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January 4, 2017 6:46 pm  #41


Re: Mycroft

I have always liked the idea that Mycroft sent Mary after CAM. It sort of fits in with him trying to warn Sherlock to stay away from him.


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January 4, 2017 10:46 pm  #42


Re: Mycroft

Liberty wrote:

I think Mycroft possibly does know who shot Sherlock, but as you say, Lola, he must have come to the same conclusion that Sherlock does.  I still like my little pet theory that Mycroft sent Mary after Magnussen (and so might feel a little responsible for Sherlock getting in the way, even though he warned him), but I don't think there's anything really to back that up in TST.    I do think Mycroft probably knew who Mary was from the beginning.   And that may be why he's warning Sherlock at the wedding in TSOT - he knows Mary won't live long, and Sherlock will be hurt (as he was over Redbeard).

That is brilliant! I have not yet made the connection between Mycroft's comment at the wedding and him knowing about Mary.Makes so much sense now you say it.

I do share your theory about CAM and Mycroft, for the reasons bb just mentioned, also CAM says something about Mycroft having been after him for a while  (plus, I still think that at Christmas Mycroft knew very well what Sherlock is up to, hence CAM's comment that Mycroft would be a "very proud" big brother). 


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January 5, 2017 6:41 am  #43


Re: Mycroft

But Mycroft wouldn't have let Sherlock go after CAM, if he knew Mary was going in...unless that was to give Sherlock the dramatic reveal about Mary!


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January 5, 2017 7:58 am  #44


Re: Mycroft

besleybean wrote:

But Mycroft wouldn't have let Sherlock go after CAM, if he knew Mary was going in...unless that was to give Sherlock the dramatic reveal about Mary!

Didn't Mycroft warn Sherlock not to go after Magnussen?

Last edited by Schmiezi (January 5, 2017 7:58 am)


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January 5, 2017 8:14 am  #45


Re: Mycroft

I would guess their plans just overlapped, with dramatic consequences.  


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January 5, 2017 9:41 am  #46


Re: Mycroft

Mycroft did warn Sherlock off, very insistently, on the day that Mary was going in to assassinate Magnussen.   Mycroft was also very concerned about Anderson and the other person hearing that Sherlock was targeting Mycroft and threatened to ruin them if they told anyone - which could be because he knew that Magnussen would be found dead later that day (after Sherlock setting himself up as a suspect!).

However, later, at Christmas, I feel he's not quite so insistent and almost encourages Sherlock ... my pet theory there, is that he's actually setting up John - he knows John will take his gun and will probably kill Magnussen because of Mary.   Sherlock pre-empts that by grabbing the gun and getting in there first, to Mycroft's dismay.
 

 

January 5, 2017 5:00 pm  #47


Re: Mycroft

I'm trying to remember the timings...did John know CAM was a threat to Mary at that point?


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January 5, 2017 5:08 pm  #48


Re: Mycroft

I presume he already had an idea, but CAM makes it explicit - he says he can alert people who would kill her. 

(I don't think John went along to murder CAM, but to retrieve the documents.   However, when he realised that the only way to keep Mary safe was to kill him - something that no doubt Mycroft would know he would find out, because he guessed how CAM was using that chain of pressure points - there was a chance that he'd go ahead and do it.  I think that's why Sherlock gets in there first and makes it clear it's he who is doing it not John).

Last edited by Liberty (January 5, 2017 5:10 pm)

 

January 5, 2017 5:35 pm  #49


Re: Mycroft

Sherlock's whole focus was to protect John, as we know.


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January 5, 2017 5:54 pm  #50


Re: Mycroft

besleybean wrote:

I'm trying to remember the timings...did John know CAM was a threat to Mary at that point?

Which point do you mean? John knew Mary was in danger of being exposed by CAM since the confrontation in 221B, but I do not know if he knew about the greater scheme of things until CAM explained the pressure point scene.

Sherlock apparently told John to bring his gun. I agree that Mycroft seems to almost encourage Sherlock to go and slay this dragon for him, but I do not know if he expected CAM to be killed or if he also thought that there would be physical documents at Appledore.


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January 5, 2017 6:04 pm  #51


Re: Mycroft

But for me Mycroft is genuinely shocked and traumatised by Sherlock murdering CAM....
Plus it was very awkward to get him off the charge!


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January 5, 2017 6:30 pm  #52


Re: Mycroft

I agree that he probably never intended for Sherlock to kill CAM. Not quite so sure if he  would have cared too much about the future fate of Dr. Watson... 


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January 5, 2017 6:41 pm  #53


Re: Mycroft

Except if anything happened to John, Mycroft knows that would badly affect Sherlock.


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January 5, 2017 7:43 pm  #54


Re: Mycroft

yes, but that is sentiment, something that Mycroft is not encouraging

edit: also, most likely nothing would have happened to John in the sense that he would have gotten physically hurt. He would have been send to prison for murder, that is, if he would have chosen to shoot CAM

Last edited by Lola Red (January 5, 2017 7:47 pm)


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January 5, 2017 7:45 pm  #55


Re: Mycroft

I think Mycroft just feels he'll have to deal with a broken Sherlock.


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January 6, 2017 1:39 pm  #56


Re: Mycroft

I'm just pondering the fact that it's Mycroft who convinces Sherlock that Moriarty is involved in the Thatcher busts, by mentioning the Borgia Pearl case in connection with him.   He could just be giving information, but ... he's also there when Sherlock says that he's waiting for Moriarty to make his move, and talks about the long game and that he'll know ... I'm just thinking about how Mycroft seems to be involved at every step, and always seems to be holding information back.    What are you up to, Mycroft?

 

January 6, 2017 1:43 pm  #57


Re: Mycroft

Liberty wrote:

I'm just pondering the fact that it's Mycroft who convinces Sherlock that Moriarty is involved in the Thatcher busts, by mentioning the Borgia Pearl case in connection with him.   He could just be giving information, but ... he's also there when Sherlock says that he's waiting for Moriarty to make his move, and talks about the long game and that he'll know ... I'm just thinking about how Mycroft seems to be involved at every step, and always seems to be holding information back.    What are you up to, Mycroft?

I think he always seems to know a lot more than he lets on. I am interested to see what information Mycroft has, or information about Mycroft, gets revealed.
 


                                                                                                                      

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January 6, 2017 1:46 pm  #58


Re: Mycroft

I think it was in the general Mycroft thread that I wrote that Mycroft seems to be involved in a surprising number of Sherlock's cases, especially the ones who are linked to Moriarty. He is definitely up to something, but what?


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January 6, 2017 5:29 pm  #59


Re: Mycroft

So I talked to my 17-year-old son about S4. He watched TST once, knows all other episodes but is not an avid fan. I mentioned people saying there were (too many) Bond moments in TST and this is what he said: 

He thinks that there has been a villain in the background all the time, someone close to Sherlock who controlled all other baddies. He thinks it is Mycroft. Maybe Sherlock was adopted and Mycroft got jealous of him. He compared this to the last two Bond films which explore Bond's family history and reveal that there was indeed a villain, Oberhauser/Blofeld, who controlled all other villains and who acted out of jealousy. He was jealous of Bond because his father had cared for Bond after Bond's parents died and loved his foster-son very much. 

My son came up with this theory without knowing any speculations or the "orphans" tweet or anything else that might point to such a solution. 


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January 6, 2017 5:31 pm  #60


Re: Mycroft

No offence, but I kind of hope he isn't right!


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