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January 4, 2017 7:50 pm  #21


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

It was a bit James Bond.
I guess the jury is out on whether that is a bad or good thing.
As Mark so eloquently points out, Holmes was the action hero of his day.


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January 4, 2017 8:07 pm  #22


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

ewige wrote:

I know that, but I'm also a fan.
I think critics write their reviews based on watching the episode once. I loved Mark's witty response too, but I still feel the criticism was justified.

They did not just write it after having watched it once, they also wrote it without having seen the other episodes. Benedict stated expressly that you need to know all three, that they are closely intertwined and that the reward at the end will be enormous. These are no stand-alone episodes. 
 


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"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

January 4, 2017 8:13 pm  #23


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Sensible Benedict.


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January 4, 2017 8:22 pm  #24


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

But that's how tv reviews work. Nobody wants to read a review about TST three weeks after it first aired on tv. At least nobody who's not a fan. People are watching it on sunday and wanna read about it on monday or tuesday.
Of course the author could have mentioned that there's more to come and some things might make more sense once you've seen all three. Nevertheless, I totally agree with the James Bond comparison... and I'm pretty sure that the scenes which for me felt like James Bond from the start will still feel like James Bond in two weeks.
 

Last edited by SolarSystem (January 4, 2017 8:23 pm)


___________________________________________________
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January 4, 2017 8:24 pm  #25


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

I agree on that.
Mark is a huge Bond fan.


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January 4, 2017 8:30 pm  #26


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

*waving from the shallow end of the pool*
I thought the fight was sexy.   http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/love.png


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I ship it harder than Mrs. Hudson.
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January 4, 2017 8:32 pm  #27


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

I could hardly watch it...I am so petrified of water and the torture seasons were just brutal.


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January 4, 2017 8:57 pm  #28


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Love Mark's response!


                                                                                                                      

All lives end. All hearts are broken. Caring is not an advantage.

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January 4, 2017 9:07 pm  #29


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

tonnaree wrote:

*waving from the shallow end of the pool*
I thought the fight was sexy.   http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/love.png

Well, I'm not averse to seeing two goodlooking guys having a bit of a tussle .  I just liked the way it became funny at the end - I was laughing out loud at the attack by jacuzzi and whatever that other water feature was! 

I did feel there were James Bond allusions, but didn't mind them.   I was pretty sure this was going to be an episode with Bond-style elements.  I wondered if Mary might actually be the Bond character, which she kind of was for a while. 
 

 

January 4, 2017 9:19 pm  #30


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Oddly fitting:

JOHN: Give the people what they want.
SHERLOCK: No, never do that. People are stupid.
MARY: Uh, some people.
(Sherlock leans over to look into the camera.)
SHERLOCK: All people are stupid. ... Most people.

(http://arianedevere.livejournal.com/86813.html)
 

Last edited by ewige (January 4, 2017 9:20 pm)


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"The posh boy loves the dominatrix." http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/love.gif Context matters.
 

January 4, 2017 9:21 pm  #31


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Yes.


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January 4, 2017 9:47 pm  #32


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Ehm....

http://media.tumblr.com/36ae6dc6e8daa2c3b202e0277d82424d/tumblr_inline_n261z3sUpk1srzzws.png


http://www2.pictures.zimbio.com/fp/James+Bond+Skyfall+Lodge+Explosion+CqaJZqA0I_Ql.jpg

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/564x/76/b1/ea/76b1ea5c319a07810e14bffd0583b9d4.jpg

https://pbs.twimg.com/media/CzV_KCRWIAAU7jO.jpg


Sorry, but Bond is the most famous fictional spy not just in Britain, but all around the world - when MG introduced the plot centered around espionage into Sherlock story, how come he was not aware of a risk that this story will be likened to Bond by critics... the comparison just offers itself to them on its own?

Also, casual audience is still an audience. If both them and dedicated fans were confused by an episode - and yet the author of the story did not intend to cause this effect - would it be better to reflect how to engage the audience better next time rather than to write poems to the newspapers?

That aside, Mark´s response was witty. But two can play that game - and the journalists won´t be affected by the poem anyway, just the opposite:

https://www.theguardian.com/culture/2017/jan/04/is-sherlock-worse-for-too-much-action-mark-gatiss-sends-his-verse-reaction#comments


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I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

http://49.media.tumblr.com/eb0e156f55878fcd6f89dcf91ae89811/tumblr_o0eyyzrphE1spvwrzo2_1280.gif
 

January 4, 2017 9:50 pm  #33


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

What is it about comments sections?
How are these people in their real lives?!


