Sherlolly!  Thanks Besleybean and Susi.  I knew there was another word for it! 

I don't see Sherlolly, but then I don't see Johnlock either.   I think it might be a bit more difficult to see a conspiracy there because Molly is more of a side character, whereas with John, their relationship is central to the show.    I do think Molly is very obviously attracted to Sherlock, though. 

 

June 29, 2016 6:56 pm  #5915


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

The latter is without doubt and made explicit...I cannot say the same for Johnlock.


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June 29, 2016 7:01 pm  #5916


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

I don't think neither Ben nor Martin would have any problem to do a gay love scene in general, but perhaps in this context.


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June 29, 2016 7:01 pm  #5917


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

That's a good point Besley: I suppose it highlights that they do sometimes make attraction very explicit in the show.  I don't suppose anybody doubts it?  Actually, I did read somewhere that Molly was a lesbian, but I think that was (semi-) joking.

Last edited by Liberty (June 29, 2016 7:01 pm)

 

June 29, 2016 7:07 pm  #5918


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Does anybody actually dislike Molly?
I don't think I've ever come across anybody who does.
I suppose it could be as she's not seen as a threat to Sherlock, in the romantic sense...but also of course she has mainly only ever helped him. I guess a slap isn't as threatening as a gun shot!


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July 22, 2016 6:55 pm  #5919


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

This is a great compilation of everything (?) even remotely Johnlock-y in the show. From a list of general things running throughout the show to specifics in each episode:

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/HoYay/Sherlock

Last edited by Vhanja (July 22, 2016 6:58 pm)


__________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________
"We'll live on starlight and crime scenes" - wordstrings


Team Hudders!
 
 

July 22, 2016 9:04 pm  #5920


Re: Johnlock: The Official Debate

Vhanja wrote:

He and Andrew never really kissed, though. The cut the scene before their lips met (I think Ben said that somewhere, but can't remember where).

I am actually starting to wonder if Ben and Martin would refuse if it was in the script. Not because any of them are homophobes - I know Ben has played gay at least twice, and Martin doesn't seem to mind in the slightest either. But more because of the Johnlock and craziness surrounding it. They have already both been exposed to rather unpleasent experiences because of it - can you imagine what they would have to suffer from journalists and talk show hosts if they ever actually kissed in the show?!

 
I've wondered this, too. And, actually I think it's probably not wanting to feed Johnlock fever and placating Amanda, who expressed her discomfort with Johnlock.

 

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