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January 4, 2017 9:57 pm  #34


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Nakahara: The Skyfall parallels are interesting and I noticed when I watched the film at the cinema. As far as I know, however, TRF aired before Skyfall. And Bond faked his death and fell from a great height.
I know that the pic is from TEH but we first got Sherlock on the roof in TRF. There are also parallels between Sherlock and Spectre. I think there has been some counter-inspiration going on. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

January 4, 2017 10:02 pm  #35


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

nakahara wrote:

Also, casual audience is still an audience. If both them and dedicated fans were confused by an episode - and yet the author of the story did not intend to cause this effect - would it be better to reflect how to engage the audience better next time rather than to write poems to the newspapers?

Yeah, that...

On the other hand, Mark, Steven, AA and I think even Benedict commented to the effect that they were not sure they could pull "it" off. Maybe this is the reason why. The idea is too grand and difficult to present in three 90 minutes chunks.


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"The posh boy loves the dominatrix." http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/love.gif Context matters.
 

January 4, 2017 10:03 pm  #36


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

SusiGo wrote:

Nakahara: The Skyfall parallels are interesting and I noticed when I watched the film at the cinema. As far as I know, however, TRF aired before Skyfall. And Bond faked his death and fell from a great height.
I know that the pic is from TEH but we first got Sherlock on the roof in TRF. There are also parallels between Sherlock and Spectre. I think there has been some counter-inspiration going on. 

I would not be surprised if this was a case of counter-inspiration indeed.
But then why deny that certain Bond influence is here?


-----------------------------------

I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

http://49.media.tumblr.com/eb0e156f55878fcd6f89dcf91ae89811/tumblr_o0eyyzrphE1spvwrzo2_1280.gif
 

January 4, 2017 10:05 pm  #37


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

ewige wrote:

nakahara wrote:

Also, casual audience is still an audience. If both them and dedicated fans were confused by an episode - and yet the author of the story did not intend to cause this effect - would it be better to reflect how to engage the audience better next time rather than to write poems to the newspapers?

Yeah, that...

On the other hand, Mark, Steven, AA and I think even Benedict commented to the effect that they were not sure they could pull "it" off. Maybe this is the reason why. The idea is too grand and difficult to present in three 90 minutes chunks.

Yes, the episode had a lot of content - it would suffice to fill an entire season, in fact.....


-----------------------------------

I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

http://49.media.tumblr.com/eb0e156f55878fcd6f89dcf91ae89811/tumblr_o0eyyzrphE1spvwrzo2_1280.gif
 

January 4, 2017 10:07 pm  #38


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

nakahara wrote:

Yes, the episode had a lot of content - it would suffice to fill an entire season, in fact.....

...And then people would moan in comments that the show became too slowly-paced! http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png


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"The posh boy loves the dominatrix." http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/love.gif Context matters.
 

January 4, 2017 10:13 pm  #39


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

Of course. http://cdn.boardhost.com/emoticons/grin.png


-----------------------------------

I cannot live without brainwork. What else is there to live for? Stand at the window there. Was there ever such a dreary, dismal, unprofitable world? See how the yellow fog swirls down the street and drifts across the dun-coloured houses. What could be more hopelessly prosaic and material? What is the use of having powers, Doctor, when one has no field upon which to exert them?

http://49.media.tumblr.com/eb0e156f55878fcd6f89dcf91ae89811/tumblr_o0eyyzrphE1spvwrzo2_1280.gif
 

January 4, 2017 10:23 pm  #40


Re: Mark Gatiss' answer to an undiscerning critic | The Guardian

nakahara wrote:

SusiGo wrote:

Nakahara: The Skyfall parallels are interesting and I noticed when I watched the film at the cinema. As far as I know, however, TRF aired before Skyfall. And Bond faked his death and fell from a great height.
I know that the pic is from TEH but we first got Sherlock on the roof in TRF. There are also parallels between Sherlock and Spectre. I think there has been some counter-inspiration going on. 

I would not be surprised if this was a case of counter-inspiration indeed.
But then why deny that certain Bond influence is here?

I think Mark did not want to deny so much that there is Bond influence but that SH is not a man of action. That it would be against Canon to have him fight baddies and become very physical. 


------------------------------
"To fake the death of one sibling may be regarded as a misfortune; to fake the death of both looks like carelessness." Oscar Wilde about Mycroft Holmes

"It is what it is says love." (Erich Fried)

“Enjoy the journey of life and not just the endgame. I’m also a great believer in treating others as you would like to be treated.” (Benedict Cumberbatch)

http://up.picr.de/28609194so.png

 
 

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